Planning a multi-week trip canoe trip and need to find a source for bear resistant food containers (BRFD) that are significantly larger than the ones readily available for backpacking but still lightweight and portageable. Be great if they were also approved by the Interagency Grizzly Bear Committee (IGBC) for use in the US. Thanks for the help.
http://igbconline.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/161216_Certified_Products_List.pdf
the list is long… Start calling… Some no doubt call for packframes… Most canoeists use a multiple of smaller containers and put them in a portage pack.
I have a couple of Counter Assaults. But frankly my go to is the 60 liter blue barrel… Not bear proof but odor resistant and better its water proof… I know some people put Ursacks in them
I was going to suggest small coolers. Many of them are certified. The down side is that they are heavier and you’d be wasting the weight of the insulation when you really aren’t using them as a cooler. Some of the nicer ones are pretty pricey. The Ursak inside a stout container idea that kayamedic suggested sounds like the most practical idea as long as it passes muster where you’re going. They have two sizes.
http://www.ursack.com/the-shop/
did you check on the IGBC site? at least in the past, they had a complete list of approved containers.
I have never heard of a large capacity bear-proof container. most people use the blue barrels; some people get some kind of olive barrels, but they are smaller than the blue barrels if bigger than bear-proof canisters. Some people use 5 gallon buckets with waterproof sealable lids ( Gama Lids I think they are called). smell proofing is much more important to not attract bears, rather than to have something they may not get into. On two trips in the Yukon, I just used regular dry bags, with multiple layers of trash bags to smell proof my food - no place to hang it, and I don’t have blue barrels, so just leave it a 100 yards away from tent if possible, and maybe tie to trees - doing that along with a counter assault bear canister so that I’d have at least 6 days food in bear proof can. Otherwise, I just use regular pack lined with layers of trash bags that I hang using a “Z pulley” set up, for food for up to 4 people for 14 days. I have never had anything get into my food. Once in Boundary Waters, had a bear walk on top of the gear loaded in one canoe- that included a food bag that it ignored, it just picked up a day pack and dropped it the edge of the lake. Heard us coming back with a second boat I think, and left. IT obviously did not smell any food in the food bag or it would have ripped that open. Most people who don’t hang their food will “hide” the blue barrel away from camp in some unobvious place. Some bears attuned to robbing camps will rip anything they see open, whether they smell food or not, just in case there is something they can eat in there. Have seen where one ripped open a plastic container of spare parts (nuts, bolts, nail, wire, but no food at all in there) just to see what was in there.
Matt, Kayamedic, Raftergirl,
Thanks for responding. Appreciate your insights. Matt, I share your experience with bears; during a past four month Alaska trip we used only duffels and stuff sacks and never had a problem. Unfortunately now IGBC approved container’s are required in many areas. The 30 L drum would be perfect but I was unable to find an approved unit in that size or larger. I have gone through the entire IGBC list but hoped I had missed something. I prefer the Cascade Pro Pack. Seems the suggestion of using several Ursacks might be the best option. Plus side: lightweight and they get smaller as emptied. Minus: not odor proof without liner, not weather proof, multiple Ursacks get expensive, easy for a bear to crush contents or walk away with. Could still use the blue barrel in combination with the Ursack but would rather not; that just adds weight and bulk with a limited benefit. Thoughts?
Google “bear proof garbage cans.” Your friends will be impressed when you show up with one of these big boys strapped in your canoe. They’ll hold plenty of food for a long trip, and are set up with wheels for portaging. Furthermore, if you figure out how to open it from the inside and you drill a couple of air holes, you could use it as a bear refuge. If you are attacked by a bear, just climb inside and pull the lid closed!
You could go with the Bear Vault BV500 and have each person on the trip have their own, plus 1-2 extras for group items. They would be lightweight, portable, and usable for other shorter trips in the future. That would be a pricey option, unless each person bought their own???
The ones on the list from World Safety look interesting. The smallest one holds 25 pounds and costs $40. I can’t tell from the website exactly how they work.
Would the Ursak inside a blue barrel or bucket with a gamma lid block odors? We use the bucket & gamma lid system as our river toilet on rafting trips and the gamma lids seal in human waste odors quite well. The bucket might not stand up to a full sized bear pouncing on it though.
@Art said:
Matt, Kayamedic, Raftergirl,
Thanks for responding. Appreciate your insights. Matt, I share your experience with bears; during a past four month Alaska trip we used only duffels and stuff sacks and never had a problem. Unfortunately now IGBC approved container’s are required in many areas. The 30 L drum would be perfect but I was unable to find an approved unit in that size or larger. I have gone through the entire IGBC list but hoped I had missed something. I prefer the Cascade Pro Pack. Seems the suggestion of using several Ursacks might be the best option. Plus side: lightweight and they get smaller as emptied. Minus: not odor proof without liner, not weather proof, multiple Ursacks get expensive, easy for a bear to crush contents or walk away with. Could still use the blue barrel in combination with the Ursack but would rather not; that just adds weight and bulk with a limited benefit. Thoughts?
Ursacks are not waterproof… Ursacks in a blue barrel are waterproof. The barrels are kind of heavy but if you have a good harness are actually a pleasure to portage… ( not carry by the handles… there are harness systems available)
Gamma lids sometimes fail the waterproofness test.
I have used a variety of containers from dry bag only to barrels, to Counter Assault Canisters ( not wateproof) but not the Bear Vaults as we have a lineage of bears in the Adirondacks who know how to defeat those.
I have a friend who locks Ursacks to a tree with a cable lock… Not a problem being a bear toy. Now you may not have trees as I often dont have trees( we are going back to the Yukon) but deadheading the barrel to the canoe alerts us to any tomfoolery… Our food must be boring. We havent had a problem.
You can add the aluminum liner to the Ursak to make it more sturdy without a lot of extra weight. That doesn’t make it waterproof, but at least adds a layer of protection.
Would be interested in how your local bears are getting into the Bear Vaults; breaking the container or the lid, unscrewing the lid?
The container from World Safety does look interesting. They have a variety it looks like, some quite heavy. Don’t seem to be approved by the IGBC as best as I can tell so perhaps no real advantage over a blue barrel?
Based on what you all have shared I am inclined to do something like one huge garbage can you can also sleep in or a combination of two Bear Vaults and two White Ursacks. Adds up to something over $300 but not all that many pounds if carries are short. It is a workable but not a particularly elagant solution. Looks to me like there might be room on the market for a new product.
That is one smart bear. I have found the Bear Vault difficult to open myself. A friend of mine brought a Bear Vault on a trip last summer and couldn’t get it open. She was getting pretty freaked out after multiple attempts to open is failed. I grabbed my small screwdriver & between the two of us, we got it open. I guess we needed Yellow-Yellow to show us how to do it. 
To comment on something Matt mentioned in his post above about bears getting into things even though they can’t smell the food. Last summer we had a ranger in Grand Teton tell us not to keep water bottles near our tents. He told us that as long as they contained only water and were out of sight inside the tent we were ok, but to be safe we should put them in the bear box. When we asked why he explained that it’s not the smell that’s the problem. Over time, the bears have come across water bottles that have drink mix in them. They break/open them and get a sweet reward. Now they associate the water bottles with a reward based on appearance and not smell.
My bear canister of choice is the Bare Boxer. I have two of them. It was the only one I found that was small enough to fit through the hatch on my Necky Vector SOT kayak.
http://www.bareboxer.com/products.htm
I like Bear Vaults because they’re clear, which makes it a lot easier to find whatever food you are looking for. Black vaults are very dark inside. it’s easier to see things inside a yellow vault, but not as easy as it is to see things inside a Bear Vault.
I can’t open some Bear Vaults with my fingers, but they are easy to open with any hard object like a small stick. Just push down on the black tab with the object and turn the lid.
If you’re a kayaker and want to buy a bear-proof container, you should bring your kayak to a store which sells bear containers to be sure that you can fit the containers into the kayak’s hatches. I can fit three large and one small Bear Vault into the rear cargo area of my Prijon Yukon Expedition.
I can’t fit any bear canisters into my whitewater kayaks, so on trips where I can’t hang food, I bring an Ursack. An advantage of Ursacks is that they get smaller as you eat your food. But I figure that if a bear gets hold of an Ursack, it’s going to smash the crap out of the food inside.
Bear canisters will protect your food against critters other than bears. There is nothing quite as irritating as discovering that a mouse has burrowed into your food supply, made confetti out of plastic bags and other food packages, eaten a little of this and a little of that, and then left some turds. Ugh. Shown below is a picture of a spotted skunk checking out some dry bags on the Grand Canyon. On another Grand Canyon trip, I woke up on the morning of the launch to discover that a rodent had chewed its way into one of my big dry bags.
Thanks everyone. Just ordered a second Bear Vault. Plan on adding a Ursack to the arsenal next.
@pmmpete said:
If you’re a kayaker and want to buy a bear-proof container, you should bring your kayak to a store which sells bear containers to be sure that you can fit the containers into the kayak’s hatches.Bear canisters will protect your food against critters other than bears. There is nothing quite as irritating as discovering that a mouse has burrowed into your food supply,
Conversely, if you are shopping for a kayak, you might want to take your bear vault to the shop to check the fit before you buy. I got a new kayak last summer and was disappointed the BV450 would not fit into the hatches. I guess I need to gravitate towards the ursack or the Bare Boxer.
On my camping trips, the main food thievery threats have come from racoon, chipmunk, mouse, and squirel. Some of the more bold ones will steal your food if you so much as turn your back or step away. The Bear Vault was very effective at stopping those annoying thefts
~~Chip
I bought the smaller Bear Vault at REI and was bummed when I got home and found that it wouldn’t fit through the hatch. Now that I’ve seen one in action and how difficult they are for a human to open, I’m glad it wouldn’t work for me. I like the Bare Boxer a lot. i will hold 3-4 days of food if packed conservatively. I have two of them now for longer trips.
I haven’t had a problem with the Bear Vault, other than it’s round - makes them hard to pack, carry. We pack most meals in sealed mylar bags stuffed into the Bear Vaults. A square vault would also be less likely to roll down into the water if a bear starts playing with it. I’ve had that concern in several camps with limited flat areas.
I’ve never kayaked in Bear Country so never needed a bear-can. But raccoons and mice and skunks are a problem where I paddle.
I mostly double-bag my foods, then put them into a really good dry-bag and hang them from a tree. Since I like to vac-seal my meals whenever possible, between that and a zip-lock baggie and my dry-bag, even my Min-Pin would ignore them… (My test is to toss them on the floor for a bit and see if my dog ignores them.)
Though one day after washing my plates and hanging them in a net to dry, I found a mouse had climbed down the hang-cord, chewed through the net and ruined my X-pot and my dog’s folding food bowl.
Another night I remained up most of the night throwing rocks at a raccoon that had climbed the tree holding our food bags. Another raccoon unzipped a tent and dragged out a dry-bag containing maria’s ‘feminine’ products, chewed through the bag and ate whatever he smelled.
I was given a bunch of ammo cans, the large ones, by the widow of a survivalist friend. I found no use for them so gave them to a rafter friend along with a bunch of used pickle barrels. I am assuming that he managed to make use but then, he is a rafter.
BTW, my Min-Pin has learned that food comes in zip-lock baggies so when I quit teaching, I put all my Tarot Cards in zip-lock baggies so I could sell them on Cl or e-bay. Came home and my dog had opened a dozen of them looking for food!
BTW, my system is to dedicate bags ONLY to food! I got a bunch of purple 8l drybags and marked “dinner”, “lunch”, etc on each. ONLY double-bagged food goes into these. NEVER clothes or such.
Then these dry-bags go into a large really good drybag which is dedicated to food only. NEVER anything else. I put the double-bagged foods into the purple drybag, then into the Food Drybag and hang that which I hang from a rope&pully system I devised.
You do NOT want your sleeping bag to smell like your dinner, thus the permanent marking on the dedicated bags. You also do NOT want to throw a rock at a curious skunk! Hence my doggie-First-Aid kit now contains doggie shampoo and skunk shampoo in Go-Tubes (https://www.amazon.com/humangear-Hg0181-Humangear-Gotoob-Travel/dp/B00CDA8XTU/ref=sr_1_4_a_it?ie=UTF8&qid=1483985594&sr=8-4&keywords=go+tube) which is the best made.
Paranoid? perhaps. But I’ve had an animal chew through my PFD looking for the granola bar in the pocket that is ‘supposed’ to be sealed and smell-proof.
And I have not yet found a bear-box that will fit through the 9" hatch of my kayak.
@RikJohnson said:
And I have not yet found a bear-box that will fit through the 9" hatch of my kayak.
If you ever need a bear canister, the Bare Boxer will work for you. 7.4 inches wide X 8 inches long. My hatch on my Necky Vector is 7.5 X 11 and the Bare Boxer just fits. Only one I could find that would fit. They have a 275 cu inch capacity, which for me will hold 3-4 days worth of food.
So far, I haven’t had issues with food in a dry sack on desert paddles, but I’m sure I’m pushing my luck there. I might invest in an Ursak to put inside a dry bag. Otherwise, I’m paddling in potential bear areas, so food goes in my Bare Boxers.