Do you wear your PFD (open water)

No Cigar
Some responses to my posts I can easily dismiss, not as replies, but rather as involuntary spasms. Others, though, become so tortured as to cause actual pain, probably both to their authors and to the readers. Guideboatguy, I suggest that you carefully re-read your post–talk about crippling decision/indecision syndrome! Why not just buckle your seatbelt or put on your PFD and cut the Gordian Knot. Break Free! But it may be that “What we’ve got here is failure to communicate. Some men you just can’t reach.”

well when you’re ready then lead the way

– Last Updated: Jan-31-14 2:36 PM EST –

...because most of your posts have obsessed over people who make different decisions than you do, and ridiculed and misrepresented simple decision-making on the part of those who decide not to wear a PFD. Even after they tell you it's a simple decision.

I'd cite more needless mudslinging but despite your feigned indignation, I trust you can probably find it for yourself.

Disappointment!
Slushpaddler, I’m disappointed by the thinness of your skin when it comes to discussing this PFD issue, one you wholly agree with me on. You and several of my other critics flail away at me with ad hominem nonsense, rather than robustly defending your various points of view. I’ve actually been called an “academic”, an “engineer”, somebody with close ties to the PFD industry–Oooo, the pain! Of COURSE I have opinions about PFD wearing that are at variance with some of your friends (not you, as you well know), but I thought, obviously wrongly, that you were up for vigorous discussion. I was wrong.

I carry an inflatable as a spare NM

I always wear
my PFD. Despite being a good swimmer and having never capsized in a multitude of years of shoreline paddling, I always wear it to avoid the most certain overzealous torrent of wrath and judgement to ensue.

Very much my thought…

– Last Updated: Jan-31-14 10:39 PM EST –

the rescue part - where flexibility is often the key. I just failed to say it earlier.

I always wear a PFD
Everybody I paddle with always wears a PFD, and there is never any discussion about it - everyone just puts it on. Fortunately for me its not an issue.

I sincerely hope
the Groundhog does not see his shadow tomorrow.

This pack can’t stand another 6 weeks of winter.



In answer to the OP question, yes, always. Sometimes just an inflatable, but always.

When I first started paddling, I never did. Now I always do.

Ya think? :slight_smile:

“PFD industry” does not equal "industry
If you’re going to argue, at least get your quotes correct.



Judging by your failure to pay attention someone actually says, it is no wonder that you have adopted the solution that requires no thought.



No point in any further debate with someone like you…

No one posting here has drowned
So, whatever the current posters here are doing with PFD’s, it must be working so far.














It is probably because…
those of us in the north have had limited chance to actually get on the water outside of a pool since the launches froze over. Though people have drowned in a bathtub, so maybe it is just luck. :slight_smile:


The ones who drowned
would be posting: Wear your frackin’ PFD!

Most of the time
The only exception is if it is really hot and humid and I start sweating underneath it and it gets miserable I will take it off and put it under the deck bungees.


We Both Failed…

– Last Updated: Feb-02-14 7:40 PM EST –

Pikabike, we've both failed miserably to address the really important part of this whole thread, don't you think?: Whether I misquoted when I used the term "PFD Industry" (I did), and then whether your own posting of "Industry" was a misquote (it was). We both know, or should know, or should have remembered, that your original accusation was that my posts "reek of an agenda tied to business interests." Yes, you actually posted that--go check. You are so cruel, so mean! And it hurts so much!!

It isn’t entirely clear


whether the lack of a PFD is truly causal to their demise or whether is more indicative of a greater problem, namely inexperience.

As consequential with regard to inexperience are insufficient skills and lack of knowledge. Furthermore, those deficiencies would lead to poor decision making and a lack of situational awareness that substantially increases risk.

The paddler that ventures into the sea without sufficient understanding of the weather, tides, cold, and “sea states” probably both lacks the skills to deal with the situation and lacks a PFD (as well as other requisite gear).





A quick google…



There’s a few that were wearing…

http://blogs.twincities.com/outdoors/2011/10/11/detailed-account-of-kayakers-death-on-mille-lacs/

http://bangordailynews.com/2011/06/20/news/hancock/massachusetts-kayaker-who-drowned-was-honeymooning-at-hancock-point/?ref=inline

http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/Crews-Search-for-Missing-Kayaker-Close-to-Great-Falls-215138461.html







But most did not.



(It is arguable this could have been much more gory if the paddler was still floating after the swans continued to maul the lifeless body.)

http://www.oldsaltblog.com/2012/04/did-the-swan-kill-the-kayaker-or-was-it-the-lack-of-a-life-jacket/

http://www.oregonlive.com/clark-county/index.ssf/2013/09/police_presume_missing_kelso_k.html

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11186741

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2337617/Father-drowns-kayaking-tragedy-just-yards-wife-daughters.html

http://www.record-eagle.com/local/x1912997194/Kayaker-drowns-in-Lake-Michigan

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11165382

http://www.ksl.com/?sid=26005091

http://www.recordonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20130814/NEWS/308140317





It’s hard to say where the statistics come from, but it is pretty clear.



http://www.usps.org/education/files/other_20_handout.pdf

http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/04/s/excerpts/uscg/15/index.cfm







So what to do? Perhaps more education would be beneficial. None of my boats came with links to “getting started” videos.



Although most new paddlers buying rec boats to paddle around the bay aren’t likely to sit through “Sea Kayak with Gordon Brown” or read Franco Ferrero, a basic instructional on currents, wind, consequences of capsize, cold, basic gear, etc… could go a long way toward prevention.

Speak for yourself (nm)

how long does your VHF last?
how long does your VHF last like that on the shoulder of the PFD?

I mean, before salt corrosion kills it?

I see people having theirs inside a see-through clear bag, despite the VHF being labelled “waterproof”.

The other 20% - good article

– Last Updated: Feb-03-14 6:19 AM EST –

I have no data to support it, but it makes sense to me that entrapment, unconsciousness, mouth immersions would be the critical risks once you get beyond not having a life jacket.

Based on my limited experience (fortunately), entrapment is probably the critical hazard. There have been a couple of entrapment fatalities in my area since I started paddling. While everyone I paddle with does wear a PFD, I do know a few people who don't wear a helmet, so they could easily be knocked unconscious. I've also been stuck in a hole, and have bobbed down some long rapids, so I can also see mouth immersions being an issue.

Unless an inexperienced paddler does something really stupid, though, these are risks that effect a limited number of paddlers (whitewater and advance sea kayakers). I would also add hypothermia to the list since there have been a number of cold water paddling deaths in my area recently.

With so many other things to worry about, putting on a PFD seems like a no brainer.

Always.

– Last Updated: Feb-03-14 8:12 AM EST –

I always wear mine. Be it a creek, river, pond, lake or ocean. Shallow or deep, calm or rough.

We had a gentleman drown here locally while kayaking on the Kentucky river. This is a very calm river, series of damns creates slow moving pools of water for this river. He apparently had heart trouble, fell out and went under. That was all it took.