How much money did the owner of North Face have? Millions but bad choices killed him.
Just heard about his after getting home on my bike:
Stuff happens.
sing
Stay safe, sing.
This link may help answer your questions. http://www.coldwatersafety.org/Rule5.html#rule5Case1
Paddler was wearing a 3mm neoprene wetsuit.
Don’t do it! I haven’t read through all the posts so, my apology if this has been stated. My point is that wet suits are not designed to be used in air. Under water, there is no evaporative cooling, therefore you stay warm. In air, you are always cooling down (assuming the suit is wet). I find a wet suit good on a super hot summer day because of this. My opinion would be to go with a windbreaker if you can’t afford a dry suit. Of course, when it comes to clothing and staying warm, time is always an issue. An hour in a wet suit may not kill you but, a full day on the water in windy conditions may give you hypothermia. I went the wetsuit route early in my kayaking life. I soon ditched it for the above reasons.
Windbreaker is a bad idea for cold water paddling. I suggest reading through the entire thread and others related.
So Sparky, are you a clothing retailer. I’m just trying to prevent an inexperienced user from making a big mistake. Even after the initial poster stated he’d be out in 50 degree air, people are still suggesting a wetsuit. And as to your post about sweating in a dry suit, I wear a Kokatat dry bib and anorak and, I stay dry as a powdered babies bottom. You get what you pay for. And, the web is the land of misinformation.
Yes I believe you need a windbreaker with a wetsuit in 50° air. Don’t really bother with my wetsuit much anyway. Water below 60° definitely a drysuit for me. I am usually alone paddling and feel better in it. Even 65° water I’ll use drysuit some times.
" I haven’t read through all the posts …but " … “you need a windbreaker with a wetsuit in 50% air”
This site has become hopeless with misinformation.
The O’Neill chart is fairly close to what works for me, until the blue zones. In those, the upper end matches my “comfortable” zone but the lower end would be Get Out Quickly territory. And in the purple zone, it is strictly drysuit time for me.
The chart, and others like it, is only a starting point to determine what YOU need.
Fit matters, too. A lot. Make sure the wetsuit is snug enough to minimize flush-through of water.
@SeaDart said:
" I haven’t read through all the posts …but " … “you need a windbreaker with a wetsuit in 50% air”This site has become hopeless with misinformation.
Just have to shrug and move on. This “debate” plays out over and over on this site. People know what they know but also think they know what they don’t know.
sing
@sing said:
Ok. I hear you. But, even with the “best” gear, nothing is 100%.I don’t know the statics of it, but I think I am actually more likely to die pedaling to work than going out paddling.
50% of the people in the US die from heart disease, cancer, or lung disease. For people over 40, accidents come in 4th. So eat right, exercise, don’t smoke, and pray for good genes.
https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/282929.php
In 2017, the Coast Guard reported 138 deaths involving canoes and kayaks.
http://www.uscgboating.org/library/accident-statistics/Recreational-Boating-Statistics-2017.pdf
In 2016, there were 204 cycling deaths - I would have thought that number would be higher. So Sing, you are not more likely to die in a bike accident, but you are more likely to get in an accident involving a serious injury.
By comparison, 33K people died in car crashes and 14K people died from opioid overdoses.
https://www.cdc.gov/injury/wisqars/overview/key_data.html
So the most dangerous thing we do every day is get in the car and drive.
@eckilson said:
@sing said:
http://www.uscgboating.org/library/accident-statistics/Recreational-Boating-Statistics-2017.pdf
In 2016, there were 204 cycling deaths - I would have thought that number would be higher. So Sing, you are not more likely to die in a bike accident, but you are more likely to get in an accident involving a serious injury.
By comparison, 33K people died in car crashes and 14K people died from opioid overdoses.
https://www.cdc.gov/injury/wisqars/overview/key_data.html
So the most dangerous thing we do every day is get in the car and drive.
Thanks for the numbers. Mark another one in there.
Godspeed, James.
sing
Car stats to me are skewed because so many people drive like complete idiots. They take innocent people with them but I’d say A-holes die more frequently.
@MCImes said:
Here’s a guide from O’neill wetsuits.
Personally, I think its recommendations are generally ok for the warmer end of each range specified, but near the colder end, IMO, their recommendation would leave you cold and I personally would go with the next thicker suit for warmth.
the pacific around me is ~65° and I am comfortable in a 4/3 full wetsuit. I figure it could get a few degrees colder before I switch over to my drysuit.
I think all the blue columns are off. For me anyway, I’d be cold if I swam dressed like that. Pretty questionable that they recommend it this way. Purple column is quite ridiculous as far as I am concerned.
But the best way is to test for yourself in a controlled environment such as a bathtub (add ice if your tap water is not cold enough). I wouldn’t just trust the manufacturer, especially in colder water.
YMMV. Wearing a hooded 5/4 for three hours of winter paddle surfing with air temps in the upper teens and water temp around 40. Never felt cold until it was time to change out. That is another story… (Hint - have the car warmed up and blasting the heat, use a changing pancho, stand on a 2x2’ piece of carpet square. Also, keep hot water in 2 gallon bottles stored in a flexible insulated cooler, covered with your towels while you surf.)
Season’s first winter-like surf session comes tomorrow and Friday. 
PS. Use silicone grease on all exposed skin areas to prevent frostbite!
sing
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At my barnicle covered rocky and boulder strewn homebreak, a drysuit can be a hazard. On bigger days, a good breaking wave can drive you under and tumble you along the bottom. A ripped drysuit would be extremely dangerous, if one paddle surfs alone or with a few, like I often do in the winter.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=plhRFfZ4xwc
sing
The statistic quoted for bicycling deaths seems low. I know several locations within 10 miles of me where people have been killed in bicycling accidents. I know of only a handful of fatal kayaking accidents in California in recent history.
@sing
“Hmmm… Maybe going of business. The female model grabbed a left over drysuit for a guy…? .
…It says “uni-sex” but the design clearly favors the male function. Just saying…”
FUD.
Except for my most recent Idol suit design I have always gotten a Kokatat Unisex with a dropped pzip. More recently gravity started winning the argument here and there. But the curves in the women’s suits have tended to be more so than my own, and the leg and arm length in the unisex small is spot on.