that’s not really so
Going out ill-prepared, significantly inexperienced or above your skill level isn’t smart. Legions of kayakers ply rough waters to enjoy paddling in it and increase their abilities. See the distinction?
Rough water…
To address the issue above about not paddling in rough water I disagree…I look for the days with small craft advisories. To me that is the first indicator that it may be a good day to go out on the water. Some people actually seek out storms and rough water, but are still safe about it.
But to address the question the poster asked…I would say we can make some inferences about his skill level and experience level. I think his question has enough information for us to make some recommendations.
This guy probably can’t go wrong with an Explorer, an Aquanaut or a Romany. Those are probably perfect for him…outstandingly seaworth boats that are easy to paddle for all skill levels. I might add the Chatham to the list but not too many others based upon my assumption that the paddler is probably not very experienced and wants something seaworthy and confidence inspring.
Matt
Matt
Rough water boats
I think there are a few boats that excel in rough water in the right hands but are kind of tender for many paddlers. But there are plenty of kayaks designed for rough conditions that are very well behaved, relatively efficient, and fun to paddle in mild conditions. For example I know people who use Tempests for beginner teaching boats.
So I think the original question is a reasonable one, since you can’t really assess a boat in rough conditions until you learn to paddle rough conditions. A little more info would be nice, to be sure. My recommendation for someone starting into rougher paddling would be to find a boat that knowledgeable people you trust consider to be good in rough conditions, that feels comfortable edging and turning on the flat and in whatever conditions you can test in, and that brings a smile to your face. There should be any number of them out there.
Good hunting.
nope …
what I’ve seen in my life are risk takers taking needless risks … sortof like practicing having a head on collision at 25 mph to better prepare yourself for the real thing at 60 mph.
Manitou & Recluse
– Last Updated: Aug-08-07 9:56 AM EST –
I've paddled with paddlers in those boats in some pretty rough conditions and like someone else said, they handled it fine in the hands of good paddlers.
What makes some paddlers feel more comfortable in rough conditions are rocker and shorter length as wilso-2 said.
Here's why: Picture a 20 ft kayak in an area where there's 3 ft peaks spaced 10 feet apart. The long boat gets bridged or held up on ends and can feel a lack of stability. A 14 ft boat with a flat bottom, shaped like a banana, sits on it's belly in the trough of the wave and you can eat your lunch there. That's the basic reason why highly rockered, flat bottom boats make their paddlers feel more comfortable.
The trade is speed (hull efficiency) and directional stability. It's not as black and white as my example and good paddlers paddle all types of boats in any conditions.
Product endorsement and advertising also is a big player in people's perception of what is supposed to be good.
ok
– Last Updated: Aug-08-07 9:04 AM EST –
The distinction is needless vs. calculated risk.
I was out this spring in the a.m. on a calm Lake MI. While I had a drysuit, pfd, vhf, etc., I was paddling solo and for my first time of the season. The water was below 40 degrees. Winds picked up and waves built to a sloppy 4' with dumping surf on shore. I decided to stay near the launch since I was alone, and when conditions worsened I got off the lake, before I reached a point where landing in dumping surf would be necessary.
Last week I went out with a friend and our trip ended up with 3'-4' following seas with a quartering chop. Actually similar to the first instance above, but I was familiar with the conditions, the water was very warm, and I had a competent partner versed in rescues.
Let's use your car premise. It would be dangerous to push your limits on public roads to get used to driving in snow and learning corrective measures (some of which can be fun). But it's a lesser risk to do the same thing on a closed course or large parking lot.
If you view risk on a sliding scale instead of an either/or option you can assess your appropriate level of risk. Get out in conditions using good judgement and increase your comfort by practicing and you reduce your risk.
Don’t forget
to look for a used plastic Skerray or Avocet.
nope
Once one begins grading risk (i.e. needless vs. calculated) you’ve crossed a line in order to rationalize risky behavior.
Quick question: does the Coast Guard practice and drill in bad weather?
Quick answer: not on purpose.
Really?
"To support those missions, training is a big part of the job as well, said Coast Guard Senior Chief Petty Officer Gordon Muse, who is the base’s top enlisted man. “If we are not doing missions, then training is very big,” he explains. “If there’s nothing else to do, then we do training.”
It’s especially important to train in bad weather, Muse said, particularly with the 47-foot heavy-weather boat that’s seen in the commercial. The boat is nearly indestructible, and designed to handle 30-foot seas and a 20-foot breaking surf.
“You want to train in the environment you’re going to be in,” he said. “In other words, you don’t want to wait until it’s 2 o’clock in the morning in a storm to be out in 6- to 8-foot Seas. So when you get the opportunity you try to go out in it.”
However, around the Chesapeake Bay, the weather is fairly good and the seas relatively calm most days. And, Harper said, the opportunities to train in rough seas are few. Even in bad conditions, the waves reach only about 8 to 10 feet, he said.
“That’s not bad,” Harper said, sounding disappointed. “You go to the West Coast and you’ve got 20- to 30-foot seas. Cape Hatteras in North Carolina has got big seas, too.”
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/newsarticle.aspx?id=25243
Artic Tern on Lake Erie
On the flip side to Ness’s boat, the tern (and Ness will attest to this) simply rides way too high in the water. The high volumn on this hard chine design is a bear to deal with in sine and swells. Go with a lower volumn (maby multichine?) if you can get away with it.
nice try
The son of a good friend is a BM1 and is the skipper of a 47-foot MLB on the Oregon Coast.
He says they only train on milder days and have strict orders not to do any rollovers when training because too much stuff gets broken (antennas, etc.).
Sure they train in weather that is not optimal for boating, but their “rough” weather training is in conditions that are well below what their vessel is rated to withstand, so it’s not really rough weather training from that perspective.
And by that standard of "mild"
none of us are out on rough days, either.
you’re wrong
– Last Updated: Aug-09-07 2:12 PM EST –
"Not optimal for boating"? That statement presumes some level of risk. You're breaking your own rule.
You have to assess risk in order to determine that it is risk. You're talking in circles to validate your argument.
That is not true…
I have a friend who is a Coastie who practices in life boats at the mouth of the Columbia river in Hellacious wind/ swell events. The waves there are enormous.
too much fun
You guys are having way too much fun with this and I can well understand how important it is to you all to continue living in your alternative reality.
I would imagine if we went to a sex club in the nearest big city and admonished those in attendance for not practicing safe sex we’d get a similar response to what I’m getting here.
For the record, I have no objection if paddlers like yourselves enjoy taking risks. That’s why my (and your) tax dollars support the Coast Guard and your local search and rescue.
Those that work for these agencies also get off on adrenaline rushes and without you folks challenging the elements their jobs would be quite boring; sortof like the Maytag repairman.
you replied to your own post
Why not others?
Definitely the Chatham’s, but also Impex models, Foster models, Kajak Sport, Valley’s, Tempests other models, etc.
I gave up my NDK for a non-Brit boat that “for me” outperforms it. Bowler, don’t get too star struck OK. There is a planet full of superb water craft, and I’ll add that there are some other “waterpeople” of astonishing capability around the globe other than Brits.
You’re just infatuated and that’s understandable. I think you’ll grow out of that.
You’ll retain the well deserved respect, but your world will expand…I hope for you.
SALTY!!!
a lot of people on this forum demonstrate a great deal of respect for your understanding and advice regarding boats and paddling in general.
but for crissakes, read your last post. leave out the condescension- it’s bloody rude you go too far!
How???
Look, I have huge respect for Dennis!! The man has done a lot for the sport and he’s the real deal. I believe he would agree fully with me here that his boats, though excellent examples, are NOT the only options for rough water kayaks!!
All I am saying is there are many choices, many of which i dont even know about, that would be excellent. Bowler is a BCU follower and gave predictable advice. I say it’s a very small portion of the market, and very narrow minded, and biased. That’s all.
There Is "Predictability…"
to certain answers to certain questions by certain people. But, in fairness, it ain’t just the “star strucked” crowd though. I think if one has a different opinion, or info of additional value, then just post it up.
I think we all have a “koolaid” flavor that we favor. I’ve come to the conclusion that actively trying to convince someone that his/her koolaid isn’t the only flavor is a waste of time. Besides… Do I really want a lot of folks “lining up” aat my favorite store and drinking my brand of kool aid…? 
sing
Pink koolaid is the bestest flavor. 