Have you tried a Impex Outer Island?
Nate…
You aren’t that big! Jay Babina, the designer of the OI is about our size. Check out an Outer Island, a beautifully designed boat. It is fast, tracks beautifully (has a skeg but doesn’t need one), and will take you as far as you want to go if interested in rolling techniques. The only downside is that it is not a highly manueverable boat…a better fast Pt. A to Pt. B boat.
I found that the Currituck, the Outer Island, the Tempest 170 (you may fit into the 165) and Caribou fit similarly. Have you considered an Aquanaut, one of my favorite commerical boats. I am a tad too large for the OI and Caribou…love the Aquanaut.
Sounds like you guys are doing a great job at demoing. This is a good time of the year to demo and get some good deals. Try to be patient and demo…demo…demo…your boat will find you!
Cannot help but ask if you are at all interested in building kayaks for both of you? It is a blast ( www.kayakforum.com ).
Let us know what happens…
Enjoy…
Bob
paddling straight
Paddling straight is a skill that improves with time and technique. Boats that manuever well tend to expose problems. I help teach a beginning whitewater class, and at the first session we see a lot of "experienced" paddlers who can't go 30 feet in a straight line.
Common problems are using a paddle that's too long, not keeping the blade close to the boat, not reaching forward at the catch, pulling back too far past the hip, and waiting too long to make corrections.
My Avocet is generally considered to be towards the maneuverable end of the sea kayak spectrum, but every whitewater paddler who's borrowed it said that it felt like it was on rails. So your perceptions of the differences between the boats are probably correct, but I suspect that your sense of what's "normal" will change over time.
I would argue for a more maneuverable boat for skills development, and to wait on the horizon-chaser until you know that's what you want to do.
Slight diversion
Well, I found a dealer in NY that has the Currituck and the Legend, so I’m going to try to see about heading up there in the next couple weeks. I think my decision will end up being between these boats and the Gulfstream.
At the risk of derailing my own thread, my fiancee really loved the CD Rumour, but she’s concerned that it might be too “advanced” a boat for her. She’s at the same skill level I am. She also liked the Montauk, but preferred the Rumour. She’s 5’2" I honestly can’t remember her weight, but she’s in good shape. Anyone have any thoughts?
attitude
The line between a rewarding challenge and frustrating difficulty is different for everyone. If she capsizes, is she likely to come up laughing at herself, or cussing at you?
If she's reasonably coordinated and willing to get wet in the learning process, the Rumor should be fine. The fact that she "fell in love" instead of being terrified by how tippy it was sounds promising. If she gets comfortable with braces and rolls she'll be able to make it dance.
Laughing…I hope!
Actually I’m pretty sure that she’d be fine with getting wet. She enjoys a challenge and does well dealing with adversity.
My concern is that she (and this applies to me as well) not be in a boat that has a “learning curve” that’s so steep that it’s almost guaranteed to be downright frustrating to anyone but a complete masochist as we go through the process of gaining our initial skill sets.
But I agree, one person’s frustration is another person’s motivation. She’s leaning heavily towards the Rumour, so that’s probably what she’ll end up with, barring some great revelation.
Impex Force
you would be remiss if you did not try out these new boats from Impex. Fantastic. And the Cat 3 will fit your GF. The Cat 4 will be perfect for you size-wise. I love mine, live in Maine and paddle ocean and bays in pretty much anything in up to 20 knots of wind. Fast, fun, and very capable. Plus they are great looking and beautifully built.
she sounds cute!
ok, calm down, just adding some levity to the geek love in...
often women will either be terrified of tippy boats- or love them. don't know why this dichotomy exits, but i've seen it many times. if she likes them, good for her, and you- good times ahead.
Gulf is great boat, many people seem to be finding lots of similarities with the Currituck in terms of handling and feel, go with cockpit comfort as the final determinant it will pay off in the end. having said that, those Valley oval hatches are a godsend when tripping... the Legend doesn't compare well with the others, it is much stiffer tracking and faster and rewards the paddler who is much more comfortable with it's stability profile and aggressive edging, where the Gulf and Curr is more user friendly and easy to turn. why does turniness matter? it doesn't! unless you want that, which most of us here (sea kayak geeks) love because it's so fun! one thing about Legends is that they are generally more expensive, heavier and more heavy duty made (cause that's how Nigel and Seaward want it) than the others. new Gulfs are only 50lbs std layup, Legends, 10+ more. good luck, it sounds like you will end up with a nice boat either way.
Learning curve
Well, you rarely hear athletic female paddlers complain about boats that are too narrow or too responsive. The opposite is far more common.
As for you, if it helps any, my first kayak was a VCP Avocet, bought after a year of classes, demos, and rentals. I’ve never regreted going straight to a sea kayak instead of a “beginner” boat.
If you approach padling with a sense of humor and adventure instead of grim determination, you’ll be fine.
The scores are in…
Had a chance to demo a Currituck and a Force 4 yesterday, and I really liked both boats. The Force 4 wins by a nose, though. So I think I’m going to go for it!
Thanks again to everyone for all of your advice. Now I just need to figure out exactly how I’m going to store it…
For your wife…
I’m glad you got into Force 4 this last weekend, and really liked it. I was going to get back onto this thread and suggest it. Heads and tails over many of their older designs.
As to your wife, the Rumour is a bold choice and one that’ll make her a solid paddler pretty quick. Just needs some padding to create thigh braces - I’m two inches taller than she is and I’d have to add them.
However, I had a chance to mess around a bit with an Impex Force 3 this last weekend, and I’d really strongly suggest that she try that. The thigh braces have been moved back properly for our size, it handles and rolls like a dream, and if she wants to do things like lose the footpegs and put in foam blocks against the bulkhead for your feet you won’t wish that you had bought an upgrade on that part.
Honestly (and I hope Danny M doesn’t mind my saying this) - outside of the OI which is a Jay Babina design, the Force boats are the first Impex boats to which my husband and I have had such an affirmative response. Our boats are NDK, VCP and P&H, and most of the older Impex boats have never felt like they had that kind of handle. The Force 3 and 4 are different critters, and darned nice ones.
Don’t forget the P&H Quests
My guy moved me up into one from the Swift Labrador Sea and I loved it, then I made the mistake of letting the wife take a turn. We ended up buying TWO. I think you would end up loving this boat. The Quest cuts the water like a knife, edges like a dream and although you might feel a little tippy at first, if you spend some time in the boat you will realize that this is a pretty stable boat.
The boat is about 18 feet long and weighs in at around 50 pounds in glass. Email me and I can send you pics of our pair!
Jim
For your significant other…
I second Ceila’s comment. One small thing to remember most women tend to be more conservative in their head. It’s more of a problem for women to under-evaluate their ability than being a machaoist.
So, if she “fell in love” with the Rumor, she’s ready for it. Or something even more challenging!
I haven’t try the Rumeur yet. At 5’4 and 110 lb, I found ALL boat very stable. It’s actually hard for me to make even my Avocet flip using my weight alone. I had to use my knee to drive the boat over when I was learning to roll (had to roll down first, right?). At 5’2, your fiance will most likely found all boats perfectly stable.
It’s hard to learn to edge and brace when the boat is too large. That goes for both you and her.
Finally…
After some soul (and wallet) searching, I’ve decided to purchase the Force 4. I’ll be picking it up on Friday. I can’t wait!
Thanks again to the wonderful community here for all of the helpful suggestions and advice.