Oooh good to know. We live in NH (cold winters) and while storing out of the sun is doable, indoors is not. Our kayaks get cockpit covers and stay outside year round. How do fiberglass and Kevlar compare to Royalex in terms of durability and maintenance? I really just want a boat we don’t have to baby. Lighter weight and durable while being reasonably affordable is the goal.
Thank you for the great info on seats. I found the Old Town and Spring Creek ones and figured they would work providing whatever boat we end up with is the appropriate width. When we paddled our friends Penobscot 17 this weekend our 3yo kept trying to sit on the yoke (which probably wasn’t a huge deal as our kid is under 40 lbs and you can carry the whole weight of the canoe with the yoke, but still not ideal).
I’m considering a 16’ Mad River Explorer too, good to know the seat works with it. We are in New Hampshire, so Mad Rivers and Old Towns seem to be the most popular boats on Marketplace.
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Maybe pay attention to rocker as you consider models. I don’t know how much rocker the Penobscot 17 has in inches, but it is rumored to be mild to moderate, and it can turn easily enough for river use. In Wenonah’s lineup, the 17 foot Spirit II is probably closest to the Penobscot 17. The Spirit II has 1.5" rocker, which is mild, and the hull is wide on the waterline at the center of the boat. Wenonah’s performance/distance touring models, like the 17 foot Escape, have zero rocker and a sharp entry. They are meant for going straight across lakes efficiently, but they don’t have the versatility of the Spirit II.
I believe the Mad River Explorer and OT Disco have moderate rocker too.
First, don’t over think it. If that Exporer that you are thinking about is in even fair shape bring it home. If it doesn’t work out you can likely sell it for what you paid for it.
Key things to look at are 1) wear, especially and the stern. Wear through the vinyl is ok but you don’t want any wear into the ABS. and 2) cold cracks especially with wood gunwales. They are preventable and fixable but those should reduce the price.
Durability of composites depends on the layup. Go for light like a race boat and they can be fragile. Go for expedition quality like a Kruger Seawind and they will survive nigh onto anything.
Finally, don’t be concerned abut where your 3 yr old want to sit. If she is along and mostly happy then it’s all good. Just like having a dog along it’s up to the adults to be happy & keep things in balance. If you are really lucky s/he will be paddling the bow in a couple of years.
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Thanks! I’d care less about him sitting on the yoke of a boat we owned (or a rental beater) vs our friends nice Royalex Penobscot. He was happy and having a great time, although he dropped his paddle, which we retrieved, and now that’s all he talks about. Three year olds, lol.
We are going to look at a 1989 16’ Mad River Explorer this weekend. Royalex with wood gunwhales, caned seats, and a center thwart as opposed to a yoke. There are only a few photos posted in the listing but it looks to be in good shape, and the owners have been very responsive to all my questions. I like your advice about trying it out - the price is in a range where I feel like we could resell it without losing out if we don’t like it. The boat has been kept outside and stored under a deck when not in use for the five years these people have had it so I know its endured New England winter temperatures. I will look carefully for cold cracks, although I’m not sure if I’ll be able to see damage hidden under the gunwhales. Any tips or tricks for inspecting that (and what else I might look for on a boat this age) would be appreciated!
Thank you! I’ve read the Penobscot has a mild rocker. Our inability to turn it quickly would suggest that is definitely a possibility (but we could also chalk that up to inexperience with hubby in the back, so hard to say for sure). In reading comparisons, it seems like the 16’ Mad River Explorer might be good for us - quite stable, maybe a bit easier to manuever, able to hauls lots of gear, can go solo decently - so we are checking one out this weekend. Fingers crossed!
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That 186 is cool!
Yes, the MR Explorer is manueverable but still tracks pretty well. It’s good up to Calss III+ Whitewater (by 1990s classifications). Here’s a picture from …long… ago:
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nah, the Penobscot is hard to turn 
I felt like a container boat skipper from the stern of ours, so much boat ahead of me, turning so slowly…
The MRE will turn easier but will be slower than a Penobscot 17, not that speed matters much in a family boat…
Ended up buying a Royalex 16’ Mad River Explorer today and took it out for a spin in the same pond we tried our friend’s Penobscot 17 last weekend. It was a lot easier to turn but didn’t track as straight, as expected, but felt stable (hubby thinks moreso than the Penobscot) and will likely serve us well. We are looking forward to enjoying it once we get some decent paddles.
One thing I’m a little apprehensive about is the design/materials of the gunwales - they appear to be part wood and part plastic. I posted a new topic with photos here: Royalex 16' Mad River Explorer with Hybrid Gunwales?.
I’m hoping they are fine, and maybe mean we don’t have to worry about cold cracks and winter storage so much, but I’m so unfamiliar with that design that it worries me a bit. Last night a killer deal on a Penobscot 17 with a set of Bending Branches paddles popped up about the same distance away from us. I contacted that seller immediately and was probably first in line but there was no way we could see it before this afternoon unless we backed out of going to see the MRE. Unfortunately buying two boats in one day was out of the question as 5 hours of round trip driving is just too much for our 3yo, but I was ready to buy it tomorrow if it was still available. It sold less than 12h after being posted. So I’m just hoping I didn’t pass up an insanely good deal on a low maintenance boat that would have ticked all of our boxes for a pretty good deal on a boat that needs more work and care.
Anyway, if anyone has advice about those gunwales please feel free to post in the other thread!