Canoe camping vs Backpacking

Advice
#41

I had an IceMule Pro which is convenient because it rolls up for storage, but I wasn’t confident of getting more than 2 days from it. It’s great for a day at the beach, but I was looking for something that could go longer.

I read a bunch of reviews and don’t remember everything on my short list, but it did include the Yeti Hopper M20 (and M30), the 30 can backpack cooler from RTIC, the IceMule Boss, and the Engel BP25. Yeti’s coolers got pulled off the market because of difficulties using their extremely strong magnetic closure. Reviews of the RTIC indicated it didn’t hold ice as long as the IceMule Pro, while the IceMule Boss held ice considerably longer. So I went to REI to look at/buy the IceMule Boss, but it was too big & bulky and I had no use for the pockets and doo-dads. If I had bought it, I would have cut the pockets off straight away to reduce some of the bulk.

That brings me to the Engel, which I bought but don’t necessarily recommend. It was relatively new on the market and I wasn’t able to find any ice retention tests that compared the Engel with others, but Engel’s other soft coolers have a reputation for excellent performance, especially the HD30. So I took a gamble. When I received it, I realized the top was totally uninsulated! It’s basically an insulated box with no lid, with a single layer of uninsulated PVC on top when closed up. In contrast, the roll-top closure combined with supplemental air inflation on the IceMule coolers provides insulation right up to where the material folds over on itself. Fearing the worst, I threw two 5 lb. ice bags in the Engel and closed it up. I went to check it 30 min later and the top was cold and covered in drops of condensation. Uh oh. So I made a lid for it out of R-5 foam insulation board, with Gorilla tape to help it seal:

Top of lid, installed

Bottom of lid

Side view, two layers

The bottom layer of the lid fits snugly into the foam box, occupying 1 inch of interior height, so there is a small loss of capacity. The top layer of the lid, despite being 1 inch thick and sitting on top of the foam box, does not interfere with the roll-top closure, which makes it curious why Engel didn’t provide a lid. With my lid in place, the top is now better insulated than the sides.

I like that it’s very light and doesn’t have excess bulk. The backpack harness is pretty minimal, which is good for saving space but will be less comfortable after an hour or two. And it’s a small fit for big guys. It did keep our food for 5 days, with one frozen water bottle swap mid-way. So I guess it’s a success, but I wouldn’t recommend it without modification.

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#42

I have an Icemule but I don’t use it for anything other that bringing groceries home on my bike because the ice retention is that poor. I’ve had good luck with my Igloo 30 qt and 70 qt neither have insulation but are rated to 5 days but. My RTIC 30 can soft cooler is usually good for 4+ days. All of these coolers have come home with ice after 5 days but I don’t use cubes. Cubes melt over everything and they melt the fastest. I freeze my own blocks in plastic milk jugs or in frozen water bottles. I fill the small spaces with gel packs. My coolers are generally 25-30% food and the rest is ice. The coolers get opened only at meal time and they sit in the shade. That said I’m always looking for portable coolers that can get past 5 days.

#43

Just back from a week in Georgian Bay. Mosquitoes love me but lots of wind meant i only had to use deet once the whole trip, instead of twice a day like in June.
One difference with backpacking is footwear - you want something dry that you can change into at camp. Bring more socks than you usually would.
When I paddled on 50 degree mornings a windbreaker over my pfd kept me plenty warm while paddling. Bundled up a lot more at night than during the day.

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#44

I bought a thermos-type bottle for use as a cooler on my trip but it didn’t arrive in time.

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https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BB5W6QKP
it is big enough to reach my hand into and will hold 4 cans of beer plus a lot of ice. If that last beer is still cold on day 4 I will be a very happy camper.

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#45

HEY! I just bought that!

I ordered silver but they sent me green :disappointed:

Actually yours is a better deal mine was 49

I could put a little bottle of Sekt in there :+1:t3:

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#46

You know if you wrap towels or sleeping bags around them they stay cold even longer.

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#47

OP- I could be reading your original post wrong, but it sounds to me like you are relying on a pack liner and a garbage bag for waterproofness. On any water-based trip, I would put your sleeping bag at a minimum in an actual dry bag. No, you don’t plan on dumping- but rain and paddle splashes can easily make your gear wet and you miserable at night. My partner and I are also seasoned backpackers who have recently shifted to paddling, and the biggest difference to me is in the gear. We just went on our first overnight kayak trip and ended up investing in these lightweight mesh bags with backpack straps to carry our menagerie of dry bags and such on portages. Since you already plan on bringing your backpack, probably not worth a pivot but I share it just as an FYI to others planning similar trips in future. What was really nice about it was that the mesh bag weighed next to nothing and crumpled down really small so we were able to fit it in hatches. For a canoe, your backpack is a good option but really consider putting crucial items in a bonafide dry bag inside of that pack for insurance.

The BWCA in fall is nearly bug-free, but be ready for wind, cold, and rain as possibilities. I have a pair of lightweight neoprene gloves I brought on our Lake Superior kayak trip earlier this summer, and my hands were cold in them on a rainy morning that was about 55 degrees. Something a bit more insulated, like a pogie, is going to keep your hands a lot warmer. Being up north in the chilly fall on the water, especially if you have wind, can be frigid.

Have a great trip!

#48

My wife and I have scuba mesh bags. I never even thought to use them as carriers for multiple smaller dry bags. I’ll bet it makes it a lot easier to find stuff than the one big big of my 80L portage pack.

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#49

We didn’t carry much ice in the cooler, but I did bring extra ice in a Polar Tech styrofoam shipping cooler. It has 2" wall thickness and I knew it could go days if I kept it sealed up. I was going to use it to carry frozen food for later in the trip, but at the last minute I changed my mind and decided to keep all the food in one cooler in case plans change. So I used it to carry frozen water bottles and blocks of ice instead.

Since the Engel cooler is tall but narrow, the method that worked for us was to vertically organize our food, starting with the frozen items on the bottom: smoked picnic shoulder, boneless lamb leg, marinated chicken thighs for spiedies, and marinated sliced pork collar for moo ping. I “capped off” the frozen items with a 1.5" thick block of ice roughly sized to fit and placed in a ziplock bag, then placed a folded hand towel over that. Next went some unfrozen meats that could tolerate a bit of freezing: minced chicken for larb gai, burgers, bacon, cold cuts and cheese. And then the veggies, the fresh herbs, and salad on top.

It was extremely full with food at the start, we only had room for a few small gel packs around the produce and the aforementioned ice block. As we consumed food, I took frozen water bottles from the styrofoam cooler and placed them in the Engel. After two days, I pulled out a fresh ice block to replace the half-melted one in the Engel. It worked, even the salad made it to day 5. But we kept it in the deep shade and only opened it twice per day. We also lived without cold drinks.

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#50

I use these Ikea Fracta bags. Strong, light, and quick dry.

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#51

I did not see whether you are doing a base camp with day trips from a lake or are doing a “traveling trip” and moving every day.
If it is the base camp route, you can easily camp in luxury with heavy items like cast iron skillets, reflector ovens and dutch ovens. Truly wonderful meals can be prepared with those! Spacious and heavier tents and tarps also make life easier in camp.
If you are making a different camp each night you may wish to go with lighter and less gear to ease the portages.
I would also recommend a visit to the BWCA.com website. The folks there tend to have a lot of good info and experience in that particular area.

#52

Bow-saw over a hatchet. Eggs are a pain. Spam is good. Indian peace pipe for after dinner.

#53

Most, if not all back country canoe routes in Ontario are not cartable. The terrain is just too rugged for a cart to work. It would be a waste of time bringing one to try.

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#54

That’s true of every BWCA portage I’ve done too. I was just pointing out the rule in the BWCA prohibiting use of carts.

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#55

We used to get frozen sushi grade tuna from a company in San Diego and the foam coolers would work great! Small and thick

#56

Yah - the cart reference was me. I hadn’t made the connection that the OP was referring specifically to the BWCA, or that carts were prohibited there.

Around here there are trips where carts are definitely an option. A few years ago we did Long Lake to Saranac Village in the Adirondacks. There were three portages - Raquette Falls - 1 mile, mostly uncartable, Indian Carry - 1 miles, cartable, Bartlett Carry - .5 miles, cartable. Lugging the cart on the Raquette Falls portage was a pain, but it was nice to be able to do one load with the cart on the other two - I think this is the Indian Carry.

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Sites like the NFCT or the CT River Paddlers Trail will often tell you how long the portage is and the % cartable. The NFCT site says the Raquette Falls Carry is 85% cartable. I don’t remember that. I remember carrying all of it except a short section at the end (nasty portage up a steep hill with lots of rocks and roots). It says that the Indian Carry is 50% cartable . I don’t remember that either. Other than a couple of narrow bridges, I remember carting the whole thing.

Anyway, around here a cart is definitely one of the things to consider when planning a trip.

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#57

Dutch ovens are great. I splurged on an anodized aluminum dutch oven. It cooks just like the cast iron ones but hardly weighs anything. Even if weight is not a priority, it’s great to not have to lug the major extra pounds from the house to the car and the car to the campsite.

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#58

I did too, and I don’t take it camping … just from the pantry to the oven. :laughing:

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#59

Post mortem report -
A truly wonderful trip.
5 days, 4 nights on the Baker Lakes loop, EP39. About 30 miles total with ~3mi of portaging
Lows were 29, 42, 57, 48. Highs were 60’s. 2 days of clouds, 2 days of partly sunny.

It only rained one night - a token amount of rain which was great.

We only had 1 afternoon of wind which was ideal. We had relatively low volume boats and could have easily been wind-bound for a day

The first night was a chilly 29* but this also made it so i saw exactly 2 mosquitoes the whole trip! No bugs at all! Amazing.

I saw a wolf on the road on the way in! Amazing! also saw my token bald eagles and turtles, but no moose unfortunately.

We camped on 2 islands. Island camping is awesome.

Mice are everywhere, aggressive, and not scared of you. Hang anything you dont want chewed into. Chipmunks were also not shy.

I used a 60L backpack which worked pretty well, but the food bags and other dry bags carried like junk. All the straps on them are worthless. I will never buy a drybag with backpack straps unless it has a chest strap. I dont do this enough to care about a Granite pack, but those look clutch and I wish I had them instead of borrowed drybags with backpack straps.

Portages suck. Mostly long portages I guess (over .25 mile or so). I will choose a route with shorter portages near the beginning or be more judicious about keeping the weight low.

Winners
*Hard-soled water shoes. My friend with the soft soled shoes had to be very careful on portages. Wet foot landings are mandatory. Prepare for it. Muk boots looked clutch for colder waters.
*Butane stove. about 4lb total + 1lb pan was great for real food all week
*a huge 1.5 gal thin walled pot for group meals
*Hammocking. Many campsites were rocky and uneven. Hammock for the win.
*55 gal contractor bag - I put my backpack in the bag to keep the initial layer of water off my bag and they worked great for this. No water even penetrated the plastic bag, leaving 2 layers additional of dry bag redundancy.
*Carbon paddles with a woody backup. Carbon paddles are just soooooo much nicer to use on the water. But a wood bent shaft was also clutch for the narrow streams (pushing off banks) and launch/land due to the rock field at each landing. Both are needed IMO.

Cooler - my 1/8" foam pad cooler kept steak and chicken fully frozen through day 2, and was still nice and cold on night 3. We also had a soft sided cooler that was convenient for storing more delicate food like eggs, apples, and tortillas. Big/real coolers are way overkill people. I cant imagine portaging a Yeti or something. that sounds like masochism.

The Bad -
I was highly surprised and somewhat disappointed at the rugged nature (i.e. bad condition) of the portage trails. Even the front country trails were nothing more than the forest service cutting down trees to make a path. No work at all on the tread (path). Large rocks meet you at each landing. Few beaches or landings with moderate sized rocks removed/cleared. The USFS in CA does a great job of improving and maintaining the popular trails in the area. I hear they want to maintain the ‘rugged nature’ of the BWCA but that argument falls flat on me. A token effort to remove rocks from the trail is not altering the landscape in a negative way. It would be nice if they organized volunteer groups to do trail improvements and improve the quality of portage trails or made some effort to improve the tread quality. The trails are extremely rugged considering their short distance and high traffic. In CA, these would have much better tread quality (surprisingly).

Same with camp sites. I was hammocking so the rocky, uneven ground was no problem, but 2 of the 4 sites we stayed at seemed quite rocky and uneven. No effort was made to make a somewhat nice tent pad. Again, in CA, the forest service makes a token effort to make somewhat flat tent pads.

I love rugged nature, but when Im carrying a 50lb 18’ boat with a 30lb pack on my back, Id rather not navigate a mine field of slippery rocks. This really did surprise me. (and I consider my past life as an Ibex. I have no problems on rocks and such, but the condition of the trails did not seem to compliment the unique challenges of portaging). If you are unstable, stay TF out of the BWCA is apparently their thought…

The lake water was generally very nice and clean, but Burnt lake was green and mucky. Gross. It was as green as a farm-country lake. I was very surprised to see how bad the front country water quality was considering there are few properties on the actual lake or watershed.

Overall -
I cant wait to go back! Next time I would like to go somewhere with more vertical rock cliffs or hills I often see in pictures. Can anyone recommend routes that have the stunning granite faces? Or a trip that has more portaging towards the end vs the beginning?

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#60

We all have our preferences, but for me this is a “good” about BWCA. I love the effort required and how it seems to act as filter ensuring that users really want and appreciate being there.

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