I know
the three categories do not at all include everyone, I just wanted to generalize. I should have made a group four for “other.”
I guess the point of the thread was to point out that most begginner kayakers can look at Dick’s, while other, more advanced paddlers that are giving the advice would never consider doing so. I just think that Dick’s deserves some consideration from the people the it is geared towards.
Good News
If you’re happy with a store by all means shop there. It makes no matter what anyone on this site tells you. You are allowed to decide for yourself.
There are no decent kayak shops near me and the price of most new boats is out of my limited range. As a result I buy everything I can second hand and have been very pleased with the results. I once listened to reviews of others and bought a high end carbon paddle that has been a complete disappointment to me.
Don’t hesitate to try many different boats and gear to find the best for you. That’s the only one you need to please.
I think the categories are wrong
Based on paddlers I see all three of those levels are pretty much beginners.
I guess it is kind of like having a black belt in a martial art; having a roll is at the beginning of level three or three star depending on the country. The levels go up to five, and then beyond that there are the folks who teach level five, and folks that teach the level five instructors.
Still I think a level 5 paddler might find a boat to use at Dick’s many folks I know have boats in all ranges and most still have occasion to use a rec boat.
but how do you know your store is good?
What do you have to compare it with? The staff may sound knowledgeable, but be completely wrong headed.
I question your categories too. I think your category 1 is really people who don’t want to spend much money, and don’t know any better. As Don Rumsfeld famously said, there are the unknown unknowns – you don’t know what you don’t know.
Dick’s is worthless
The only high end items they carry is workout clothes and sunglasses. I’ve heard the sales staff in paddling give pure out wrong info. Shame is they bought out Galyan’s, which at least carried some high end Bell canoes and generally better gear. Not top notch across the board, but way better than what Dick’s stocks.
Big box stores around here
The ones within reach of where we live are no place for anyone to go who wants a salesperson who knows about getting someone fitted into a kayak, even to the kind of exchange you had. There are things they do pretty well, like baseball gear. For choosing a kayak if it isn’t an independent operator, the biggest store to try is Bean’s or EMS. I don’t think this is unusual.
The problem with big box stores is that there is no assurance that they will care about having knowledgeable staff in the paddling area. Since they do everything their stronger interest will be in the higher volume areas (kids’ team sports etc) and if they can sell a bunch of kayaks for a few months of the year that’s a good thing. It isn’t like a chain like even Bean’s, which stores offer basic paddling trips and offer some instruction. They have to know what they are doing, at least a bit, because they have a full program there.
Also - guys tend to forget that it is quite possible to put a woman into even a rec boat that is an unpleasant paddling experience due to its having knuckle-busting width. I and my sister are about average height for our generation, or at least I was half an inch ago at 5’4". She is paddling the same rec boat as her much larger husband, and until she made some changes to her seat and I got them both lighter weight paddles she was coming in with whacked up fingers from every paddle. The boat is still big enough on her that a lot of distance could be a problem, but then it’s a rec boat and that is not how they use them.
Most new paddlers don’t know how to sort out the good from the bad about a kayak. Assuming that the big box stores around here aren’t unusual for inland areas, they would not be anyone’s first choice. Plus, they tend not to offer the tryout opportunities of more paddling-focused places.
dicks
I thought this thread was about my in-laws.
True,
I don’t have anything to compare it to, but I have read posts on here that are obviously not true to my Dick’s. As I was researching both kayaks, I learned very, very much, and all 4 different slespeople that I talked to at Dick’s knew about chines, rocker, paddle fitting, correct paddling technique (torso rotation, etc.) and proper carrying technique.
terminology
A caveat 1st; I know that I may choke on my foot here.
Speaking as someone who has to endure that training (lately delivering it rather than receiving it and whose been involved with training Dick’s personnel this year) almost everyone who sells kayaks, from the expensive Valleys and to the lowly Pungo, is taught about those terms. While I certainly can’t speak to their ability to retain those terms, they all learn about them. Not a good measuring stick, generally.
not at all
Fair question. For me we really don’t have one nearby so it’s not convenient.
I agree with willih2o about the sales effort. All things being equal, I’d prefer to give my money to a locally owned store (or at least within the state) and ideally an independent. But all things aren’t equal so the people I describe have to earn it the sales and service. I don’t find the national chains around here to be very well staffed when it comes to kayaking but that may be a regional thing. And if the intent is to stay within 1 and 2 as described by the OP then often Dick’s and other nationals are the only choice. The brands mentioned are decent manufacturers.
The other option, though, is to shop used. Depending on where you live and if you don’t mind a few scratches, you can find some great buys.
REI
The problem isn’t just relegated to Dicks. REI used to hire certified instructor trainers like Roger Schumann of the ACA to train its employees. Then at some point they dropped that. Maybe they figured they could save money, who knows. All I can say is that now their paddling offerings are noticeably sub-par.
For example, they have a beginner’s class called “Open Coastal Kayaking”. Now, I don’t know about you, but I wouldn’t venture out onto the open coast until I had amassed quite a bit of knowledge and skills. It’s an unforgiving environment, no place for a beginner. And yet this is one of their beginner’s courses.
Another example (my favorite): I was paddling in Elkhorn Slough one day when I saw instruction going on, an REI class, I later found out. The instructor said, “Now I am going to demonstrate a roll.” Well, who can resist that. I had to stop and watch. Well, over he goes, he thrashes once, he thrashes twice, the hull rocks back and forth from side to side, and then out he comes, out of his boat, a wet exit, and pronounces, “I am now going to demonstrate a paddle float rescue.” Priceless. He didn’t miss a beat!
Best Post Nominations
- Poleplant
- TheBob
Dicks
So now we know. Thebob doesen’t like dicks.
This thread could go real bad…
real quick when associating those usernames with “dicks”.
!!!
Good thing there is no Neil involved!
100% Chinese Junk …
Next time you are in Dick’s check out the labels of where the merchandise comes from.
People who complain loudest about our economy and lack of jobs need to look at what they are buying and where it comes from.
I know the people who make my boats/waveskis, paddles, PFDs and they live in the US.
That would be correct poleplant…
Based on your assessment of your inlaws; I probably wouldn’t be a big fan of theirs either.
However, that blanket assessment of your inlaws makes me curious.
“What is their assessment of you”?
:^/
BOB
Dick’s is good
If you want a red one.
Chinese Junk?
The problem is that most people shop based on price not caring much about quality of where it is from. “Buy cheap twice, instead of quality once” seems to be the motto. China produces what US companies are willing to pay. Apple and Cisco are made in China as are other quality high end products. As a kid I remember “Made in Japan” on cheap products, look what it means now.
What are you posting with?
An American made computer?