Explorer vs. Tempest Pro 165

Too big!

– Last Updated: Aug-20-08 5:02 PM EST –

At 5'7'' and 160lb, that boat would be bigger than he needs. The regular Romany would be better.

I’m probably a bit larger than you
I’m probably a bit larger than you.



Anyway, I never paddle without a skirt. It’s part of the boat and I don’t want to have to think about “do I have a skirt on?” when I paddle.

word has it
the T-165 already won. great deal and IMO a perfect fit!



steve

No skirt was not the plan
I got to the beach and a friend had his brand new OI there, unfortunately his skirt was way too big to stay on me and my extra small deck skirt was no way going to stretch the length of that cockpit. So the only way to do this was no-skirt. Then a wind came up.



It’s a smaller person thing - while average sized guys might have several skirts that are pretty interchangeable across boats, boats that fit me tend to all have a more specifically sized small or extra small, or very narrow, skirt.

Decisions are a wonderful thing
Hope that’s right.

With luck :wink:
It would make another T165 near me and increases the opportunities to paddle one!

Comfort
A variable not mentioned is comfort. I have yet to paddle a more comfortable boat than the Tempest. And I’m talking 8, 10, 12 hour days.

T165

– Last Updated: Aug-20-08 6:32 PM EST –

Leaning toward a weekend purchase of the T165. It is a 2007 model, so told it has all KS hatches. Actually, would not have bought this model with Wildy hatches.


WS hatches

– Last Updated: Aug-20-08 9:41 PM EST –

It really blows my mind that Wilderness System continues to use their own sucky hatches on their kayaks. And next year, there is some new WS hatch cover out there. The Z 15.5 that I use on a daily basis is always getting water in through the hatches. Except for the rear KS hatch. Always. My KS hatches on my personal boat, never leak. I just can't understand why WS decides to use such a crappy hatch cover on otherwise great kayaks.

Anyway, I wouldn't blame you a bit for not buying the kayak if it had WS hatches on it.

IMHO, you'll always wish you would have bought the Explorer. :)

WS hatches can work…

– Last Updated: Aug-21-08 11:09 AM EST –

I'm no great fan of the WS hatches...but I've found that some 303 treatment does wonders for the seal on a RTM kayak. I apply it once a year, and it makes a huge difference in hatch performance.

That said, I, too, would insist on KS hatches for a new WS boat.

still undecided

– Last Updated: Aug-21-08 8:17 AM EST –

So it figures that I was contacted this morning with a great deal on an NDK Explorer in almost new condition! Slider skeg. 2007 model.

OK, to get to a final decision on Explorer vs tempest 165, it would best to share the type of paddling i expect to do with this boat:

50% per year, 20 to 30 times - 1 to 3 hour paddles on local freshwater lakes and rivers with zero to 1 foot chop
35% per year, 5 or more all day trips on larger freshwater lakes, 10 to 16 mile round trip paddles with waves zero to 2.5 feet
15% per year, 1 to 3 times a year, 2 to 3 night camping trips on these larger lakes, covering 15 to 30 miles, own backpacking type gear-smallest Thermarest, down bag, tiny stove, 1 person MH tent

Need to decide by end of today which boat to purchase ahead of an inland Northern Forest canoe Trail Maine camping trip.

"You may always long for an Explorer"
Until you have one, you may always long for an NDK Explorer. Once you have one…



Both the Explorer and Tempest are very good boats. If the deal on the Explorer is better than the Tempest or is so good that a similar deal on an Explorer is unlikely to occur in the future, then maybe you should buy the Explorer.



Otherwise…


Which is most comfy over time?

– Last Updated: Aug-21-08 9:27 AM EST –

There is nothing in your paddling that pushes either of these boats off the block. Is there one of them that you had a stonger feeling about, or that you felt would be much more comfortable over a long paddle?

Celia question

– Last Updated: Aug-21-08 9:37 AM EST –

Hi Celia,

Here's some random thoughts on this.

Pro-Explorer:
Being used to a straight tracker, I bet that I'll be relying on the skeg much more on the Tempest than Explorer. Assumed after test paddling. For my one or two camping trips a year, I will probably find no more storage room or even less in T165 vs OI. Paddling-wise, instructors have relied on Explorers world-wide for a reason. Not sure of any instructors using a Tempest. Resale on Explorer is always quick and good. In comparison, I've dropped my OI price to an embarrassing and ridiculous $1,495 and stll can't sell it. The Explorer, even just pyschologically, might provide more comfy feel, in tough conditions.

Pro for Tempest

I've indicated that 80% of my paddling is less than a day freshwater stuff. Do I really need to lug 60 pounds and almost 18 feet off my car to do this? WS seat and backband better. May be easier to roll-lower back deck. Unknown quality on NDK boat-never been in water. Think Anthony kill on Round Lake-this is the boat for that I am sure.

The most intelligent comment that I can give here is that I've had neither boat out in challenging conditions of wind and waves so simply do not know how comfy I will be with either. Both will turn better than my OI of course. (I loved the look and cockpit feel of the BD Ellesmere but once I got in 2 foot chop, I hated the feel of the boat)




Coin toss.
Heads:Explorer

Tails:Tempest

get both

– Last Updated: Aug-21-08 9:42 AM EST –

Ok, enough of this. I appreciate all of the help here from posters. It makes sense to get out of this indecision loop and make a goal of getting both boats. get whichever one first has the best deal and as time permits and a good deal pops up, get the other maybe next year. I just need to finally be firm with my non-paddling spouse, who insists that a kayak is a kayak and why would anyone need more than one.

The priority may be to get the tempest first as that is the deal taking my OI. I can always save up for a used Explorer for next spring.

Can’t find a coin?
Oh well, throw your gift cert. up in the air instead.

instructors using a tempest???
there are a bunch…

EMS kayak has a couple of us in tempests…

i imagine that Alder creek might have a few in T’s as well…



There is a new book that just came out in May about kayaking…and it is a well illustrated book that the people are only in tempests…

gotta look harder…they are out there!!! all over…

rob

lot of guides
in the MDI area use the tempest, either 165 or 170 for guiding.

hatch problems???
i have owned two plastic tempests and currently have a glass 170 and my wife’s plastic 165 in the basement…

neither of our boats have WS hatch leak problems…and neither has been treated with 303 on the hatch coamings either…



hit or miss on them i guess…not all are bad though!