fast kayaks

What I have taken
from this thread is my paddling level and my Capella 163 are adequate for paddling with just about everyone and every boat. Before my post was beginning to have doubts on whether I made the correct choice in boats. Will now spend more time on bracing and rolling maneuvers. Thank you all for all the insights.

Worthy of a bookmark for reference later

Priorities

– Last Updated: Nov-24-09 9:56 AM EST –

I don't know where you are on bracing and rolling now. But in terms of your asset to a group, being able to stay upright and avoid needing an assisted rescue seem right up there with keeping up with the group. And 4 is a plenty decent cruising speed for a group.

It seems that newer paddlers often get so interested in speed that they leave the basics of handling problems in messy stuff until later than they really should. Especially guys, sexist as that sounds. But it's hard to under-rate staying upright in slop.

try one

– Last Updated: Nov-24-09 9:57 AM EST –

I swapped boats recently with a Romany for my Outer Island. I've been in the Romany many times and it always feels like i'm dragging a plastic bag on the skeg. But I keep up with the group no problem and so does the owner. You can feel it but it's not going to change your happiness on the water. When we are humping it out into the wind, we all paddle side by side regardless of the boat. You should try some boats and see how they feel for you because that's ultimately how you ended up with what you have anyhow. You'll probably find that you are still very happy with what you have as you stated.


16 miles
is a healthy paddle… at 4 mph probably a little faster than average paddling groups. A lot of people like a fast start then take a lot of breaks and slow down towards the end.



On Saturday I did about 16 miles in 4 hours total against some tide and wind… half was in the ocean… I was kind of pushing it because I started at 2 pm and wanted to get back off the ocean before dark.



I don’t mind paddling anywhere down to about 3 mph, as long as I don’t have to stop paddling.



I had a Capella that I was a little heavy for so it seemed a little sluggish at the time.



Level 3 training and strokes and maneuvers improved my paddling the most. Not necessary for everyone (I was pretty good before I took them) but those two one day classes teach things you normally wouldn’t do, and made me a lot more compatible with more advanced paddlers and a solid group paddler. (if you haven’t done it already)






do both
Do it all. Do some whitewater and bust thru ocean surf in a $300 dagger animas. Be in a canoe race with a partner or the 90 miler. Have a fast boat such as epic sport ski. Have a fast flatwter boat. The marathon master at 25# is often bought for under a grand. A 17 ft icf trainer-20 in wide- is about same stability as epic? Not made for whitecaps but excellent for portage. It and boats like it are the most popular kayak for 90 miler.



Fast can be lonely if others paddle slow. people are more importanat than fast

Speed
Most suggestions of trying different boats is probably going to get you the answer that best fits you. Paddling in a group provides many other ways of increasing overall speed and performance. By using paddle skills for the stroke and edging for turns, you will increase your speed. Watching how others execute those techniques and then trying them for yourself, you should see dramtic increases in speed and perfomance.

If you are doing those 16 miles…
… as a pretty much nonstop paddles you will likely have a hard time finding groups that you will enjoy paddling with and vice versa!



Short answer to your original question: You could probably expect 1/2 knot out of a faster hull. Maybe less in some conditions, maybe more on flat. That’s with something like a QCC 700 that is still about as stable as what you’re in now and pretty versatile. To some that’s not significant, but they probably don’t do 16 miles very often (at least not without a mid trip picnic).



Going to higher performance craft than that my get you another 1/2 knot or more over that but there will be a learning curve and the change in stability will cost you that speed at first as well as limiting the conditions you paddle in for a while.



I did 15 the other day in 3:30 (in my 700), but it used to only take me 3:00 even on average. I could blame the tides, but it’s really more about my not paddling much last several months. In other words, that is my slow/out of shape pace, and I think it is slow (as there are some here that could do 15 it in 2:30 in same kayak).



I nearly always paddle alone as I like to set a pace and go, not stop and go. Not a killer pace, but a get into the rhythm pace. Seems few want to hold anything over 4 knots for very long and like to glide as much as stroke. Sure it’s easy to slow down when in a group, and I do, but I also find doing so really kills technique (mine’s poor enough already) and that leads to a lot more strains and pains.

another option
If you’re looking at improving your technique, fitness, and speed while in your current boat, give a wing paddle a try (or a few tries, as it takes a bit of getting used to). The wing forces you to use body rotation - which will aid your speed and endurance after some training time. You can still roll and brace with a wing.



IMHO your speed is already fine if you’re group paddling. Work on rescues and getting a good forward stroke. BUT… If you find yourself constantly wanting to ‘push’ your speed, and find the increase in speed and endurance addicting, using a wing and eventually getting a faster boat will reward your efforts and likely motivate you even more. Personally I have more fun paddling my ‘fast’ ski than I ever did in my sea kayak.

Faster boats are not as much work
I took second twice in the Des Plains Marathon so you know I trained alot. During the many years I raced I almost never paddled with a group that I wasn’t racing with. Now I still like speed but if I learned anything about paddling, it was to buy the fastest boat you can comfortably paddle. maybe even a little above your ability. If your paddling in a group you don’t have to work that hard. And when your in the mood to go fast you’re already sitting in what you need. One more thing. Learn to be content paddling solo. If you truely enjoy the sport you also enjoy nature. You can be more intouch with nature solo paddling. Solo is where it’s at!