authority
– Last Updated: Jan-23-04 11:29 AM EST –
geee, i didn't realize i was an authority figure, thanks! well, except for my kids. you sound very submissive. now drop an give me 50!
your right …
about your first paragraph. it’s all the info i have to go on at this time. like i said i can’t paddle them at this time. but, generally speaking when looking for a canoe don’t you, at least i do, start with the dimensions first to see if it’s the size and type of canoe your looking for? yes, the final test is paddling, no doubt. but i just want some other peoples thoughts. people that have an imagination and that have enough experience with a number of canoes do help out in general terms.
it’s interesting that unless one puts a manufacturer name on it they can’t imagine a the boat or have anything of value to add. it makes me wonder about some of the advice people give and how much bias is given to manufacturer’s and not the individual craft.
your second paragraph is wrong, no troll. look my profile up… i’m for real!
Thanks!
thanks for everyone that replied with something to offer! i really do appreciate your advice and will look closer at the #3. i’ve been informed by the builder there is one person about 4 hrs away from me that has this particular model. i just need to find the time and make a visit and try his out. thanks, again!
Inquiring minds want to know…
Builder? Area?
Before you close this “tickler”, are you going to satisfy our curiousity?
Great subject matter. Thanks.
Late To The Dance…
I, too have multiple flatwater solos, ranging from 14 ft to 16 1/2 ft. And, as has been observed in earlier posts, each has its unique characteristics, including the the two 14 footers; they’re similar --dimension-wise-- yet quite distinct. Others have pointed out how the boats you’re interested will generally behave, so I won’t rehash that. Basically, IMO, it comes down to the characteristic(s) that you prefer, or that best suits your need. FWIW, I’m essentially the same size as you (just a wee bit lighter) and I prefer my 14 footers. I’ve had them on multi-day camping trips in a variety of conditions, to include some big water. Never felt like I was in over my head, or in conditions that the boat was not capable of handling. But that’s a personal decision/evaluation.
If you’re interested in another view on this, visit the Stewart River Boatworks site (http://stewartriver.wcha.org/) and read the builder’s comments/comparison on his two solo w/c canoes. (Gee, the Traveler sure sounds like boat #3…;-))
Happy hunting.
canoes
– Last Updated: Jan-23-04 2:36 PM EST –
bellcapt,
yes, one is from stewart river [traveler], and one is from kedros canoes which no longer has a web site. the 14ft'er is from red river canoes in manitoba,canada.
curious as to what your solo canoes are,especially your two 14ft'er? are they wood canvas? thanks!
Boo
– Last Updated: Jan-23-04 4:55 PM EST –
I was wondering if the 14' one was the Red Fox. I've been waivering about adding a w/c canoe to my collection. The Red Fox, Unity and Traveler are all on list of "possibles." Some day, some day... Currently, though, I have a Merrimack Baboosic (hands down, my favorite), a Bell Wildfire (those two are the 14 footers); a Bell Merlin II (15' --the one I generally use when I want to favor straight ahead over maneuverability); and lastly, a We-non-nah Prism (16 1/2'). I don't use the Prism as much as I once did because I prefer maneuverability over go-straight, but that's just me. All of them are fine boats. And I've had them all out for multi-day outings and would not hesitate to do so again. Caveat: I generally paddle alone, so keeping up with others is not an issue for me. I try to allow enough time to get where I'm going. I may not go as far in a day, but, hey, it's all part of the journey, a piece of what makes ya' smile...:-)
Please keep us posted as you progress in the elimination process. Be interested to know which one you select, and why.
Happy hunting!
w/c canoe
– Last Updated: Jan-26-04 6:32 PM EST –
bellcapt,
yes, i'm looking at the Red Fox. the dimensions are similar to the wildfire. i found a couple people that believe it is more seaworthy than the unity by stewart river. i contacted a person that has the traveler which he really likes. the canoe by kedros is a cedar strip called dreamcatcher.
so have you paddled or have any experience with these canoes? or do you know anyone that has paddled them that i may contact for their input? email me and let me know! thanks!
So I used my brain
and my brain said that I could adhere to any of your three sets of dimensions and build either a great stripper, or a river pig. That’s why it wasn’t too meaningful to deal with mere dimensions.
I thought you might have been looking at three different sizes from one stripper constructor. But, even stranger, you’re looking at different sizes from different constructors. Apples, oranges, and bananas.
It was especially amusing that you listed dimensions down to the second decimal place. That sure was important for us to have.
14 foots
Sounds like a valid question to me – all other things being equal, what would these differences in dimension do to performance?
Basically, more length, less width, less rocker, all = more speed, less maneuverability, and vice versa. Now, as to whether more speed or more maneuverability = a better all around boat, that depends on your planned use.
I’d say the question boils down to whether you have a particular need for speed, such as if you usually go with people who like to go fast, or if you frequent mainly large lakes or other big water where it would get boring if you can’t cover a lot of ground. The 15-1/2 foot, 26.75 inch wide, low rocker boat will likely be much faster than the others. If you can give up a little speed, the 14-footer will be more versatile and able to handle small, tight water, and yet still be fast enough to do some 30-mile days on slow rivers.
If it were me, I’d rather have the smaller, more versatile boat. It means there will be more fun places you can go within 4 hours of home.
w/c canoe
memphis,
the 14ft Red Fox is the one I was originally leaning towards because of it’s versatility. it is based on the original Chestnut Fox. but, because of my size i’ve been hesitant about following thru with buying it. after discussing this with a few people they feel it would easily handle me plus gear. the Traveler [15’6"], because of it’s size seems to be a canoe to consider. i’ve done extensive research looking for a w/c canoe between 14-16ft and no wider than 30in. there are a lot of different w/c canoes out there but these two plus the kedros seem to fit my bill. yes, someday i need to have all three but for now i can barely afford one. which brings me to cost, the red fox is from canada which i’d save a bit of money from the exchange rate. there are other very reputable builders i’ve looked at but their cost plus shipping make them out of reach for me. thanks for your reply!
take door #2!!!
You said all around boat right?
The two longer boats will be way better than the 14 for cruising…the glide will be much more enjoyable and usable for covering miles. No contest.
The 15.5 footer with little rocker doesn’t like to turn, doesn’t turn gracefully, and sucks for freestyle.
I’m about your same size and my take is that you can’t beat a 15 for an all around solo - in general. Of course there are always exceptions.
It’s #2. Duh.
‘Fraid not.
Sorry, but I have no firsthand experience with any of the three you’re looking at. However, I have read discussions about the Red Fox (don’t recall which forum). Essentially, the comments were along the lines of those found at Red River’s site. Have you contacted any of the builders? Years ago, during a ‘fact-finding’ quest, I corresponded with Alex Comb at Stewart River. I found him to be knowledgeable and forthcoming; suspect the folks at Red River are that way, too. Also, if you haven’t done this, might be beneficial if you stopped by the Wooden Canoe Heritage Assn site (http://wcha.org) and posed your questions on one of their fora, especially since you’ve zeroed in on specific builder/models.
I noticed your reply (below) to Memphis. The main reason I responded to this thread in the first place was to try to give you additional perspective on a 14’ boat, particularly if versatility is truly a major determinant. If so, I encourage you to not summarily dismiss the Red Fox. Its specs are very similar to the Baboosic --a canoe whose design was derived from the Chestnut Prospector. Personally, I find the Baboosic to be quite seaworthy; and though it’s not the fastest boat on the pond, it, IMO, is not a dog, either. I have gotten the impression the Red Fox’s behavior is similar to the Baboosic’s.
Or… you could always give the Stewart River Unity a look; at 14’10" it’s right in the middle. ;-p
Good luck and Happy hunting.
Bigger Fox
– Last Updated: Jan-24-04 2:13 PM EST –
If the 14 foot size concerns you about the Fox, but you like the way it handles and fits your style you can have a longer one built in woodstrip/glass. Red River has plans available for woodstrip molds and as it is a symmetrical hull it is easy to stretch it.
I have been paddling a woodstrip version of a Rushton canoe called a Vayu or Ugo, 15 foot, 30 inches at the gunnels. It has a V bottom and not as much rocker as the Fox, but volume and flare are very similar. It is not the fastest hull around, but it is seaworthy. I spent a windy, rough afternoon on Basswood in Quetico clawing my way up an eastern shoreline with a strong west wind. The motion in the waves was comfortable and I was able to be traveling when everyone else was sitting it out.