no dog in this hunt
But there is some lack of logic here.
Why isn’t a man’s experience with repairing them just as valid as people’s experience w. owning them?
It’s all experience, all gained over some period of time. It’s all anecdotal (like all kayak quality discussions) There never is going to be any statistical precision, this is a very small manufacturing output.
People can read this thread and the other ones in the archives. They can go research other places. Then decide for themselves if they want an NDK boat, or don’t.
Seat Replacement
Well the fit on the this early 2000’s boat is not as good as the fit on newer explorer I tried because the seat has pads, and its not the same seat. The used seat seems to be bit higher off the hull and the front edge is elevated.
The newer seat is more hemispeherical, with no change on the front end, and Im pretty sure my butt ends up closer to the hull…how big a job is it to put one of these newer seats in? I forgot to look at the connection to the hull…
Why are you nervous?
You checked for cracks and leaks (none found), and the kayak weighs about what is normal.
Go paddle it!
Fit
The fit is not good with old seat…and fit obviously is important.
Anyhow in the mean time I found out that the new seat is
-hard to find
-sits lower
-is pretty easy to install and needs a little epoxy
-has a back band that goes a little higher
-takes alot of stress off the attachment points
-~130 to 150 usd
try MIKCo
Maine Island Kayak Company. http://www.maineislandkayak.com/
Talk to Tom Bergh, I’m pretty sure he has some of the new seats in stock. He can also answer questions/concerns about build issues.
Lyn
experience
All I can tell you is of my experience. I bought a new '01 Explorer ten years ago, and it hasn’t had the easiest life. It’s been a fantastic boat. Love the original seat, though the backband was replaced years ago. If any of you have an old seat that you tear out and don’t want to keep, let me know please…
I did put a hole in mine about five years ago. The circumstances were such that I can’t blame the construction of the boat, and I’ve had no other problems with it.
Check for water in the hatches, paddle it, then check again. Try the skeg, make sure everything looks solid. They’re pretty simple boats.
Simply false
SKUK does NOT use a “chopper gun”… why do you continue to to blast with false info?? I have spent time (over the past 6 yrs) in the factory - have you EVER been there?? Maybe not the fanciest bit still some of the most solid boats built. Can provide boat build photos. 'Nuff said.
Perhaps that’s changed…
– Last Updated: Jul-14-12 1:25 PM EST –
...but I know someone who saw them using one only a few years ago. Also, when repairing them, I've seen firsthand the bridging, air bubbles, gaps in the glass and inconsistent glass thickness that's characteristic of chopper gun use. I couldn't figure out how they could build boats so inconsistently using chopped-strand mat, is what I assumed they were using, so when I heard about the chopper gun, it all made sense.
Look closely at the underside of the deck they're building in the video. Specifically, notice how lumpy and uneven it is, which is also characteristic of chopper gun use. If they're using mat, they've managed to screw it up pretty badly. The variation in the thickness and glass/resin ratio is very obvious.
If there is ANY advantage to this type of construction other than low cost of materials and labor, please explain why every other manufacturer in the industry has moved on to more sophisticated and expensive methods of building kayaks.
OK, I admit…
…that I don’t KNOW that they make minimum wage. However, why else would SKUK hire inexperienced kids to build boats?
I don’t consider that an insult, as I made minimum wage myself at that age. You have to start somewhere…
Having a high-turnover, inexperienced workforce makes it very difficult to maintain any kind of consistency or quality and it shows in the product.
You can also install or build…
– Last Updated: Jul-14-12 1:22 PM EST –
...a Minicel foam seat. That allows you to customize it to suit yourself. Of the issues you can have with a boat, I would consider the seat to be one of the least concerning, as there are many good options for replacements.
Why hire inexperienced kids
Two reasons other than low wages:
- The kids live locally and there are few jobs available. (Helps the community and gives kids something constructive to do in case they aren’t crazy about academics.)
- By learning to make kayaks, it’s likely those kids will want to TRY the items they helped make. (Creates a new generation of sea kayakers instead of being a pastime of only/mainly older people.)
The underlying reasons given in parentheses are important aids to long-term health of the area. They go beyond just making money for the employer. I have to give NDK/SKUK credit for thinking with this broader view of how they affect the community.
You’re making a big assumption…
…that SKUK actually has that “big picture” in mind, rather than just the bottom line (though in all fairness, I’m also making the assumption that they don’t). It may be the case and if so, kudos to them! But I’m skeptical considering that everything about the operation seems to scream “low budget” (spartan facility, cheap materials, antiquated construction methods, young workforce, etc.).
There are other British boat manufacturers such as Valley and P&H that produce high-quality boats using local labor AND modern manufacturing methods, at comparable prices. It seems to me that buying one of their boats accomplishes the same social goals without any downsides.
Tmx
Thanks for the tip