greenland paddle looms

Some factor in kayak beam…
… others don’t.



I don’t, but for me it’s a moot point as I like about a 21" loom on a GP and my widest kayak is 21" (other is less than 19" - about 4" narrower than my shoulders).



GP was designed for relatively narrow kayaks, so I don’t think qajaq beam was a big factor for most Greenland Qajaqmen either.



For wider kayaks there is no good rule or even sound guideline (besides not using GPs in wider kayaks! [wider than typical sea kayaks anyway- there are other paddle types for that particular handicap])



The narrower the kayak, the more forward stroke secrets the GP reveals…

I agree that your paddle is too long…
…and the loom length seems excessive for someone your size. An overall length around 80" (+/- a couple) with a loom in the 18"-19" range and 3 1/8"-3 1/4" wide blades is more typical and should be a much better fit for you.

hi
loom length is really a matter of preference–I use 20.5", but i know of a couple of world class paddlers same size as me who use a 24" loom. bill or don can help you figure our what you want. for many people, it takes a while to “dial in” the perfect paddle, but you can always get close. in this sense, other than going shorter the advice here is advisory not prescriptive. good news is that you’ll love the skinny stick–tempest will be fine with the smaller paddle.

Thanks to all
Wow, who would’ve thought choosing a paddle size could get soo technical! And I thought longer! yet many of you much taller than me are using shorter. Thanks for all your help - your suggestions have surprised me and opened up my eyes and mind a little more. I know that I will most definately order another wood before the investment of a custom carbon (probably not superior as i know 3 1/8 is max for my hands). Trying a euro again (carbon) felt almost cumbersome with the spoon feeling blades for me as I dont need the quick acceleration just paddling on lakes and slow rivers. Thanks again to all for your time and effort in helping me!!

Loom length
I wanted to like the GP and made 3 of them but when I use one I always want the Euro paddle back after about an hour or so. I think one of the reasons for this is that 18/19" loom length. I’ve grown used to a hand distance determined by putting the paddle on top of the head and moving the hands to a location that creates a 90 degree bend at the elbows; for me that’s about 29" (inside to inside of my hands). I guess most people just hold the Greenland paddle a little ways up the blade. This doesn’t make sense to me (not to mention that I don’t like the feel of it) Why not make a wider loom? I may make another paddle and try this just to see if it makes enough difference to sway my opinion on the GP.



Bob

Loom Length!
Wheels just said it…



Just1more, are you grasping your GP at the loom alone and not grasping the shoulder of the blade? That might be why you’ve tolerated the long loom and are partial to the oval shape. I was taught to grasp the loom with the thumb and forefinger and the rest of the hand is on the blade.

Depending on your size…
…an 18"-19" loom may well be too short for you. I would guess the average adult male uses a loom around 21"-22". There’s nothing to stop you from making a wider loom and famous Greenlanders like Maligiaq Padilla use a 24" loom. Loom length is largely personal preference and the anthropometric measurement methods people commonly use to determine loom length are just a starting point.



The reason that Greenland-style paddlers hold the roots of the blades and not just the loom is that it helps orient the blades for a canted stroke.



There are subtle, but important differences between Greenland and Euro forward stoke techniques that make a big difference in performance. If you haven’t had the chance to work with an experienced GP user on your technique, you should try to find one to coach you. Also, an hour here and there is not going to be enough to learn to use a GP effectively. It took you much longer than that to become proficient with a Euro paddle, right? If you’re really interested in learning to use a GP, you have to make a commitment to working with it until you develop a feel for it.



FWIW, the first time I tried a GP it felt really awkward and I went back to a Euro. However, I was intrigued enough by it to make one and give it a more extended trial. My first paddle wasn’t great, but I refined my paddles and my technique over time and now I wouldn’t consider going back to a Euro for general paddling.

Kudzu
I think so at least i try to be aware to have the 2 fingers around the loom and the rest of my fingers sort of splayed on the blade. I have been feeling lately that I could “choke up” a little and that is why I am thinking that a slightly shorter loom might be better for me now. I really dont feel I have the right hand orientation on the blade though as I tend to bring those other fingers back in subcontiously.



I am still wondering about the majority of looms - do most people prefer and use oval? I do want to say I love my gp over a euro now and when thinking about using our wide breezes to do a relaxed river paddle, I fret thinking that I will probably need my 230 euro for its length and this style of recreational kayak and that just changes the whole feel to my paddling!

My Opinion

– Last Updated: Jun-01-08 3:11 PM EST –

If you'll go with a shorter loom and a shorter paddle you'll be fine. You'll keep your hands on the blade shoulder and you won't much care whether the loom is oval or round.

If it assures you any, my buddy at about 6'4" is using shorter and shorter GPs and he just bought a Tempest 165. (He's selling his Tempest 170). I doubt that he ever had his loom as proportionately long as you, however.

technical…
Paddling often, you come to a place where you begin to discern subtleties. Then you develop preferences. Luckily, the design of a paddle can be infinitely varied-- as is the paddler. though the changes can be relatively small, the effects can be as profound as the difference in bottles of wine. One thing about working with Bill stands out to me-- he seems to keep a finely detailed mental record of every paddle he shapes. The right answer is transient because the paddler is always changing as well. We never paddle the same piece of water twice.

loom length…
one thing Bill showed me made an impact on my loom length. I was paddling an 18" loom and thought that was right but he had me try a 20" because with a wider grip you can more easily expand your chest to breath! I’d never considered that because the anthropometrics said my loom should be 18". Going longer helped the engine run better. Like adjusting the carb.

the other thing…
is that you can go with a shoulderless paddle and vary the loom length on the fly depending on your need.

Need to go paddling
Hoping to go paddling at Lake Arthurt later today and see some WPPSA people again. Looks like an awesome day out there! I will try holding my hands closer together to see how it feels with a shorter loom. Maybe someone else has a gp this year as I was the only one in the group, so none to compare with. Thanks for all the insight.

Oval Looms…
“I am still wondering about the majority of looms - do most people prefer and use oval?”



Yep…



: )

oval looms
Yes…totally round… no



finger and thumb on loom…the rest of the fingers on the blade root and shoulder area.



These are my preferances



Best Wishes

Roy

how about a picture
A picture’s worth a thousand words so - if anyone has the time I would appreciate a close up pic of how your hands are supposed to be on the gp paddle ie 2 fingers - rest on the blade. It may help correct me.

thanks, Marilyn

URL
http://www.greenlandkayaking.com/sizinginfo.html



See picture 5.

Try an Aleut and be less certain still
Have you also tried GPs that you haven’t carved? Did you before you carved? Makes a lot of difference.



I rarely see people making euros without prior experience/reference yet folks seem comfortable to do this with GPs - usually with predictable results…



Folks who get fist GPs from recommended sources rarely go back to EP full time. Coincidence? Methinks not.



Consider the wine comment above…