I revert back to beginner every spring.
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Thanks for this thought-provoking and valuable thread. While I consider myself well beyond a beginner, I’ve made more than my share of mistakes getting here. My most concerning misjudgements have been when I have overestimated or failed to adequately take into account the abilities of friends — often first-timers — I’ve taken paddling. I’ve put them in waters that are too challenging or we’ve put in too late in the day, when there wasn’t sufficient daylight remaining.
It’s an easy miscalcualtion to make — at least it has been for me. When taking a novice out paddling, go easy, at least until you have a clear understanding of their abilities.
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Years ago I got to paddle with Dan Colodney aka LIV2PADDLE. On the experience scale he was up around 10 and I was a 1. It looked like the paddle was glued to his palms.
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Nice experience to have had.
A new paddler joined at some point and, in all innocence, initially adopted that as a screen name. It was not way long after Dan Colodney’s death. There were still enough around who had interacted with him that the new paddler soon decided that another name would be a good idea.
Valsdad, very true.
Thanks for this thread, string. Its thought provoking and interesting to see the issue from the many different points of view represented here.
Having not done as much paddling in the last few years as i used to, I think if I’d put the thread up I’d have called it “I think I used to be an intermediate paddler.”
The whole business of ranking paddlers is an absolutely necessary exercise for instructors or leaders of group trips. But I think the idea of broadly applying it to a group as vague as “paddlers” can perhaps lead to a judgementalism or elitism that is off-putting to folks beginning the sport. I’m thinking of William Nealy’s proclamation that “there are no skilled flatwater paddlers” or the scaling of paddling skills based on sea kayaking in oceans or big waters. It seems to me that to be a good paddler there are a lot of skill sets that may be very important to some sets of paddlers (the ability to read weather as it occurs, orienteering, understanding of tide charts, the ability to make and break a camp fast in adverse conditions, or portage efficiently, for example) that are imperative to being an “intermediate” paddler in some areas of paddling but completely irrelevant in others.
In the end most of us paddle the water we have. The type of paddlers we become and the skill sets we develop is the product of the type of water we paddle. I have nothing but respect and admiration for those who are skilled in big water tripping or high level whitewater. I love reading their posts, but I don’t have such waters at hand to practice on and don’t expect I ever will. And nobody gets really good at anything they don’t regularly practice. In another lifetime, perhaps.
I agree with Oldboo - at least I notice I’m not as good a paddler for the first few trips in spring as I was last fall. (Or is it a case of “The older we get, the better we were?”) Come to that, I think MCImes’ point about competence being dynamic even within a session is a good one. For instance, though I know I’m not nearly as good a whitewater paddler as many here, I know I’m better if I run trickier sets later in a trip than if I hit the hard runs first in the day. I also know I can reliably and without much conscious thought more easily hit a small eddy on my right than on my left - I’m more level four to the right and level three to the left. Same with onside or offside competence but the difference is more extreme. And recovery after an upset is something I’m absolutely bad at due to lack of practice in that skill - lost a really nice paddle last time I did that - as a good whitewater paddler wouldn’t have. So how does that rank?
I love paddling mild whitewater with those who are more skilled than I, as ppine rightly suggests we should do, but there’s a bit of caution that should go with that. If you’re running a drop behind pblanc, or gitchellbob, or Rob - they easily thread lines through rapids that most (myself included sometimes) find hard to follow. And that’s something to bear in mind if there’s someone following you where you might lead them into something they might have trouble maneuvering through, though they might well be expert sea kayakers or BWCA paddlers that can eat three lakes before lunch.
If we paddle in groups, especially with folks we don’t know well, its almost inevitable that we note that he or she is fast, or precise, has or lacks endurance, chooses good lines or doesn’t, is confident in waves or isn’t, needs to have a close eye kept on them, but as just a fellow paddler I try not to get real formal in such assessments or even too certain of my observations… Safety and trying to keep a group together enough to be recognizable as a group is, for me, the only reason to judge other paddlers abilities at all.
So to the degree I’m able, I’ll leave the ranking of other paddlers to those who take on the role of formal instructors or hire out as guides.
Thanks again for a thought provoking post, string.
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This is true. The solution is somewhat in having skills and to an even larger part understanding the skills you have. Knowing your limitations.
Growing up on Lake Erie and in motorboats sometimes as small as a 16’ outboard you learn to always keep an eye to the west and keeping an eye on the weather before you even launch. If you are 4-5 miles off shore and the weather changes you don’t have time to get off the water and you run risks of getting in trouble. A thirty-minute warning is huge and it is up to the person to take the warning and get off the water.
Driving in blizzard storms here are no different. I know lots of people that are excellent drivers and come here in the winter to find they are total beginners.
I agree people need to hone their skills as best they can and select equipment best suited to the task at hand. Likewise the best tool they have to stay safe is the one between their ears. Knowing when to play your cards or when to fold them.
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I’ve learned over time what I can and can’t handle. I have a good idea of how to read conditions where I paddle and avoid conditions that I know I can’t. There is no rating system for that. I call my own shots, and if it doesn’t feel right it isn’t right.
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In paddling, the skills, really every individual stroke, can be dynamic endeavors. I think paddling has a lot in common with other athletic sports in this way. Ball fields have a bullpen just so pitchers can warm up. Basketball players, volleyball players…the warmup brings you into the flow of the game before the game starts. Even then, no matter how skilled, you can carry a no-hitter into the 9th inning and still lose the game, and it isn’t always the top of the order that gets you. A basketball player can be shooting at an exceptionally high percentage, keeping her team in the game, and still miss a few in the fourth quarter. Most football teams look quite unpolished the first game of the season versus mid-season. But they can still throw an incomplete simple screen pass in the playoffs. A lot of skills stick with you pretty well between games and even seasons, but I think there’s probably a fair amount of use it or lose it too.
I kind of like to think that if you’re paddling, you’re a real paddler. If you can do things that you couldn’t do when you first paddled that measure as significant to you, you’re some degrees beyond a beginner. I understand where there can be some practical use for some form of measuring stick, but I also understand that it can overtake the focus of paddling and sap some joy for some people, especially when folks get notably competitive.
I never seem to have a problem noticing talents in others towards which I aspire. And each time I recognize such a thing, I feel like a beginner. But I try to always process it in a positive way.
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Isn’t there something in (maybe) Zen about always keeping a beginners or novices mind?
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Group dynamics is an interesting thing. Before COVID, message boards and Facebook groups were filled with open invitations to trips – “Meeting at such-and-such at 12:00 – all are welcome”. The expectation was if you showed up you had the skills to run the trip. I did a lot of new rivers that way, but being an open boater (often the only one in the group) I usually tried to join groups with people I knew, and who knew me. Still, I would invariably get the skills questions from someone – “first time out?”, “done this run before?”, “what other rivers have you done?”, “do you know so-and-so?”, and of course “do you have a roll?” (the answer to that is no).
I am pretty careful about the trips I do and the people that I paddle with, so I never had an issue, but on whitewater trips (probably challenging sea kayak trips as well) people want to know who they are out with. No one wants to be dragging my butt out of the water, or worse bombing through the good rapids to chase down my lost boat. Once you are on the water you are stuck with each other. If someone said “hey – this probably isn’t the trip for you”, I’d be OK with that. Obviously, I don’t want to be in over my head from a skills perspective, and I’d rather not paddle with a group that doesn’t think I should be there.
Ad-hoc/common adventure/meet-up trips are one thing, but formal club trips are another. I lead flatwater and easy whitewater trips for my local club, and it is important to know who is on the trip. You can tell a lot from their gear, and a few minutes of quick observation at the start, but I’ll give them the skills questions as well. I’ve never had to turn anyone away, but I am also up front about the hazards of the trip (if any), the equipment needed, and the experience required. Most people make the right decision about their personal safety. If they want to do a trip that pushes their limits, I’d probably be OK with that. I’d just want to make sure that we had enough support to cover it.
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I almost always paddle with each person for a couple of hours to assess their ability before a trip. Many people over estimate their ability and it is apparent on the water. You want to know that before the put in.
Once we agreed to take on a couple of good friends without checking their ability. The river was in flood when we got there. We waited two days for it to go down. The friends paddled last and were instructed to follow our lines. We pulled over at a bad rapid and waved them over 75 yards above the rapid. They went right past us headed for an under cut bank. They made it okay, but that one still gives me nightmares. I never should have taken them out there.
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So I boat with a lot of different folks. Group dynamics are huge part of ww paddling. Chat folks up. Be honest. The river doesn’t care about our preconceived notions. I’m not here to impress but to get home in one piece and enjoy some fun. Set your own goals and create your own adventures.
I think the first concept is “assumption of risk”. If you’re boating with a few friends that you know well it might not even need to be discussed. On the other hand, pointing out the hazards before hitting the water might be a great idea if it is a new environment or an unfamiliar group. My own personal assumption of risk is really low right now- novice rating
Physicality- are you in shape, can you survive multiple swims? I’m feeling pretty vulnerable right now- thinking I need to get some low intensity seat time, on shorter trips before I can even really work on getting into paddling shape- experienced beginner only because I know how stay in the current, cut down on the play, and run easy lines if I get tired (intermediate skills) but definitely not in paddling shape.
Skills or techniques- even though I bash my own skill level, it has been a long time since I’ve gotten on a river and started having thoughts like "damn this is ugly, I really don’t belong here, I need to get my s**t together and hone in on my focus, exclude the fear and focus on what needs to be done if I’m going to continue. I usually start getting those thoughts when I’m on the edge of my skill level. I find myself having to start making moves I’m not comfortable with. My own skill level is higher than my assumption of risk and physical conditioning- so I probably have some intermediate skills in the water reading and bouncing off of rocks department.
On the other hand, my paddle drags, extra bracing, control hand issues, getting symmetrical on the paddle shaft, and reliable river rolling are all deficiencies. So we all have stuff to work on. Easier to address skill gaps on easier water conducive to practice.
situational awareness- how hard is it to sandbag me? Pretty dang hard, so I think I rate an intermediate or maybe even advanced. I got enough of a clue to look around and start to get a handle on what’s going on and make my own decisions. Once on the water I’m pretty adaptable to changing conditions and not afraid to pull the plug if things are getting out of hand. I realize there are still some environments (marine) I’m still clueless about and just barely stick my toes in the water.
So what does this all mean? I’m a fat, well seasoned, out of shape paddler, who boats well within my personal skill level on short runs that are moderate or easy. The perfect day for me right now, would be 5 miles of quick moving, straight forward class II-III. Throw in a little play and I’m very happy.
In terms of boating with others- chatting them up is real important, try to get a handle on their assumption of risk, physicality, skill level, and situational awareness. Be up front with others about your own issues. I find myself telling younger folks I need more breaks and am slow (so eddy out occasionally). I have gotten some younger folks to help load and carrying boats for me at times. I can still get there myself but it just takes me longer. Sometimes it is nice to have help.
So I’m a novice experienced beginner with intermediate skills that has advanced situational awareness. In other words, I’m a hot mess! Glad I could clear that up for folks! The river doesn’t care one lickety-split- keep it real!
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Our Club has a whole section on trip ratings
We are a sea kayaking club in the Chesapeake Bay area. We don’t do whitewater and out trips very rarely involve surf.
Not bad for neophytes.
Not my job to rate them as paddlers - but didn’t that W/C canoe break awfully clean? Looks like the planking was scored to break cleanly at exactly the mid point. However they paddled, it was a really poor choice for them to take a scored canoe down that river.
I started with how they had the canoe strapped down and then proper PFD wearing, then lack of any kind of floatation in the open canoes.
I remember watching the movie in 1972 and there is something to be said for how our brains work regarding self preservation as we age. The movie does point out how groupthink affects individuals and how strong personalities affect weaker ones.
There could be some lessons in the movie to be learned.
I agree the canoe broke apart right on cue.
It was a movie. Things do that in movies.
Haven’t read the whole tread, but agree with the many perspectives I did read. Even though they differ they all seem to make valid points. I enjoy paddling and have done a bit of it all from ww to open ocean, and paddle both canoes and kayaks. I enjoy day paddles and live to paddle and camp on multiple day outings. Have th basic skills to do some form of all the above at something more than beginner, but no where near the top of any. Having many years of experience from working on the water and playing on the water helps in risk assessment. But over confidence based on experience can lead to trouble. It’s best to bow to Mother Nature if you have any doubt. Being older tends to lead one from experience to be more conscious of the fact that we can get it wrong. The deteriorating body also leads us to be more cautious.