I'm disgusted with P&H!!!

Works for me, …
…and I have been described on these boards as the customer from hell over my SealLine footbrace issues.

Is the compass really such a big deal. I think the P&H logic is very good on that issue, and you said: “I paddle in contacts and see distances well but can’t see close in that well”. Well, the compass is now farther forward so you should be able to see it better, not worse, if this is true.

The bulkhead? How much space do you need to fill? I’d want one or two layers of minicell in there anyway. A super easy fix that also lowers cockpit volume. Wastes a little bit of storage space, but more foam improves comfort and reduces pump out volume. Is that really so bad?

I don’t get it.

I 'm With You On Both Counts

– Last Updated: Jul-30-04 5:06 AM EST –

as someone who is farsighted (and soon to wear bifocals) and short enough to do a lot of outfitting on any boat.

- Much easier to align compass with the horizon when it's further forward. If one cannot see the lettering on the compass, I think it's time for a new prescription since the lettering is pretty big.

- With bulkhead location, it's far better to have a little fudge space that can be finetuned with foam. Someday, your footwear may change or what you wear in the winter months will alter the fit and distance of cockpit to bulkhead.

My .00 worth, since I didn't pay anything for a custom ordered boat. :)

Just a thanks for your posting. I seem to collect sea kayaks and will continue to follow your experience with P&H since I have yet to aquire one of their boats. The last boat I ordered was a Looksha II from Necky, aside from an incredibly long wait, the boat arrived in perfect condition. The only instruction I gave the dealer was that I would not accept the boat if it was greater than 5% of the stated/advertised weight. Happily it was not.

I leave for Brick New Jersey next week to pick up an Eggemoggin by Lincoln Canoe/Kayaks. For this boat I have no expectations-only hopes that it is in semi-good condition since it is a used model, and thus I would not attribute any failure to the company for a boat I’ve purchased sight unseen, e.g. I’ve never seen any representation of the boat except the pics on the internet.

Regardless I feel your disgust in your dealings for such a prized kayak and do hope for you and future customers of P&H that the issue is resolved.

hold the mayo hold the lettuce
special orders upset us.

well not really.

Take stock of what is important.

  1. The hull, how does it paddle?

  2. What am I paying for?

  3. Can I modify the interior to make it comfortable?

    If the answer is:
  4. it paddles really well for me!
  5. a sweet ride!
  6. yes.

    then pay for the kayak and get to work on outfitting the kayak, this website has an endless array of info available for outfitting.

    If the answer is
  7. not really
  8. silly options that don’t effect how the kayak moves through the water.
  9. not willing to make any modifications because I expect everything to be perfect at time of purchase because I spent $3000.

    If these were your answers, find another past time.

    No kayak will be perfect. You will have to do some minor/major modifications to any kayak to make it comfortable. I don’t know how to get this through people’s heads. It is not an automobile that has a cushy seat, and electronic seat adjustments to swivel you into place. It is a big fiberglass tube with pointy ends. And what’s worse it has a fiberglass tractor seat in it and a piece of fabric for back support. And you think you’re going to be comfortable from the get go in that. Are you barking mad or what?!!!

I don’t think he said he expected it to be perfect. He expected it to be the way he ordered it. For 3k and countless months of waiting, it should be the way he ordered it.

Sending a new model boat…
from a new mould with the old “out of plumb” boat coming from the old mould sounds fair to me… Be Happy…

Suggesting that someone should just “be happy” with a product that they didn’t order is silly. It doesn’t matter if it doesn’t really affect the functionality of the boat. That’s not even the issue. If I special ordered a black hulled boat with green topsides, and I got a blue and white boat, I’d be pissed. It wouldn’t affect the handling or quality of the boat word one, but it would still be total BS. Anyone who told me to just “be happy with it” would have it coming. If someone pays for something specific, waits for months on end for something specific, and doesn’t get it, they have every right to be mad.

No, it’s not the end of the world. Yeah, maybe the boat will paddle just as well after he corrects P&H’s mistakes. But still, he ordered something, they told him okay, and in the end he didn’t get what he ordered. That’s just crappy QC and customer service. They can make all the excuses in the world, but it won’t change the facts that they did a poor job with this fellows order, and that they haven’t offered a remedy. To me, this is piss poor performance on P&H’s part.

Prior Customer Approval???

– Last Updated: Jul-31-04 3:48 AM EST –

I think that P & H should have at least contacted the dealer and had them get ahold of the customer to see if the "new" version was acceptable instead of just providing him with what they had.

This way he could have accepted or rejected the kayak giving him a choice in the matter.

At least it wouldn't have been a surprise when he arrived to pick it up.


Then again…
… it’s his problem not ours…

I’m going paddling… G’day

not trying to be picky, but - - -
you said that you ordered a CAPELLA, and P & H apologized for, and gave explanations for, the mistakes made in a QUEST ??

i was looking at p & h boats recently, and a disinterested outfitter said that p & h had been sold 2yrs ago, and have had some problems since

His problem, our benefit
It doesnt seem like a vengence rant, and I’m glad people share both problems and accolades. when I was ordering my kayak, I looked at every shred of insight about the company and its products.

People will weigh this report along with others to help make their final decision.

Why bother?
Accoring to your logic, as long as the haul paddles sweet, everything else can be forgotten. Then, why does P&H try to get more money by offering “customized” boats, if they don’t ever need to deliver what the “customer” wants? Why not just sell uniform boats with the same outfitting for “one same low price”?


My .02
This has been an interesting post to read. Good points on many issues.

I had a fiberglass kayak custom built last year to my specs. The first one out of the mold wasn’t what we had agree on and the builder told me up front about the difficulties. The next one was right on…just what we had agreed on, it paddled so nice I had one made for my wife.

Any manufacturer/builder should provide what is agreed on. It is a sad day fpr P&H if they can’t.

It will be interesting to follow up on this.

You should get what you expect.