Rudder
The one I tried had a Feathercraft rudder on it. I’ve only ever seen 2 or 3 others, all the same.
Nice boat.
Hey!
Mayhem with Maynard belongs to the Downeast Sea Kayak Symposium, for the tidal races class. My husband even bought the Tshirt to prove it. No fair poaching that name…
Mayhem with Maynard
Steve now uses that name for an array of his sessions. The Downeast Symposium last September was the first and as I recall the tee-shirt reads something like ‘Mayhem with Maynard, 2006 Tour’
That session was tidal currents at Sullivan’s Falls. The fastest moving thing was the water!
BTW it was all Brit hulls in that session. Albeit a couple made in North america - a Legend and a Montauk.
Very well put Greyhawk
– Last Updated: Jun-12-07 6:28 PM EST –
I live in the middle of that great NW paddle ground called Puget Sound. I have both a "Brit boat" that is skegged, and a "Northwest" boat that is ruddered.
We do have places up here that are not as protected as one might think, and have to deal with tidal races, rips, wind and quite of bit of current. I generally reach for Brit hull, it rolls easier with the low deck and the upturned ends are much more pleasing to the eye from a design standpoint. So that is the real point, you have your expedition barge SUK (that's Sport Utility Kayak). Mine is affectionally know as Escalade. And you have your shorter, lower Brit style play boat for day trips and general high performance environments (textured water). Why settle for just one kayak?
Comparisons are OK
We all get caught up in the details and personality differences - but truth be told there is FAR more overlap in performance than difference.
For the majority of what most would folks use either kayak for - either works well and can perform in excess of what most paddlers can do with them.
How many are really frequently doing anything more than sheltered/mild coastal and inland touring, in under 20 knot winds, at much over 4 knot average pace, for more than 20 miles a day?
Damn near any sea kayak is OK at that, so paddle what you like. If your needs and skills exceed those conditions - then the performance differences can matter a great deal. Otherwise - it’s all about fit and feel and features.
As for the maneuverability issue. If some crazy guy in a kayak is chasing me trying to do me harm - and one of us is in an Explorer and the other a QCC 700 - I sure as hell hope it’s the other guy who has the Explorer!
What real world use for a long series of S turns? You folks paddling those Explorers in tight winding creeks? Oh wait, someone said “rough water”. On waves, the waves will lift the ends out for you and let you spin a 700 pretty easy with a planted blade and some body english. If not - they’re not waves. Explorer may have an edge in the troughs - but it also digs in more and so is in the troughs a but more whereas the QCC rides over more (one turns 10% more “in” the water, the other 10% more “on” the water - for lack of a better way to express it) Again, very minor stuff - that varies from day to day and wave to wave.
We actually agree
IMHO, the Explorer is a much better boat than the QCC. I don’t think the QCC is anywhere near as seaworthy.
I don’t usually paddle flat water and I want a boat that can handle whatever is thrown at it. When I bought my Shadow, the choice had been narrowed down to an Explorer HV or the Shadow. I took them both out on the same day in some of the roughest water I ever paddled. The Shadow fit me a little better and that was what made my choice for me.
Both the Explorer and the Shadow are great boats! For me, a boat that goes fast in straight lines is not what I’m looking for.
Ever paddled in rock gardens?
Do you play in surf? Then you’d know the reason for wanting a boat that can do a series of S turns.
Read the whole post - keep in context
I as much as said we weren’t talking about playboat use.
Brit fans alway go to the rock garden and tidal race examples - but again - how many paddle this stuff vs. how many buy videos and dream? How many that would be looking at both an Explorer and a QCC700?
I love my 700 but would not pick or promote it for that use. You make a silly argument with this - simply because it’s and argument that doesn’t need to be made.
Of course the Explorer would have some edge in rock gardens (for me, mostly because I’d be less upset if I trashed it - and my repair patches wouldn’t seem so bad on an NDK vs. a QCC layup). L
yep, “does not”=mis-labeled
Fine boats all…
… but anyone who writes off the QCC as a flatwater no rocker go fast boat doesn’t understand it’s hull.
Feel is definitely different (I’ve paddle both Explorer and HV). My take is that whatever type of feel you’re used to, it will bias you and limit your appreciation and maybe even ability to get the most out of the other type.
Anyone used to an Explorer may feel the QCC is a bit more active/reactive and less reassuring - and harder to turn until you adapt to it. Anyone used to a 700 will find the Explorer a bit sluggish and boring - losing too much energy to the waves (I understand this is can be an asset in extreme conditions - but so can speed).
This feel difference is compounded by outfitting differences and very limited seat time in borrowed boats (I have minimized this difference a bit by having a skeg, foamed out bulkhead, good backband, and other small tweaks. I suspect an Explored paddler trying my 700 might find it a bit less objectionable than a stock outfitted/ruddered version - PARTICULARLY the OLD version with Feathercraft rudder and sliding pedals! Definitely NOT a fair comparison there!).
“how many”?
“Brit fans alway go to the rock garden and tidal race examples - but again - how many paddle this stuff vs. how many buy videos and dream? "
I don’t know how many “buy videos and dream”. I only know I “paddle that stuff”! In fact, that’s the main reason I bother to paddle! So I’m definitely a Brit fan. For I seek out “texture” water to put my boat in! Ooops, I got it backwards: a brit fan wants a brit boat even for flat water!
I’m not hunting seals for food. I buy food in the supermarket. I paddle for FUN, not as a daily routine. And the FUN for me is to PLAY. All boats that appeal to me are “play” boats.
There maybe others who “buy videos and dream”. But there’re enough of us who “play”. Just like I know a lot of bike riders buys full suspension bike with 6” travel never leave pavement. But there’re also lots of riders who, believe it or not, jump off 6 ft drop-offs over and over again FOR FUN!
So you ask “how many”? I can only say, MANY!
Just because many don’t doesn’t means there aren’t many who do.
All I can say is that is the type of
paddling that my friends and I do every week. We very rarely do a long crossing to one of the Channel Islands (12 - 30 nm depending on which island), but evey week we are usually out there launching, landing, and playing in the surf and finding relatively easy rock gardens to play in.
As someone else said, our boats are for play.
Several years ago, a friend ordered a QCC 700 and wound up returning it because it was not able to hold up to the stresses and strains we put on our boats. The hatches leaked a lot in surf, and the gelcoat was actually starting to crack.
Again, it’s just not designed for this type of use.
The QCC is quite a bit lighter than my Brit boat, but other than carrying it to and from the car, it’s not a problem LOL
How many are really doing any…
Well, a few of us are doing more than sheltered paddling. I’m happy with my quiver of sea kayaks in great part because I can use them to surf, rock garden, play in tidal races, etc…
Some might be surprised at the number of sea kayakers who use their boats thusly.
I have nothing negative to say about the sleeker QCC boats. I’ve never had the chance to paddle one. I would love to encounter one when I have access to some of the stuff for which I most enjoy paddling. Thusfar there have not been such boats anywhere that I have been surfing, rock gardening or playing in tidal races.
It wasn’t me
Steve Maynard was the one who came up with the name. I was expecting a class more along the lines of what your husband took----but since there was very little publicity about this class, Steve asked the participants what they wanted to learn.
There was about 1/2 the people in that class who shouldn’t have been in it. They needed to get some training in how to do basic strokes.
I liked Steve as an instructor, but he had a bad mix of people signed up. About half of us were solid intermediate to advanced paddlers and the other half were beginners.
Just kidding
Actually it started as a joke then Steve decided that he really liked it. I just wanted to be annoying and give its lineage.
But 1/2 beginners doesn’t make for much mayhem. The Tidal Races they had available at Downeast seem much more in keeping with the name than the class you describe. Generous numbers of capsizes, that kind of thing - tho’ as I recall from being told afterwards no rescues needed.
Northwest looking kayaks
Actually Nigel Foster’s boats are a bit Northwest looking - arn’t they? High flat decks, long boats, not a lot of rocker and not much overhang in the bow. (maybe Nigel’s not really British?)
I think there’s a lot of good nautical designers and some of them are not good industrial designers. (like edline) What a lot of people call Brit designs are really decendents of the Anas or copies of the thinking of the Inuits.
I paddle with lots of paddlers reguarly, brit boats, home made, American, etc. … the kayaks that handle various conditions best have paddlers who handle the boat better in them.
Actually I had only signed up for two
classes at that symposium. One was an all day class called “Incident Managment”, by Fiona Whitehead and Axel Schoevers and the other was the Mayhem with Maynard.
Fiona’s class was fantastic. All very experienced paddlers. We did things such as towing a rafted tow off the beach and out through surf as well as landing them through surf.
We also fad to “rescue” Fiona who was found wedged into some rocks with a shoulder injury that prevented her from beining anything but a dead weight. Her kayak was drifting not too far away, also up against the rocks.
Then we also had to land at a rock jetty, carry our boats up onto it, and launch into a small tidal race on the other side, and be back into the boats before you got washed into the surf zone, where it hit the ocean.
All in all it was fun, but I expected Steve’s class to be more of the same kind of thing.
must just be me
(Actually I agree with you regarding similarities vs. differences).
I have to confess I’ve never paddled both in all conditions - but I have paddled my explorer in all conditions and tried the 700 in a 2’ chop. The QCC felt a bit faster to me but not dramatically so, it felt a bit more direct but not at all unstable, less reassuring, or if it was more difficult to turn I didn’t detect it.
Two different solutions to a design problem, one in a different direction than the other but both very on-target for answering the design problem.
Isn’t the QCC a Canadian design?
Yes, QCC is a US Company, but doesn’t Mr. Winters - the designer - hail from Canada?
So what sets the design’s origin? The location/nationality of the designer or those who commission and sell the design? What does nationality have to do with hull design/performance anyway?
and how do you categorize
West Side Boat Shop?