not sure about international compliance
but Australian Maritime law requires that on a kayak you have a running white light as minimum.
Flashing red light (bicycle style), which are occasionally seen being used for the purpose, are illegal (they could mimic a buoy).
If you want to be fancy you can get a specific red/green running light that has a small suction cup for attaching to a composite deck of a kayak (plastic kayaks sometimes are not smooth/shiny enough for suction cups)
C-Light GOOD
I have one and currently use it like that…I have questions about it’s visibility though so I’m going this route…(My pole is also a flag staff… the C-light mounts up top).
PA regs are typical
Scroll down to Figure 7-C
Jim
http://www.fish.state.pa.us/boatcrs/03boathandbook/operation5.htm
Red & green lights…
– Last Updated: Sep-17-08 10:12 AM EST –
...on a kayak has never made any sense to me. It seems that a white light is all that is required if you do as most people do and apply the rules for "a vessel under oars" to kayaks.
Imagine crossing paths with a really large vessel at night. Is there really any point in confusing the issue by using lights which can imply that the large boat should slow down or alter course to let you freely pass (or at least force the captain to spend time figuring out what that red light belongs to and whether it makes sense to try to alter course). Even for more nimible powerboaters, I think it makes a lot more sense to display a while light so they can choose the most sensible path to avoid you, rather than put them in the position of trying to figure out what you are going to do. After what people wrote in Salty's recent "right-of-way" thread, it seems that most people would agree that putting red & green lights on a kayak is pretty silly.
nope, not silly
– Last Updated: Sep-17-08 1:21 PM EST –
a kayaking club in Manhattan did a study on various lighting setups, they determined that the more you looked like a boat, the more information you provided for direction and position. That you are seen as a slow moving boat does not mean you are exempt from prudent seamanship and able to make larger vessels adjust their courses,,it means that you are seen a lot farther away and improve EVERYONES situational awareness on the water.
The relative position of red/green and stern light will define your size, your height from the water is obvious to anyone in a boat on a deck. It's the person in a kayak that's confused about distances as they're so close to the water.
I've paddled in the S.F. bay a fair amount with dimming ACR 2AA penlights and various hand held waterproof dive lights going dim. Not until Tek-tite came out with a BRIGHT 3AA 2led penlight setup was there a substantial improvement for running lights for kayaks as it's flush and absolutely waterproof.
The colregs for rowing craft understandabley developed from a time where techonology couldn't put adequate running lights on a dinghy.
Practically speaking having a "white light to shine to prevent collision" is an acknowlegement that maintaining a constant running light was not possible or effective with little dry cells. It is now.
The problem with a singular white light is that it's the same as an anchor light. Also that single white light would have to mounted on your head to be visible all around. The standard forward running lights with stern white light satisfies 360 visibility. The Tek-tite red/green setup can be configured so that the lense doesn't shine up in your eyes and the reflected colored light off the deck doesn't mess with night vision.
If a person is really paddling where there's a chance of crossing paths with other boats,,you should be using running lights that help communicate your position and direction. A single constant white light does not do that.
http://tek-tite.com/src/products.php?c=2161
what i don't get is why they don't offer a 1AA cell white LED light to replace the ACR. Something like the Mark-lite but a white LED
c-light old incandescent technology
– Last Updated: Sep-17-08 1:23 PM EST –
it goes dim after a few hours. The beam is 360 with a narrow band. The get sold because that's what existed in their product line for affordable SURVIVAL gear that's not an emergecy strobe but it's not a navigation light and it's really a marginal rescue light.
14yrs ago I went on a night time paddle with BASK from Pt. Richmond marina with about a dozen paddlers. Nearly everyone had ACR lights. This was before white LEDs became common. I usually paddled with three lights, a Bright halogen light on the fordeck to be used intermittantly as needed, "the white torch", an ACR on the back of my pfd and another ACR on the back deck of the kayak.
All the the ACR lights look like dim candles flickering away as the narrow 360 beam bobs around. With regular batteries, non-lithium disposables, the beam becomes weaker in a few hours. Nearly half the kayaks had weak beams and some nearly dead as it was a two hr paddle and folks had used these ACR lights other times.
When we came back to the marina a big charter sport fishing boat was returning. We all thought we were well lit up...I certainly was because I turned on the 2watt halogen on my front deck as we came in and I was far from any boats in the middle of the marina channel.
When the charter boat came to the public dock he screamed holy murder down on us that he couldn't see us worth shit and it wasn't going to be his fault if he ran into us. The guy was terribly upset, he certainly didn't want to see his 30" twin screws chew up people in kayaks but we were floating around like faint fireflies, blinking in and out of visibility.
Please do a test. Get the ACR and the 2LED 3AA cell Tek-tite white light (or equivalent), put regular alkaline batteries in them. And head out into the night and see how the two look from 1/4mile. Then let the lights burn for a few hours and do it again the next day. I went through this paddling regularly at night. Having your faint yellow light,,turn yellower and yellower while totally surrouneded by black water is not a good thing. That's why I always went out with three lights.
You can get at least 24hrs of usable light from any of the small waterproof LED pen lights with more useful light output than the ACR incandescent light that's been around for decades.
The tek-tite lights are even better.
Good info LeeG
– Last Updated: Sep-17-08 5:05 PM EST –
"The problem with a singular white light is that it's the same as an anchor light. Also that single white light would have to mounted on your head to be visible all around. The standard forward running lights with stern white light satisfies 360 visibility. The Tek-tite red/green setup can be configured so that the lense doesn't shine up in your eyes and the reflected colored light off the deck doesn't mess with night vision."
"If a person is really paddling where there's a chance of crossing paths with other boats,,you should be using running lights that help communicate your position and direction. A single constant white light does not do that."
An constant all round white light means you are at ANCHOR. I suppose some here won't care, and neither do I. For those that do, Lee's advice is excellent.
BTW, never shine your light at a vessels bridge / wheelhouse.
Why?
> BTW, never shine your light at a vessels bridge / wheelhouse.
That would be my first instinct if I was just carrying a flashlight and a vessel was bearing down on me.
(Not meant to be argumentative, I’m honestly curious.)
Yes, but
Some states require even kayaks beyond the COLOREGS line to have a white light visible for 360 degrees. I have never heard of the state marine patrol enforcing that except in bays, but they claim its is a requirement in all state waters which goes, according to them, 6NM off shore. I think their position is shaky from a legal perspective, but not productive to discuss the law with law enforcement types as they assume they know what the law is and for all practical purposes they are the law.
Might not red and green running lights cause confusion concerning size and distance?
Because
– Last Updated: Sep-17-08 5:55 PM EST –
They have bigger lights. Talk about losing night vision. Don't upset the guy with the huge light.
Because you will blind
the operator which is a bad idea if you desire to be seen. It’s referred to as “embarassing a vessel”
Some state inland lakes etc. may have lighting rules that superceed the Colregs. Just check things out locally.
I’m guessing
they need their night vision and that shining your “torch upon your rigging/sail” would be more effective to illuminating who and what you are.
The photons in your flashlight have no repulsive force to prevent a large or fast boat from colliding with you. That’s the problem with interpreting the colregs wording for a single light to shine “in time to prevent collision”.
The best thing you can do for a fast or big boat is to COMMUNICATE with them in the time they can react, otherwise it’s like walking across a freeway counting on the cars to dodge you.
Here’s another anecdote. I’m paddling from Red Rock in the bay to the beach, the open crossing to the land is about 3/4 mile with the actual channel about 1/4. I’ve got an ACR light dangling off my pfd and a BRIGHT dive light on more foredeck “to shine in time to prevent collision”. I’m scanning up both ways as I head across but am confident with the current any likely traffice is up bay on the other side of the Richmond San Rafael bridge. As I’m half way across what I though was a slow moving ship far away actually turns out to be a commuter catamaran going about 25-30mph. I’m guessing. The point is it’s FAST,once I realize it I turn on the bright light and continue paddling triple time with the flashlight bouncinng around. It went behind me with lots of clearnce, about 150yd. But what I realized is that it wasn’t going to change course one bit. Until I turned on the BRIGHT light I was a floating log. The photons in my bright light would have no effect on the boat given the time to react.
It makes no sense to surprise a less maneuverable vehicle with a sudden illumination expecting that your reaction time is the only factor involved. Visible running lights ensures that I am constantly communicating my position.
Suddenly flicking on a bright light might give you the idea you’re in control of something but you’re actually setting up a situation that REDUCES the choices for the vehicle that will wipe you out.
You really don’t know what it’s like run a big boat or ship until you talk to people that do. I was in a kayak class with a captain of big 500’ ships, when he described what he went through on the chesapeake it totally changed my view on where a safe place to cross was and what they had to deal with.
Not really
small runabouts have them and they give the other guy more information as to your heading etc.
not to someone on a bridge
it’s the person 18" off the water that’s confused with size and distance.
I understand the desire to use what is sold in stores, that good ol’ 2AA ACR light with the 360degree. But it’s really marginal.
My $.02 is that if you paddle where there’s traffic and you are going to be on a path to cross other boats, look like a boat and not a floating candle.
Yep, I find that going a little beyond…
– Last Updated: Sep-17-08 6:27 PM EST –
... the minimum "flashlight" (have that too) or single constant white light requirements - and using some form of the red green forward and white aft not only works very well by giving much better 360 and more usable info, and is definitely appreciated by the other traffic. Get some chuckles (much as GPS gets in daylight), but more positives, compliments, thanks (or best of all, simple nods/waves vs dirty look/cursing).
The other traffic who I have them there for - as courtesy thing, to limit THEIR confusion, more than a personal safety thing for me (I tend to rely on maneuvering for that). Being small and low to teh water - I never assume anyone sees my lights - though they all seem to.
When in the boaters' realm, I'm a boater too, and so I do as the boater's do.
Lately, using three Tektite LED lights. A red and a green (same as in NAVLITE without the bag) under the deck bungees at either side (not on bow - so not optimal for leght, but better separation - and still forward enough - yet still reachable if need be too) and a brighter white on a suction cup mount on the read deck (sometimes well aft (if I put it on before launching) - sometimes as far back as I can reach from the cockpit (if put on underway). I also have a set of paired R/G round LEDs with plastic shield on a suction mount I sometimes use that I put all the way up by the bow (but these aren't as bright, and it's harder to see if they go out). All of these stay put rolling (so far) and all also have some sort of tether built in.
I don't see many other night paddlers, but when I do they all too often use some hodgepodge mix of glow sticks (nearly useless), cheap LEDs (in some confusing odd pattern and/or mixed colors), and worst of all - red and/or white bike type strobes. I've also seen blue!
paddling by moored boats
more than once I was asked where I got it since the inflatable dinghies they had used the standard 2Dcell lights from West Marine. They said the lights I had were as good as regular running lights.
Yep, very small boats that go slower…
… than I do in my kayak have them. No one should be assuming anything about size or speed based on the basic three running lights.
Exactly
I use a set of suction-cup mount regulation LED running lights. Got 'em at West Marine. They’re great. I get lots of compliments from power boaters and they all say the same thing: “It makes you look like a power boat”.
'Nuff said.
There’s a problem here.
– Last Updated: Sep-17-08 11:26 PM EST –
It's great to make yourself visible from all directions by whatever means you can think of, but it's even better to simply obey the law, because that's the best way to AVOID GETTING A TICKET. I don't know if law-enforcement is a concern on the coast, but it is on inland waters (and you can meet a game warden anywhere, anytime).
Lacking the ability or ambition to provide a practical means of making your white light visible from from all directions is a really bad reason for adding red and green lights! Adding red and green lights simply to give you 360-degree visibility is not a legal substitute for having a white light, or more than one white light, that is/are visible from all directions. Boating is just like driving, as far as the rules go. Sheriffs and game wardens DO interpret the law exactly as written. If they see your boat and are aware that your white light is not visible from all directions, it won't matter if your red and green lights show up just fine - you WILL get a ticket. That's why I use a pair of white lights when I need to be worried about being seen or when I might not hear approaching powerboats (like when it's choppy). At least one of those lights is always visible from any direction (I also shield them so I myself can't see either one of them. If I could see them, I wouldn't be able to see anything else over the glare).
Oh, I should add that I have no disagreement with the people who say providing lights that make your paddlecraft "look more like a boat" to all the powerboaters out there seems reasonable.
Oh, and for what it's worth, I don't believe that the white-light rule for "vessels under oars" is in place for no reason other than because there was no easy way to rig up colored lights for dinghys. A small motorboat is nothing more than a rowboat with a motor clamped on the back, and red/green-plus-white lights have always been required in that case. Self-contained, battery-powered colored AND white lights have been in use on small motorboats for decades, and could just as well be clamped on the gunnels of a rowboat as any other craft.
There is a difference
– Last Updated: Sep-17-08 11:26 PM EST –
between displaying a constant all round white light (vessel at anchor) and having available a white light to shine only as needed when another vessel is approaching. This is lost on some here I think, but not on the CG. In International or Inland waters governed by the Colregs you would be "out of compliance with a constant white light" unless you were anchored.
If you choose to run constant lights "and" wish to comply with the Colregs, the running lights are currently your only legal option, as outlined in Rule 25.
Again "some" local laws may superceed the Colregs and a prudent mariner (you) should check said laws and comply. Some areas "may" allow for a constant white light by human powered craft, but NOT the Colregs (unless you are at anchor).
Assumptions about speed and size are disingenuous as many small trawlers and sailing craft aren't much faster than a kayak.
A power vessel, commercial or otherwise will probably assume a white light to be a vessel at anchor, whereas they will NOT assume that with running lights.
Ambiguity is only there for those wishing to believe it's there so they can do what they want anyway. In the end, the USCG is a Rules driven operation and the Rules dictate. Whether they choose to mess with a kayaker is any body's guess. Coasties I know will and do check paddlers and expect them to have an all round white light "available" or running lights. If you do not they typically give you a ride to the nearest marina and a warning.