Exactly
I use a set of suction-cup mount regulation LED running lights. Got 'em at West Marine. They’re great. I get lots of compliments from power boaters and they all say the same thing: “It makes you look like a power boat”.
'Nuff said.
There’s a problem here.
– Last Updated: Sep-17-08 11:26 PM EST –
It's great to make yourself visible from all directions by whatever means you can think of, but it's even better to simply obey the law, because that's the best way to AVOID GETTING A TICKET. I don't know if law-enforcement is a concern on the coast, but it is on inland waters (and you can meet a game warden anywhere, anytime).
Lacking the ability or ambition to provide a practical means of making your white light visible from from all directions is a really bad reason for adding red and green lights! Adding red and green lights simply to give you 360-degree visibility is not a legal substitute for having a white light, or more than one white light, that is/are visible from all directions. Boating is just like driving, as far as the rules go. Sheriffs and game wardens DO interpret the law exactly as written. If they see your boat and are aware that your white light is not visible from all directions, it won't matter if your red and green lights show up just fine - you WILL get a ticket. That's why I use a pair of white lights when I need to be worried about being seen or when I might not hear approaching powerboats (like when it's choppy). At least one of those lights is always visible from any direction (I also shield them so I myself can't see either one of them. If I could see them, I wouldn't be able to see anything else over the glare).
Oh, I should add that I have no disagreement with the people who say providing lights that make your paddlecraft "look more like a boat" to all the powerboaters out there seems reasonable.
Oh, and for what it's worth, I don't believe that the white-light rule for "vessels under oars" is in place for no reason other than because there was no easy way to rig up colored lights for dinghys. A small motorboat is nothing more than a rowboat with a motor clamped on the back, and red/green-plus-white lights have always been required in that case. Self-contained, battery-powered colored AND white lights have been in use on small motorboats for decades, and could just as well be clamped on the gunnels of a rowboat as any other craft.
There is a difference
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between displaying a constant all round white light (vessel at anchor) and having available a white light to shine only as needed when another vessel is approaching. This is lost on some here I think, but not on the CG. In International or Inland waters governed by the Colregs you would be "out of compliance with a constant white light" unless you were anchored.
If you choose to run constant lights "and" wish to comply with the Colregs, the running lights are currently your only legal option, as outlined in Rule 25.
Again "some" local laws may superceed the Colregs and a prudent mariner (you) should check said laws and comply. Some areas "may" allow for a constant white light by human powered craft, but NOT the Colregs (unless you are at anchor).
Assumptions about speed and size are disingenuous as many small trawlers and sailing craft aren't much faster than a kayak.
A power vessel, commercial or otherwise will probably assume a white light to be a vessel at anchor, whereas they will NOT assume that with running lights.
Ambiguity is only there for those wishing to believe it's there so they can do what they want anyway. In the end, the USCG is a Rules driven operation and the Rules dictate. Whether they choose to mess with a kayaker is any body's guess. Coasties I know will and do check paddlers and expect them to have an all round white light "available" or running lights. If you do not they typically give you a ride to the nearest marina and a warning.
Then strictly speaking, it would be …
… better from a legal standpoint to paddle in the dark with a white light at the ready than to be constantly visible without red and green lights. As stated in my most-recent post above, I’m all for staying within the law to avoid being ticketed, but I have no qualms about leaving my white lights on when I’m worried about being seen by boats of which I am not yet aware. I know I won’t get a ticket for doing that as it’s already been put to the test. However, as I mentioned in my most recent post above, simply adding red and green lights to supplement your 360-degree visibility WILL earn you a ticket. If you are going to use red and green, you ALSO need a 360-degree white light to be in compliance.
stern white light is not 360
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someone could correct me but I think a 360 with light with red/green is for motoring, the stern white light with red/green is for sailing/rowing/kayaking so there isn't a need to have a 360 white light with red/green runnning. I think putting a white light behind your back should be sufficient and save your night vision from a white light in front,,or on your head.
I just checked, a stern light is 135degree coverage. A 360 white light with running lights isn't mentioned. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.
If you choose
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to run running lights you must do so in accordance with Rule 25 which includes a white stern light! Rule 25 d (ii)...You will not get in trouble for that! Yes, technically speaking you would be out of compliance with a "constant" white... BUT, as I said they may not bug and I'm simply sharing the correct info, NOT judging. Do what you want. I'm explaining the "difference" in an attempt to clarify the difference for readers who may be confused.
Where are you paddling, and who enforces? USCG? If so then the Rules are clear. If some local laws superceed then follow those. All I'm trying to do here is be clear and accurate about what the Rules say specific to kayaks which I have done.
I'm sharing this info not to be superior as some here accuse me, rather to share accurate info from a perspective of a licensed captain with much sea time. Take it, leave it...
Bigger question may be the decision to paddle in the dark in high traffic waters?? Low traffic waters make this a mute point...have a light ready to shine if / when another vessel comes near. Otherwise enjoy the peace and darkness.
No disagreement here
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I wasn't disagreeing with anything you said. I was only thinking about what would be necessary to be operating within the law no matter what system of lights a person happens to choose. I understand what you are saying about lights when at anchor, but I wasn't clear what you said about using a stern white light. One statement seemed to say 360-degree white IS necessary if you use red and green running lights (which was also my interpretation), while the other statment implies it doesn't matter ("you will not get in trouble for that").
In Wisconsin, the lighing rules are the same as they are for a whole bunch of other states. Rules are enforced by local sheriffs and state conservation wardens. In some towns, the local police have a boat and will enforce the rules too (the police in my town used to have a couple of boats, but I don't think they do anymore). See Jasaults' post below for the Pennsylvania rules, which are the same as Wisconsin's and goodness knows how many other states as well.
Finally, you are correct that all this only matters in certain waters. Most of the places I paddle or row, I don't use lights at all, as there's no need.
yep
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and that's the part that never made sense to me,,paddle dark so no one can see you, then start shining a light on your self with your third hand to prevent collision,,giving the other vessel enough time to see your position. It seems to reflect the limited watt/hour capacity of a "torch" than the need to provide constant illumination of ones position as running lights do with a dedicated 50lb lead acid battery driving 15-25 watts of lighting.
Once you drop down to sufficient lumens from .2 watts,,you got the ability to be seen all the time.
where do you get 360?
Since the rules are so poorly written,…
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...I'm putting two and two together, and perhaps the answer is not four because I should be adding something other than two plus two.
Here's my logic, and it may not be correct.
1) There is an emphasis on all-around visibility by means of a white light, and that goes for all boat types. For every type of boat, the one constant is having a white light visible from all directions, or a directional light you can shine where needed (which serves the same purpose) if you are using a boat not required to have full-time lights.
2) There is no mention of exemption of "vessels under oars" from using white light as the primary means of being seen, only that such a light need not be turned on at all times.
3) Therefore, I figure that merely putting red and green lights on your boat would not eliminate the need for a white light as the legal means of marking your location while under way.
Yes, all the different diagrams in various state boating regulations I've seen show red and green lights combined with 360-degree white lights as applied to power boats, but overall, it seems very clear that WHITE is the standard color of light for saying "here I am", meaning that red and green have another purpose (as indicators of direction). As long as the law makes it clear that every kind of boat must be visible from all directions by means of a white light of some kind, why would adding red and green to a non-motorized boat cancel-out that requirement?
Seriously, I'm sure a non-360-degree stern light is fine in a non-powered boat IF you obey that rule about displaying a white light in time to avoid a collision (so maybe when a powerboat is coming at you from the front, it's okay to just bend over against the deck so they can see your stern light).
screw lights
This rule is the best!
Rule 2
Responsibility
(a) Nothing in these Rules shall exonerate any vessel, or the owner, master, or crew thereof, from the consequences of any neglect to comply with these Rules or of the neglect of any precaution which may be required by the ordinary practice of seamen, or by the special circumstances of the case.
(b) In construing and complying with these Rules due regard shall be had to all dangers of navigation and collision and to any special circumstances, including the limitations of the vessels involved, which may make a departure from these Rules necessary to avoid immediate danger.
In a nutshell - your primary concern is avoiding immediate danger. If avoiding immediate danger requires departure from the rules, let it be so.
Actually, not much departure, since:
Rule 25
Sailing Vessels Underway and Vessels Under Oars
…
(d)
(i) A sailing vessel of less than 7 meters in length shall, if practicable, exhibit the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) or (b) of this Rule, but if she does not, she shall have ready at hand an electric torch or lighted lantern showing a white light which shall be exhibited in sufficient time to prevent collision.
(ii) A vessel under oars may exhibit the lights prescribed in this rule for sailing vessels, but if she does not, she shall have ready at hand an electric torch or lighted lantern showing a white light which shall be exhibited in sufficient time to prevent collision.
Since at hand needn’t be taken literally and the sufficient time is not defined, I can pretty much rig a white light on a 3ft extension and argue vessel limitation and safety concerns.
A bit of history - some dude was trying to cross Lake Erie some time ago. Here is his account http://www.seakayakermag.com/1997/aug97/erie.htm
Please follow to the end for the interpretation of his situation.
I think in high traffic areas in urban
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environs one could argue for surinam's point. So many vessels, you are in a constant state of warning.
I doubt seriously the CG is going to get super literal with kayakers, but I know one Eddyline employee who was taken aboard and hauled in by the CG with a warning for not having a light ready to shine.
Another thing to consider is no matter what your lighting, against a heavily lit urban background you will be very hard to see. So many lights it's difficult to interpret things. Many large vessels do not enter busy ports at night for this very reason.
Lights, no lights, whatever, the big question is using good judgement and not willfully putting yourself at risk in high traffic waters at night. Lots of options. And btw, power vessels really do not want to hit you or anything else.. $$$$.
In low traffic areas much of this is irrelevant.
AND, for those intent on constant lighting why would you not use a combi light? You will have to mount your all round white high enough on a post of some sort for it to be "all-round" soooo why not just employ a combi light??? You'd be completely in compliance, would not be blinded by a bright white glow!, and other vessels would actually know your heading, and that you were in motion...
And I disagree that the Rules are poorly written. The more you understand the more they make sense. It's a complex system and what may be stupid to someone with little maritime experience makes perfect sense in the big picture. I believe we as paddlers have a responsibility to be good mariners.
Regarding 135-degree coverage:
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Check that more closely and see if there's an additional white light required in that case. Every diagram I've seen showing 135-degree visibility of the stern light shows an additional white light positioned more forward, which is visible within the "dark area" of the stern light. In other words, there is still a requirement for 360-degree white-light visibility regardless of what amount of coverage any individual white light provides. Any diagram I've seen so far showing the legal use of just ONE white light at the stern shows it to be a 360-degree light. I see no evidence that the rules allow anything less than 360-degree visibility of white lights.
Here’s my version
Accomodates C-light or glo-stick
http://good-times.webshots.com/album/558917191SxHfjK
eel/salty/leeG - thanks
Thanks for the clarification.
I agree completely with this post, Salty
Lighting in higher traffic areas makes some sense and also to follow the rules. However, if people expect someone several feet or several meters above them to see a few pin pricks of light with an urban lightscape all around them they are on quaaludes. Sorry, but if my glass in the wheelhouse is full of 1000 watt high pressure sodium lamps from the local port facility the little Firefly I bought at Kayaks R Us will not register much, LED or not.
The proposed lighting also needs to overcome 2 issues regarding “perception”; 1) you are not “expected” to be out there; and 2) if seen, you may appear to be further away than you really are.
Dogmaticus
were in the same boat of confusion
Seems to me that salty should be able to clarify this. I find that a 360 white coverage is somewhat impractical given the reduction in night vision if it’s deck mounted and inconsistancy of projection if on ones head. I interpreted the same lighting as a sailboat for the reason that a sailboat wouldn’t be as fast as a motorboat, as a kayak would be.
salty
please clarify something. Is there or is there not a required set of options for running lights on a kayak?
Is it a 360white plus red/green or is it 135stern plus red/green? Can it be either one?
Rules are clear on this
A vessel under oars may exibit the same lights prescribed for sailing vessels. Nowhere in the Rule specific to sailing vessels is there mentioned an all round white light option, (unless vessel is at anchor). An all round white in combination with side lights is applied to power vessels less than 12 meters in length per Rule 23 International and Inland.
Above someone posted Rule 25. If you study it it’s clear.
Practically speaking I doubt the Coasties will give a damn if you have an all round white with running lights, and my guess is they would prefer that over just an all round white?? But again, why why why not a simple combi light which solves the whole issue and doesn’t blind you?
When in doubt consult the Rules, and or local laws which may trump the Colregs, and if still in doubt call the local authorities. If USCG jurisdiction they will go by the Colregs and will be very clear on that.
All this lighting is actually a language. If a knowledgeable operator sees an all round white and running lights he/she will assume small power vessel. If they see side lights and stern light, or depending on orientation just stern, or running lights they will assume a sailing craft, or oar powered craft exibiting “their option” of running lights. Which makes more sense… I’d choose the lighting that gives the other guy as much accurate info about me as possible.
Good day.