CL
Here is one i found, its a ways away from me. http://staugustine.craigslist.org/spo/3057125384.html
Here is another I just found.
http://orlando.craigslist.org/boa/3029603542.html
Here is the black water which is the closest to me.
http://tampa.craigslist.org/pnl/boa/3052800276.html
Used Blackwater
That Blackwater is the most recent and last model line which I believe started in 2007 and disco’ed when the Axis came out. I can’t see anything glaring wrong with it. Looks like it worth checking out and decent starting price for that boat, paddle and what looks like a Seals Sneak Sprayskirt. Boat was $750 new.
See if the owner will let you demo it.
Blackwater fine
– Last Updated: Jun-25-12 6:43 PM EST –
It is a popular boat among people I know with your type of paddling in mind. It came in two, maybe 3 sizes as I recall, but I never heard complaints about any of them. I am not sure who said it didn't paddle well - for what you describe I fail to see a problem. I think the person on Craig's list is inflating the boat's interest for advanced paddlers, but then you aren't talking about paddling that demands advanced skills.
Kayak
I vote Vapor wayyyyy over Trophy. Vapor goes faster and has a much better seat, as well as an anchor trolley. No front hatch, but you can’t fit anything in the frint if the Trophy.
black water
– Last Updated: Jun-25-12 11:07 PM EST –
It looks fine in the pics but then again you can never really tell in low quality pics. I sent an email and wouldnt mind trying it out. I dont want something thats slow and hard to paddle, im less than 165 soaking wet and plan on all day outings. Id like to eventually do weekends and camping. (maybe) :)
Edit* I read a few reviews here and there and some said for lighter people its pushes alot of water. Not sure if they improved on that with other models? Does that sound like a good price if its in good condition? I didnt really want a bright red kayak but hey I can get used to it I guess.
Reviews
– Last Updated: Jun-26-12 1:48 AM EST –
You aren't really going to get a fast kayak in the 10-12 foot rec range. If the kayak is reasonably well designed and has a decent paddler then the longer boat is going to be faster and track better.
Also, kayak reviews really are a mixed bag. Almost every rec kayak reviewer loves their boat, can't imagine why anyone would want something bigger/longer/more expensive, and gives it 10 out of 10. Most rec kayakers haven't really been in that many boats. I would look more for the constant trends in the review - stable, weathercocks, turns on a dime. Also different styles of kayaks fit and handle differently for people based on their height and weight.
Just because someone or a bunch of people says a boat is "fast" or "slow" or stable doesn't mean that will be true for you.
At min you need to sit in the cockpit and see how you fit. Do you have some hip contact? Can you brace your thighs comfortably on the thigh rest? Do your feet fit?
Can you get your hips and legs to move the kayak? You can always make a cockpit you are bit small in to fit better with some pads as you get better.
Or you can go the traditional rec kayak position of lying back with your feet out over the deck in which case you don't want any contact with the boat. Of course this is not really the best paddling style, but does work well if you want to drink.
I like the crossover boats since they are a bit narrower then the typical rec boat, the smaller cockpit (but still huge compared to sea kayaks) gives you better control and contact with the kayak, and always nice to have a skeg. Also, you get at least one sealed bulkhead and dry storage.
As for speed most of my friends felt the Blackwater was faster and cruised better then the typical rec boats or SOTs they rented in the past. I have never had any trouble keeping up with a group of rec kayakers -- I am sure someone in 14 footer touring boat or beyond is going to leave me behind if they wanted to.
I think your size is within a range that a Blackwater would fit you and perform well but can't make any promises. The ability to track well does translated into less correctional strokes which does help your overall speed and fatigue. If you try the boat you may want to add some weight and see how that impacts the feel of the boat for you.
I have also read the plowing but that seems to be on the older reviews, I think all rec boats with the rounded bow are going to push a bit of water and not cut it like a sea kayak does. Just the nature of this class of kayaks.
Good price
It seems a fair enough starting price. The owner seemed to hang it out of the sun, so probably in good shape.
Red is an awesome kayak color!!! It is good to be seen on the water.
More re Blackwater
– Last Updated: Jun-26-12 8:11 AM EST –
To some degree, you have to increase your budget, your paddling skills or limit your performance requirements for this next boat. You are saying some things here so far that are contradictory or at least speak to a paddler who is likely to be moving up thru boats beyond this next one. For someone knows how to paddle decently a 12 ft boat is easy to turn, for example. What you seem to have experienced in tracking in a 10.5 ft boat is not comparable to tracking in a longer boat - it is apples and oranges.
ALL boats hit a wall where they will push water - it is a factor of the hull design - and a lighter person in the boat doesn't particularly affect that. It varies between boats - it is around 4.5 kph in my Vela but is much higher in my husband's Aquanaut. It tends to happen at slower speeds in the transitional boats - 12 to 14 feet. And if you haven't noticed it in your present 10.5 ft boat you either haven't been going fast or haven't been paying attention. It happens at quite slow speeds in the pumpkinseeds.
Are you trying to make this next boat a really perfect fit, or something to step thru? If it is the first, I'd suggest that you would be better off expending some money in time with a good outfitter trying out a bunch of boats with someone who knows that they are talking about. Maybe drive a distance for a day of this. Get into a bunch of boats from 12 to 16 or so feet, get a feeling to their fit and how they feel on the water, then decide which way you want to go.
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Its not my 1st kayak but would be my 2nd. My 1st wilderness systems was 12ft. longer than I cared for and also warped which seem to slow it down. I sold it for $150 a couple years ago. I was just wanting to get back into yaking. i dont need or want an expencive boat. I want one thats inexpensive but still fairly good. I dont plan to buy anymore unless its for my gf or kids latter on. Besides i dont have the funds to spend more than about $500 on it, theres more important things i need to take care of. I know im not goin to get the best and fatest boat for that kind of money just something decent, trying to find the best in that range that fits my needs. Your right about most of the reviews tho its still good to read them and get some kind of idea.
Good and decent
These are pretty subjective terms, very very hard for someone to be sure what that would be for you. The best compromise when this is unclear may seem to be a transition boat, like in the 12 - 14 ft length, that can cover a lot of paddling. But that seems to be longer than you want…
Agree on the color
I rarely see those blue kayaks while they are on the water - usually see the yellow or white paddles going up and down.
Suggestion
– Last Updated: Jun-27-12 12:02 PM EST –
My honest and blunt advice is I think for the type of kayaking you said you wanted to do and the hard budget you have that you should buy the used Blackwater. I think you will like it, once you try it. It seems to me to be a fair starting price for the boat if in good condition. Also from years of looking at Craigslist I doubt it will be for sale for long.
In another thread, Waterbird, claimed they have bought used kayaks, just for the paddle, and then resold the boat for the same price they paid for it.
Assuming the boat looks in good shape, you could buy the boat and paddle it for awhile. It is doubtful that a a few weeks or months of paddling is going to decrease the value of the boat -- another scratch won't change anything. If you don't like it then keep the paddle and spray skirt and try to resell it on Craigslist. Give it a good wash, 309 treatment and I would think you should be able to get close to what you paid for and at least get decent paddle and maybe keep the spray skirt (probably 2.2 sized) out of the deal (and maybe have a better idea what you want).
Paddle seems about the right size for you and that boat. I am about 5'8 and use a 230.
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thanks, I may try that. I havent heard back from the people so maybe its sold already. Thanks for the advise everyone. Ill take what you said into consideration for sure. Which ever boat i find ill let you know how it goes and will probably post pics when I get out on it.