Cleveland
My husband grew up in Cleveland and recently returned for a visit. While he was there, he went for a guided daytrip on Lake Erie. The outfitter provided him a CD Scirocco, which is a Hutchinson design. Let me know if you want the name of that outfitter, if you want to paddle that model.
ConnYak
One of the best paddling clubs in the East - maybe anywhere.
A number of members, including the president, read and post here.
changed my mind again
I was looking at the Current Designs website at the Scirocco (?) and it looks like what I think I want. Thanks for the suggestion. So never mind about Prijon or composite… plastic is still an option. I have heard of Fluid Fun, supposedly they have a ton of kayaks to choose from so I might make a trip there and demo as many boats as I can in one day.
I also looked at the Caribou as someone suggested but it looks way too narrow, I think stability might be questionable for me.
I still like the Kodiak or the Seayak if I go with Prijon.
Another comment
I think it is better to cut through the waves than to ride on top of them, isn’t it? I’m talking about for Great Lakes paddling or maybe an occasional coastal trip.
Somebody said if there’s too much buoyancy in the bow, that leaves the midsection in the trough of the wave which is unstable. Did I understand that correctly? So slicing through would be better I think. Would the Scirocco slice through, and how can you tell just by looking?
Even if I do demo some boats at Fluid Fun, I am not going to be on the conditions I’m buying the boat for. So how do you know if it will perform the way you want on big water?
Brian
If you don’t like the Gulfstream,
you won’t like the Sirocco. They are the same boat except the Gulfstream is a composite.
I’ve been paddling my GS for 5 years now and still love it. Not the fastest boat on the water, but I can keep up. Put it in rough water and it really starts to shine.
The boat is fantastic for my needs of playing in the ocean and doing day trips of 10 - 15 NM.
I have camped out of it for a couple of days and found it had plenty of room for that.
I’m still in love with my Gulfstream.
Gulfstream
I just went back to the website to see what you were talking about. I totally missed that the Gulfstream and Scirocco were the same boat except one is composite and the other plastic. Thank you for pointing that out.
demo…
Can’t answer your questoin on slicing through vs. over.
I understand your reservation on demo. I had that very same problem myself when I started out. On a calm day, every boat I tested feels stable as a barge! You really need a rough day to really see the difference between boats. This time of year, the wind is starting to pick up. You might be in luck for some rough days for your demo!
I’ve also done the “stareing at website and catalogues” trying to figure out if a quarter of an inch here and there is going to make a difference. My own expereince taught me that I can’t rely on those numbers. They don’t tell me much! Take the width of the kayak, seems simple, right? Wrong, the widest part of the boat are sometimes at the waist, while for some boats it’s immediately in front of the cockpit. Makes a difference on how two boats of “same width” on paper feels on water! Way too many parameters to work it out in my head. Not to mention most catalogue/websites don’t really give enough details even if I can figure it out.
The best demo I’ve done were those on a windy day, paddling back to back of similar (but different) boats. I started to get an idea what I DON’T like… as pikabike said.
The Scirocco is a little more
buoyant than the Gulfstream because it’s plastic. Therefore it floats a little higher and is a little more prone to being blown by the wind.
The boats both tend to slice through waves and you can usually tell that by seeing how narrow and fine the bow is.
The pro is that by slicing through the waves, you are a little more stable and apt to stay upright.
The con is that the boats are both known as a wet ride.
I frequently get a face and/or chest full of water when launching through big surf unless my timing is perfect and I can miss all of the waves.
The pro to that is that it is a great morning wake-up when the water is cold.
bouyancy
Huh? Since plastic boats weigh more than composite, a plastic boat of the exact same hull design as a composite boat would be “less bouyant” since the reserve bouyancy (from the volume above the waterline) is less.
Caribou stability
Don’t discount it for that reason. I feel half-guilty with mine, like I’m not getting the full kayaking experience because it’s so stable. It’s my first and only hardshell and felt that way from the first paddle.
Mike
nope
unfortunately because one can say one hull shape tends to slice more than rise it doesn’t therefore follow that one is better than the other. That’s like saying “longer waterlines are faster” then leaving it at that. I wouldn’t get to hung up on that,go for the whole picture, not one element.
For example the ArlukIII does both,and it’s garbage with waves from the stern. The Caribou does both and it’s good with waves from the stern. The Gulfstream/Scirocco are 15’ kayaks disquised at 17’ kayaks because of the nature of the ends. The Scirocco and Gulfstream handle differently, the Gulfstreams weathercocking is more mild and responds better with a lean and the skeg,the Scirocco less.
The Scirocco is still a nice/efficient hull shape. What’s your budget and can you roll?
All I can say is:
that when I paddle a Sirocco, the boat is higher on the water and has more freeboard than when I paddle a Gulfstream.
I can’t give you the physics of it, but that is the reality.
why Current Designs?
Is that due to availability? Have you considered other similar kayaks from companies such as Valley, NDK, P&H, Impex, Necky, WS, Borreal, etc.?
For some reason the Great Lakes region has always been a hotbed for Current Designs which is something I can’t particularly understand. I have never been a fan of their kayaks although the Slipstream/Gulfstream is ok and the Caribou is a decent kayak. I personally thought the Scirroco was a bit of a pig on the water and really disliked it. I would recommend trying the Valley kayaks for plastic boats and maybe look at some used NDK boats. Most of the boats in this category are really stable so you just need to try them out.
If you really are hung up on Current Designs, I would highly recommend the Caribou over the Gulfstream. The Caribou (despite being an ugly boat) is relatively quick, stable (probably even more so than the Gulfstream), and it carves beautiful turns.
Even that’s not simple
The Squall I used to own had fine ends for a plastic kayak. Yet it hobbyhorsed in even moderate conditions. Those fine ends did not cut through any water, they still floated and bobbed on top of the waves. I never ever worried about pearling, LOL, but boy did I have to fight to keep it moving forward more than up and down.
Don’t know why that was the case…maybe because the fine ends suddenly widened to a bulging mid-section.
Ugly
Darn, wish I’d known that before I bought mine.
Rolling
No I can’t roll, and in all honesty will probably never be able to because of chronic back problems but I am good at self-rescue using a paddle float or a strap. Should that be a factor in my choices? If so please explain.
About Current Designs, I am not leaning toward them for any particular reason except that they are available around here and I thought might make for easier demo-ing.
I think some of the Boreal kayaks look good but I don’t think I’ve ever seen one around here.
Brian
Me too!
Yes
>>> I’m thinking I’ll get either Prijon plastic or composite.
“Brian, you are on the right track here. Stick with your original thoughts. And test rides of demos are for wimps.” – signed, your conscience.
Huh?
I’ve always thought the Caribou was one of the best looking kayaks on the water.
It also happens to be a very good boat.
lol, sorry if I offended anyone…
and I guess we all have our personal tastes. I think the Anas Acuta and the Betsie Bay kayaks are the nicest looking production boats. Of course true SOF kayaks are nice as well. The Caribou in my eyes is some sort of twisted combination of a Greenland style hull and a pacific northwest style deck. Plus with those hatch straps… shiver. I do give the Caribou some credit as it paddles surprisingly well and even rolls pretty easily. Still, as a fan of British/Greenland style kayaks, I would take even a QCC over the Caribou in the loooks department! 