i’d disagree
keeping your head is certainly a positive, but if you cannot move your fingers there’s little you can do to help yourself. moreover, while you may ‘think’ you are keeping your head, the effects of hypothermia typically result in a depressed ability to think clearly and thus, you may make poor decisions about self rescue while thinking you’re fine.
very old school rule
– Last Updated: Mar-23-05 10:46 AM EST –
here is one for you. 75 degree spring day paddler on pond in canoe has a couple of beers tips and dies in the 50 degree water. This will happen within 100 miles of me this year you can bet on it.
It's the water temp that inhibits swim and self rescue ability.
Some tips for paddlers, Survival hood from rapidstyle, (in my pfd pocket year round, and it is much more comfy than a cap and strap but more expensive,....ain't it the way). If you are planning a self rescue, keep your hands out of the cold water as much as possible.
love that hood
Yep, hood is good. Surprising how much warmth retained by keeping neck warm and the shoulder muscles work better too.
Blues concert
I went to a Blues concert here in annapolis,usually it’s nice and mild but one time it was non-stop drizzle, for HOURS, as we were huddling under ponchos and plastic I pulled out a fuzzy rubber cap out of my pocket and handed it to a friend,normally a person would never wear such a goony thing,but what the heck there were lots weirder things in the audience. She had this Eureka look in her face, “I LIKE this cap”
some more info.
I would say I’m a pretty good swimmer but poor kayaker (hence the name Rookie). The Delaware here is not very wide. Assuming I fell in the middle of the river it would normally take me about 10 minutes I suppose to swim to shore.
Wetsuits
Actually reading your posts I think I will invest in a suit and wait until water temps are over. I am going to have to check the archives as I’m not quite clear on the difference between a drysuit and wetsuit. Thanks for all the posts by the way.
Wetsuits
Actually reading your posts I think I will invest in a suit and wait until water temps are over 50. I am going to have to check the archives as I’m not quite clear on the difference between a drysuit and wetsuit. Thanks for all the posts by the way.
Cold water and paddling on it…
Hi!
I exerpted a short section from Evans’ Post:
“Some college rowers were going by the other day with 32 degree water in shorts and t-shirts, air temps in 40’s. I asked one of them why no protection. One said, dunno, last year they went in and two of them almost died! Hmmmmm?”
Janine’s thoughts: as a canoe/kayaker new to CREW.
Now, I had questioned one of the Persons-in-charge at my Rowing Club, when they had repeatedly remarked that by mid-April we would be able to go out onto the the Hudson, about cold-water suits/gear. (I know that anything under 60F needs extra care, i.e. a wetsuit at least. Around here, water temps don’t become a reasonable 60F until mid to late May.)
The response I got was disturbingly empty of content and really sent up some red flags. However, it’s more from the prospective that OTHER people are potentially being led astray. I would NEVER go out on the Hudson in less than 60F without adequate clothing.
However, it occurred to me that perhaps CREWing is considered ‘different’ in the minds of people who have been doing for awhile. I know I don’t know…you know?
So, now, I’m wondering what’s going on and am put on the spot to confront, as nicely as needed, them about this issue. If it turns out they really do plan to go out, with beginners and young people no less, in less than 60F water WITHOUT proper clothing, I will ardently and loudly counsel whoever will listen that it is a very bad idea - leading by example of course and stay indoors, practicing on the Erg until it warms up.
Crewing is different
In fact I saw the first 8 person shells of the season on the Hudson just last Friday.
My niece rowed in high school, on a pretty competitive group of rowers from Hanover in New Hampshire. There are a few things that you wouldn’t realize unless you had gotten in real close to the situation or rowed yourself.
The first is that, with the oars extended and the boat moving, even a one person shell is impressively stabile. (let alone a four or an 8 man boat) The long oars act as outriggers. There is an older, not racing, one person fiberglass shell where we stay in Friendship each year that I’ve taken out to the mouth of the cove and been fine in up to 2 or so foot swells. (I had to boogie in ahead of a surprise blow one afternoon and things were a little steeper by the time I got to the dock. The boat was still solid though getting docked was a pain.)
Also, they always have a motor boat out, in fact I not infrequently see one motor boat per two sculls in training and competition situations.
As to clothing - when these guys are going full out they are at more risk of passing out from overheating than losing their balance from normal rowing.
That’s not to say that people don’t dump these boats. But that is usually near the dock, with the oars not fully out, with people just learning to row. To be honest I think there was one fatality some years ago, but as I recall it was the above situation combined with the river running at spring strength. The person got swept under a dock or something. The solution to that was not clothing really - they were right near shore - but to not load any boat with beginners on a spring river. For that group, they should have been in a pond somewhere.
To your original question
of not having any thermal protection at all. If you are proficient in self rescues and it is an accidental tip over with no challenging conditions (no strong wind, currents, or waves), then I think anything from 60 degree water and up and you should be ok. Parameters include being healthy, accustomed to water above 60 degrees, no more than a 50 yards from shore, and able to self rescue in under 2 minutes. Anything more than that, or water colder than 60 is foolish to be out in without appropriate thermal protection.
Decent choide, Get a hood too
– Last Updated: Mar-24-05 10:16 PM EST –
you can get one of the strap and cap models from mountain equipment coop of canada for short money, if you cannot handle the rapidstyle survival hood which you will buy after the strap irritates the heck out of you. Get some neo socks too (also cheap from MEC)
50 degree water for a ten minute swim in a farmer john and you will be very unhappy at best but it's better than dead (which might happen). get a boat with floatation and get some self rescue skills. Ten minutes exposure on flat water? You should be able to get yourself out much faster than that. Skills lessons practice etc!
Conditions…
Of course any above endorsement of the motor boat for rescue assumes they have adequate stuff on board for the level of crew in the boat, and I forgot to mention that the cox isn’t rowing so is the fly in the ointment on the thermal issues. From following posts, it looks like a glance inside the motor boat would have also been a good check… sounds like there may often be less emergency resources in in there than would be prudent.
Not just how far from shore
but also how far from warmth and dry clothes! Sure, you can swim to shore in lots of circumstances, but if that shore is a long walk from warmth and dry clothes, you could still be in big trouble.
Its in the Bill Mason books
I have heard it as both 100 and 120, but one of them is in Path of the Paddle and Song of the Paddle.
the difference
between wetsuit and drysuit, in short: A wetsuit is generally what you see a diver wearing - a form-fitting neoprene suit - though ones designed for paddling are cut differently to accomodate more movement. A drysuit is essentially a Gore-Tex coverall (or similar material) with latex gaskets around the neck, wrists and ankles. Though greatly simplified, that’s the difference.
cold water
Anyone ever hear about acclimating your self to the cold. I have read about it and it is just that going out in the cold and just getting used to it. I do it when I run. I don’t wear anything but shorts and a tee unless its is under 30 and when it gets around 10 I put on a thin sweat shirt under 0 I wear a light hat a and gloves which then have to take off after about 15 min. Each time I get done I am sweating so I have to believe what I have read about acclimation to the cold and I would imagine that it would work for water also to some degree (no pun intented)
For my type
paddling, close to river banks and out in the woods. I use a wet suit , carry xtra dry clothes (including socks,boots and coat), tinder for fire starting and a trusted companion.
My running threshhold
for shorts and a T-shirt is more like 40. But I have a postman who has acclimated to the cold so successfully that he rarely wears a coat, and is often in short sleeves when most people are in coats.
Joints work better
when warmed. Beleive this and you’ll be happy when you get older.
OTOH Sanjay just wrote about the idea of water acclimation and that is lasts for up to a year.
I’ll stick to immersion protection gear.
Acclimatizing to the cold AIR…
Well, I run in NB running pants and a T-shirt with a thin windbreaker in Rain/snow in Winter…
I love running in Fall/Winter/Spring, I don’t overheat… 
I have taken to putting the shower on cold (50-55F?) toward the end, feels good, too. However, I don’t want to find myself fully emersed in 35F water!
Does this count as acclimatized?