Yes, Grasse River is still turning out canoes.
Try J&J Canoe www.jjcanoe.com
They are a Grasse River dealer.
Of the three boats you added to your list, the Hemlock is the only one that comes stock with a bench seat, which most folks seem to prefer for kneeling. If you are looking at the Voyager, Wenonah will sell you one with a fixed bench seat, but I'd recommend against it. Being able to adjust the trim is very helpful, and kneeling with the pedestal-mounted tractor seat isn't that difficult, just different.
One other thought - you could consider coming to the Raystown Rendezvous in Pennsylvania the second weekend in October. There will be a nice selection of solo canoes there that you would be able to test paddle. It's a bit early to know exactly what boats are going to be there this year, but you can keep an eye on the Raystown thread on the "Getting Together" forum to see what is going to show up.
My impressions of Voyager vs Magic: I’m 5’6" and 150 lbs and test paddled both the Voyager and Magic as well as my Sawyer Summersong, one after the other, a couple weeks ago at Rutabega in Madison, WI. in mostly calm conditions and mostly flat water, so I don’t know how’d they handle in lumpy water or wind. The Rutabega staff advised me that the Magic handles better than the Voyager in wind and rough water because of it’s differential rocker.
MY OBSERVATIONS: I paddle sitting and I liked the feel of the Voyager the best. With the tumble home and deep sides, I can use the gunwales as knee braces. I used my Zaveral bent shaft in all three boats and the Voyager was noticeably faster, felt more stable than the Summersong and as stable (or more stable) as the Magic. The Voyager was faster than the other two and also MORE maneuverable than the other two. The Summersong turned faster than the Magic. I was applying as much lean as was comfortable while turning all boats. I felt most comfortable leaning the Voyager. I didn’t feel the magic of the Magic, but I guess I’d need to try it in rougher water and compare it to the Voyager in those conditions to verify what the Rutabega folks told me.
Turning the Magic I actually find my Magic very easy to turn. I kneel in it and just lean it a little bit for a tight turn. It responds very nicely to leaned turns and is plenty stable for doing this even with my sixty pound dog in the boat with me.
In rough water, it’s all about power and control. The larger the boat, the more surface area in contact with the water and greater frictional resistance to overcome. The larger the boat, the more above-water surface area in contact with wind and so windage resistance becomes a problem for both directional control and forward progress. Sea kayaks minimize both problems by being narrow and small … and have a lower center of gravity due to a low seating position. They also have double bladed benefits for directional control and bracing. They also allow for great body english (hip snap reactions, thigh leverage against the hull, instant feedback from wave motions, etc.). A solo canoe is at a disadvantage in all of these physical and ergonomic factors … the facts fairly obvious!
That’s not to say they’re not great on many types of water (river and lake expeditions for instance) … but when it comes to really rough and unpredictable ocean conditions, the solo canoeist is definitely more vulnerable because of all of the above … AND has no roll up capability to easily right himself if accidentally capsized by rogue waves or circumstances beyond his control (shit happens!).
I think a large and efficient canoe/rowboat with two rowers (or one rower and one stern paddler) CAN handle rough water because they have more power and leverage and thus can provide for enough propulsion and directional control to stay out of trouble while making long distance progress. Even a solo rower in an efficient boat does pretty well in the sea (except that his vision is most often backward looking).
But I think the bottom line is that a single blade paddler in a solo canoe will always be only marginally effective unless he has great strength, experience and a superb boat with rudder control to help him overcome the inherent limitations of his chosen mode of travel. Kruger had all of those capabilities (along with phenomenal courage and willpower) and so was tremendously successful and lived to tell about it.
the review Perhaps I didn’t read the review closely enough once it got published, but I don’t remember any consensus in the test paddling group on the best day boat. I know that each of us in the group had different opinions on which boat we’d choose for ourselves.
My opinion was that the Rob Roy was best used as a day boat or as a light tourer, but I know of two or three folks who own them who say they have done more than than with theirs. It’s certainly a competent design, which is no surprise considering who designed it (Dave Yost).
If I remember correctly, the Rob Roy is the only one of the four than anyone has ever set up with a seat that allows both sitting and kneeling - I think Chad19 did that with his, but I don’t remember how happy he was with the results.
Rob Roy I wouldn’t recommend a Rob Roy for rough water unless you put a spray cover on it. It tends to slice through waves rather than riding over them and could be a pretty wet ride in choppy seas. It is, as others have said a good day boat or light tripper in protected waters or mild rivers. I paddled mine with a double paddle and it was quite fast when paddled that way. It did have a tendency to turn into the wind a bit, but it wasn’t severe. I sold the boat because even after modifications to the seat and backrest I found it to be uncomfortable after a few hours.
An OC-1 is the only canoe meant to be paddled on the ocean, outpace seakayaks, and handle truly big waters.
Although a highly skilled paddler might paddle one of the boats mentioned above, you'll be using a suboptimal equipment for the water you have mentioned.
Screw the ballast, learn to J-lean If your reflexes are good you shouldn’t have to worry about flipping in a Wildfire or any similar boat.
Stay on your knees even when you paddle switch.
If you just have to sit, figure out thigh hooks like in a kayak.
I paddle a Swift Osprey and it has good speed and IMO is better than the Wildfire in whitewater. I don’t know that it’s any faster than the Wildfire though and it is asymetrical. I think you may find fast and symetrical don’t come in the same boat.
If I wanted a super fast boat with some stability I’d look for a Wenonah Voyager.
I don’t understand what you mean. When I hear “OC-1,” I think of a short, rockered, Royalex whitewater boat, which is presumably not what you mean. What are some example boats?
Probably also the lightest!!! I was told that they now have their SpitFire listed at 20# down to 13#. Assume similar weight reductions on the 15' RapidFire.
I just bought a RapidFire last week and have been training on it every day since. I have the high seat. I took it out on a big lake to test wind and wave stability. I was impressed under both conditions, so much that I wish the seat was higher! It passes through waves easily and hardly wobbles. Experimenting with a short shaft single blade, I could hold a fast very straight track using hardly any "J" correction, without need for hit-and-switch. Because of the unexpected stability and performance with single blade (which I prefer over double), I'm looking for ways to elevate the seat another inch or two.
With LPB's new vacuum process Joe told me the weight is down to around 28 pounds including seat. Joe also showed me a prototype of a fore and aft spray cover that will slip on in a flash. Based on how well I like my home-made Hornbeck cover, I told him to send me one for the RapidFire as soon as it comes off the line.
I doubt it It didn’t seem that impressive to me when I paddled it. Yes, it was efficient, and yes, the quality was superb. But was it efficient enough to hang with the fast boats? It sure didn’t feel like it. However, this is a pre-coffee post, and I don’t think the seat-of-my-pants speedometer was particularly well calibrated that day, so perhaps I’m just being cantakerous and contrary. T’wouldn’t be the first time. Now where are those darn coffee beans . . .
RapidFire with high seat If you don’t mind my asking, how big are you? When Charlie Wilson heard that I am six feet tall, he said there was no way I could balance the RapidFire. I weigh 200 pounds, though he said that didn’t make a difference.
RapidFire high seat I’m 6’, 185 pounds. Charlie did not mention any particular stability problem I might have, though he did say most people by far go for the low seat. After paddling many hundreds of miles in a Hornbeck, I wanted to get up off the bottom in this much faster boat. It’s very stable for me, even in large powerboat generated waves. When I turn fast and sharp, I can easily heel it over almost to the gunwale and it does not threaten to dump me. It paddles with a single blade nicely… I’d like to get up even higher to make that easier as I prefer the stroke variety and maneuverablity of single blade over double.
Same for my RapidFire. I originally ordered it with a high seat, but after many conversations with Charlie and Joe and a visit to the shop we all decided it best for the structure and for balance to go with the pedestal seat. I weigh over 210. I put a 4" thick boat cushion on top of the pedestal seat to try it out with higher seat. I quickly removed it. Even with all my years paddling everything and white water experience too, it was too tippy to consider for more that a short paddle. Will probably try again sometime, but am basically very satisfied with my RapidFire seat on the hull bottom…