Wave heights at sea
With sufficient fetch on the open ocean a 50 knot winds will produce a 20 foot wave in 6 hours. If the wind persists for 2 days it can produce waves of close to 50 feet.
Celia , I have “0” time in a yak …
– Last Updated: Aug-28-08 3:16 PM EST –
...... all my paddling time has been in canoes .
And that has always been predictable weather and water conditions that where within a canoes ability .
I think a specialized yak can have a tad bit more ability in rougher waters and/or windy conditions , but nothing so drastically different than a canoe .
I've been in (some) bad waters , I've been in nice waters .
I've been in storms , I've been in golden pond .
I don't believe a kayaker can handle bad water and storm conditions for any period of duration , simply because of the physics and dynamics of the situation .
Then again , what you may deem high challenge water conditions , and rightfully so for a kayak , I probably consider just a bit of rough water , no big deal .
A paddle craft such as a sea type kayak (like you see in the vids. on you tube) , with it's length , pencil point and spray skirt , is no more than what it is .
That's not much in terms of bad water under heavy storm conditions . I've yet to see any kayak in what I would consider "bad water" , dangerous conditions !!
Although , salty did describe what I believe was an incredible account , and I believed every word he said because he told it like it is .
Heck , it dosen't have to be at sea on the open ocean . I'm just talking about "bad water" , anywhere it shows up .
In my examples given , I stated the bay was only 5-6 miles wide there . I said , "you won't be there , I guarantee it" . (talking about in kayak)
Show me different if you can .
I've seen plenty of vids. with kayakers in somewhat rough waters , but nothing that has struck me as serious .
Show me ..... and I'll admit I believed inncorrectly .
I've seen kayakers "playing" in the surf with big foam , all that looks very predictable and the "out" looks to be readily at hand always .
Go ahead , show me what you think I don't know or understand . I've yet to see it , and I do believe there is the one in a million that is possible , so that's about it . Show me the paddler taking on the storm in a kayak , and you will make a believer out of me !! Even if it is the one in a million .
If it's just a bit of choppy water on the swells in some wind , well that's not a storm of much consideration ...
most I’ve seen
– Last Updated: Aug-28-08 3:51 PM EST –
Surfski folks in the Pacific 15 miles offshore tackling 20'-25' seas with winds in the 30-40 knot range is probably the toughest conditions I've known people to tackle, but that's with a support boat and also more importantly not a storm.
Belief not at issue
Just a question of your own experience re kayaks. You answered it.
Celia , I don’t need any experience …
… in a kayak to reasonably know where it’s limitations are . It’s just a small , very low powered craft . No more , no less .
Extremely limited in terms of storms and bad waters …
Beam Me Up Scotty …
“I’ve never paddled a kayak, never been in one, don’t have any experience but I’ll tell you what they can and can’t do.”
I read it differentyly maybe
– Last Updated: Aug-28-08 11:14 PM EST –
I think Pwings would have full respect for Flatpick. I think he's raising a legit question. How much sea can a fit skilled paddler really endure? Probably not that much in true storm at Sea standards! A uber-fit human is insignificant in seas that can tear a ship to pieces etc...
Haven't read every post, just responded authentically to what I regarded as a legit and interesting question.
At Sea, I am, and will always be, a mere fledgling.
That’s an exaggeration
Maybe 25 knots sustained, gusting 30+, and 10-12 foot combined seas, maybe a little more. That’s a week plus of unusually strong trades. Definitely serious water, but beyond Force 6 doesn’t happen much, and when it does you’re not going to find a lot of surfskis out.
you know it (NM)
rather large very sea worthy
vessels are sunk as a result of storms on a relativly frequent basis—I’ve been paddling quite a while and I recognize that a sea kayak and paddler, even a fit skillful one, has limitations significantly less than say, the Edmund Fitzgerald and her crew or some other like ship. I think we all realize that
The key to safety in a small human powered boat has three componants–judgement, physical and mental skill and luck—if you don’t have the first two you need a lot of the third. I’m gong paddling now for the next three days—have a great labor day weekend every body!!!
The internet is full
of very authoritative commentary from well meaning folk who have limited experience / knowledge in the areas of which they are on-line authorities! To single this guy out on this site for such is funny, though I see your point Seadart…
I read his stuff differently as I hear him saying any small human powered craft is limited in a true storm, be that a kayak, raft whatever.
Some footage
– Last Updated: Aug-29-08 5:57 PM EST –
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vesgFkgP0Oo&feature=related
What may be of interest to some here is the fact that Nigel Dennis has been a coxswain on a British Motor Lifeboat for many years. I think he'd concur there have been a few times he was glad he was in a MLB rather than his kayak! Pic of similar vessel below.
http://www.whitby-yorkshire.co.uk/lifeboat/lifeboat_trentclasslifeboat.jpg
The first video highlights USCG 44's, a 52, and the new 47' MLB's. Awesome vessels. Check out the 47 pulling a floater off the lip then going 90 degrees! The plume is the exhaust blowing water. Below is the Canadian version of the US 47 licensed to be built by Metalcraft. It has Cat engines rather than Detroits and weighs about 4k lbs more than the US version built by Textron. It's also painted.
These replaced the venerable but slow displacement hulled 44's. These 47's self right faster and can cruise at 25 knots Vs 10 in a WOT 44. Very amazing craft.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d68qkS0ETss&feature=related
Cool stuff
Big surf is just a different world. I don’t know–and don’t really want to know–how much wind it takes offshore to generate breaking crests with as much power as even middling surf.