BCU != seakayaking
"I have never seen or heard of a BCU organized race/skills competition, or BCU studies/info on physical training and nutrition"
On P.NET people seem to think BCU is equivalent with sea kayaking. A good deal of members of BCU clubs would cringe at this impression. BCU is primarily not about sea kayaking. You’ll have no trouble finding UK paddlers who think BCU is just about racing: http://www.worldclass-canoeing.org.uk
/Peter
Price structure
"I haven’t seen a price structure"
As far as I can tell, the BCU doesn’t require people to charge for instruction, etc.
Individual schools and instructures charge what they want.
Rolling
– Last Updated: Mar-20-07 12:02 PM EST –
I suspect rolling isn't emphasized because teaching it is "inefficient". That is, it can require a fair amount of time and one-on-one instruction.
The BCU also does a fair amount of white water stuff (in the UK at least). The preference of the Euro paddle and non-extended paddle rolls may come from this.
I have no problem with people using Greenland paddles (I use one) and I have no problems with people learning various rolls. But an extended paddle roll isn't (typically) necessary and is less effective as a recovery than a roll where the paddle remains "ready for action".
I do think the BCU should be more open to Greenland paddles.
Not convenient.
Alaska or BC isn’t exactly convenient for the masses that live in the contiguous US.
Different strokes
"Wasn’t the reason you started paddling more about adventure and discovery than about technical accomplishment?"
People have a wide range of goals for their pursuits. I have no problem with that.
At the core, the point of the BCU (or ACA) is to develop skills to support the “adventure and discovery” stuff.
Describe the BCUNA structure
Slightly off T, but maybe OK as it will add context to the topic. Anyone care to describe the BCUNA structure. The syllabuses for the certifications are on the web site, which is very helpful. Other than that, perhaps describe;
Meetings or symposiums with coaches in prep for assessments. How does that work? (I understand that’s optional.) Approx. cost?
Approx. cost for assessments?
Anything else helpful to know?
I’m not trying to say it should be free. I’m just asking, on cost, as it’s information.
Great topic. Something I’ve wanted to know more about.
Paul S.
we’re cool
– Last Updated: Mar-20-07 12:33 PM EST –
While responses from those unfamiliar or only vaguely aware of BCUNA are probably the most valuable. I was thinking that providing info/links in reponse to those who need or request might be valuable.
I was also thinking that the experiences and observations of those of us who have only recent (less than 4 years) experience might contextualize the overall responses.
I'm a long term ACA member who became acquainted with the BCU through a training session arranged by a friend.
Get the rope!
Just kidding. If we all had the same point of view then only one of us would need to post in the first place.
I think it’s an AND situation. One can go for instruction and assessment in skills AND go for adventure.
I think satisfaction and pride in accomplishment is good, including in passing an assessment, if that’s one’s desire.
Paul S.
It would seem the US-UK gap…
… has only been crossed by sea kayaking/kayakers so far…
All BCU chatter I see here is about sea kayaking.
More competitive angles of BCU may not sell here, as “British” would automatically be a competitor…
"ready for action"
Combat position certainly advantageous (not disagreeing), particularly for speed/technique benefits, but may still be a bit euro centric thinking, no? Another crossover from WW paddling - where having a lot of paddle on one side and none on the other could introduce other problems? Potential rock/bottom interactions require more defensive postures and encourage quickness.
For sea kayaking, outside surf/rock, there’s more room and time. I don’t see a problem with extension - besides maybe over reliance on the easiest roll - but out of the pool, whatever works.
It’s not like someone has to stop what they’re doing, extended, stop again, and retract using some slow complicated sequence. Hands can slide quickly, without losing grip. Extended roll need not take longer, and difference if any isn’t much more than a second or two if you consciously slow it down. An extended blade on roll recovery can be brought back to combat grip during the recovery, while moving right into the next stroke or brace move.
Extension can be a soothly integrated part of stroke/brace roll motions. With EP there may be some increased chance to get tripped up/loose blade orientation (round shaft/feather issues). Maybe not optimal with euro, but with GP? It was designed for this. Shuttling hands around, upright or inverted, should be second nature.
My Impression of BCU = Salt Water
I’m an inland kayaker, in Wisconsin. Been in the sport for 4 or 5 years and do day paddles and overnights.
My impression of BCU is that it is an organization for Open Water paddlers, probably Salt Water but possibly the Apostle Islands of Lake Superior.
My impression is that it is a group for people who want to develop a set of skills that allow them to paddle in open water conditions, probably including chart and compass navigation and significant open water crossings.
I get that impression from the Web, from 3 trips to Canoecopia, three or four trips to the Midwest Mountianeering Expo’s.
It’s not based on facts, but it’s my impression.
In other words, I don’t think the group is a match for the type of paddling I do. I respect them, but have no reason to join them.
My goal for the summer is a 120 mile camping paddle on the Mississippi River. I could improve my skills with a class, but am not likely to look at BCU for courses, they would probably be the place to go for a course on rolls. Half the rivers I paddle are too shallow to roll in.
Paul
Yeah…
Washington coast as well…all the North. Plenty of BIG water!
Not long ago was sharing ass kicking stories with several commercial fisherman pals in Anacortes, Wa., at the pub. We concluded that anywhere with a name that started with “Cape” was worth fearing, and that one could toss a dart at any chart between Anacortes and Dutch Harbor etc., and if it landed on blue paper, someon’e had their ass kicked there! Big, big water… Lot’s of good reading about CG rescues etc…
And that’s great!
Never seen one worn/displayed
– Last Updated: Mar-20-07 2:27 PM EST –
No one I've seen, paddled with , took instruction from, etc.. wears her or his BCU badges.
When I received my first, I niavely asked what was the usual and was told putting it in a drawer.
RE reverse figure 8s: The reverse figure of 8 is an exercise to hone backwards paddling skills. I was the person in the water in Naragansett Bay who was rescued by expert backwards paddling of a 5* trained BCU paddler. I've also found controlled backwards paddling important in the rocks and ledges.
Prep for assessments etc
– Last Updated: Mar-20-07 2:45 PM EST –
As said in another post, in the UK a great deal of what has been mentioned here is actually well incorporated in the club system. So it's already there, so to speak. If anyone ever did Pony Club, a holdover from a more Brit system of learning to ride and school horses, it'd probably ring a bell.
The BCU handbook, supplemented by information from sites like those listed above and cue cards you can get for the strokes, tells you what has to happen. The syllabus for each star assessment is available from AKT - I think it is downloadable from their site under the section on BCU North America.
A paddler can take all this information and work entirely on their own to prep, then contact a coach for an assessment when they feel ready, or take training from a BCU coach as part of their prep. Both training and assessment can be found by attending the major symposiums, finding a coach or a BCU-oriented major center within reach and asking if they have something coming up, private lessons - whatever works for the paddler. Most people find that they do the best with taking a full training to start, going home and practicing, then doing a tune-up just before assessment.
There is also stuff like navigation and knots that come up as you move higher thru the levels, much of which can be done by pulling the requirements from the materials and working on your own.
The cost of passing an assessment is pretty inexpensive, a failure doesn't cost, so the major expense is the coach's time for training. As with the ACA, individual rates will vary.
We were lucky - we had a level 3 coach who lived locally who we reached out to. He was able to put together a group of four of us for training and assessment and run things at larger lakes within a reasonable drive.
Holes in a drytop?
I can’t imagine what that’d look like, or that it’d be a good idea. I have a few Half Century badges from the bike hanging around as well as the BCU stuff - have never been inclined to put any of this on a garment.
Celia. . .Your Prep for assessments
Is exactly what I was looking for. It explains the BCU training in a way that can be understood. I now know the procedures for get training, how to go about getting it, where to look for it and what can be expected when being trained.
BCU guys . . . would it that hard to place this type of explanation on your site. It sure would clearify it for us outsiders who know nothing about the BCU.
Thanks Celia, that helps a bunch
The BCU…
I took their classes in Feb down in Florida. I never really heard of the BCU before this. I have had classes and believe in instruction. Most ski areas will have an assessment done before you enter a class so you are of equal skills with the people in the same class. This wasn’t done down there.
I didn’t have a clue that hand position, paddle position, etc, etc was going to play in the assessment either.
To make a long saga short, I just wish the instructor would have just said, “you didn’t pass.” He didn’t. He ripped apart everything I did…didn’t have a forward stroke, didn’t know how to edge, couldn’t turn the kayak,…but! For a mere $60 I could join the BCU and for $20 administrative fees, I could get a 2 star beginners rating!
Two days later I was on the Suwannee River and 7 days,218 miles down stream, I was in the Gulf of Mexico. Beginners luck I guess.
I joined the ACA…still don’t have a clue about them either. I’ll just keep doing what I’m doing…that is paddling 700-1000 miles a year and hope someday I can meet that instructor on the right river at the right time so he can show me how to use his elite forward stroke and deluxe edging to keep up with me in an amatuer race.
it’s called feedback
The coach wasn’t ripping you apart, he was giving you feedback. Without getting too technical… paddle position, hand position, etc are important for efficient paddling. You weren’t being scolded for not having an ‘elite’ forward stroke… you were getting tips on how to make your forward stroke better. And he wasn’t trying to make you perform ‘deluxe’ edging, he was suggesting that you use edging.
The BCU star assessment criteria are readily available on the website so you shouldn’t be surprised by what is on the assessment.
If you are a great paddler then it IS the smaller details that you should work on to improve your paddling. Just like if you are a skier and you spend hours on a bunny slope getting feedback that you ski upright, need to bend your knees, or move your hands more then maybe you could open your mind take the suggestions.
I am not saying this without knowing a bit about the situation. I heard you rant for about 20 minutes about the coaches and the whole assessment process. Try to open your mind to other peoples input. Your last statement you made before getting in your car was scary… ‘I am done with the BCU and going to give the ACA a shot. If they don’t pass me then I am done with them too.’
BTW… an average of just over 31 miles a day for 7 days is decent. Decent, but not exceptional since the Suwannee River does most of the work.
I think I have figured it out
BCU does not teach. They only test. You have to go else where for the instruction and then go to them for approval. Correct?