@paddletothesea said:
I still see people, even instructors using a bent shaft paddle backwards. WTF!
When I was down at the beach I would often see SUP paddlers with the paddle backwards. They seemed to manage without my help.
@paddletothesea said:
I still see people, even instructors using a bent shaft paddle backwards. WTF!
You thought they were instructors.
@pblanc said:
Well, at least leading a group of newbie paddlers on a trip is not as tough as what these guys do:
I once paddled forth
in a flock of Duckheads.
Talk about herding cats!
Feathered blades to gale wind,
some reversed in rescind.
I think it was madness ersatz.
I see quite a few people with outfitter gear that inevitably use a bent shaft paddle backwards. I usually say something to them. I’m surprised the outfitters don’t at least mention in passing how to hold it, after they’ve probably upsold them on it in the first place.
When I was buying my second bent shaft canoe paddle for my then wife, I held it in my hands backwards. The sales person pointed out to me I was holding it backwards. I had been holding my own bent shaft backwards for months. It seemed right to me until I read more about them and learned why they are meant to be held a certain way. Subsequently every time I’ve brought a new paddler along in my canoe, they initially hold it backwards until i point it out to them.
I’d probably be one of those that used a bent shaft canoe paddle backwards seeing as I’ve never paddled with one, Definately wouldn’t be opposed if they made “the flats” more palitable. In general I tend to like gear that I can toss around a bit
This happens in the bicycle world a lot. A new guy joined us for a group ride some time back. He was really strong but he had some technique issues and technical issues. My buddy tried to advise him (diplomatically) about his technical issue. I don’t think he wanted to hear it. He didn’t show up for any more rides. Strong body but Dunning-Kruger mind.
So we attempt to make their experience more enjoyable by mentoring them to a higher level. But they didn’t ask for it.
I think the original question remains, " why care so much"?
If they’re having a good time , fine let 'em have at it.
Beginners seem to almost always try a bent shaft canoe paddle backwards; I think it’s because it looks more natural that way like the blade will act like a scoop.
One of the dangers of using a bent shaft backwards is that in a moving boat it’s easy to accidentally jam the paddle against the boat…resulting in a sharp u turn and a wet paddler.
I think that using the bent shaft canoe paddle is confusing to those who have never used them because the principle is the reverse of the euro kayak paddle. Kayak paddlers do most of their forward stroke in front of their hip while canoe paddler do more behind their hip. The curved 'yak blade gives more push early in the stroke while the angled canoe blade gives more late in the stroke.
@harry0244 said:
I think that using the bent shaft canoe paddle is confusing to those who have never used them because the principle is the reverse of the euro kayak paddle. Kayak paddlers do most of their forward stroke in front of their hip while canoe paddler do more behind their hip. The curved 'yak blade gives more push early in the stroke while the angled canoe blade gives more late in the stroke.
Actually, the bent-shaft canoe paddle acts to keep the blade vertical in the water during a greater portion of the stroke, no matter what. The upper hand will naturally reach farther forward than the lower hand during most of the stroke if the upper arm is fairly straight, which it needs to be to minimize the required effort (try letting your upper arm bend at the elbow to make the top grip stay directly above the blade during the whole stroke and you’ll see what I mean, and this is even very pronounced if you end the stroke as far forward as your knee). The resulting tilt of the paddle (as seen from the side) is corrected by the angled attachment of the blade. Bent-shaft paddlers, and especially racers, end their stroke quite far forward compared to those with a more lazy stroke, but still benefit from the blade being more perpendicular to the intended direction of thrust with a bent-shaft.
For what it’s worth, back when I first started solo canoeing and used a Werner Camano, I noticed that with the curved blade it was exceptionally easy to make a clean entry. It took no skill at all for the entry to be virtually perfect. And I think a “scoop” action is the intention in that case, rather than blade alignment. Consider the fact that the blades of may racing sculls have a similar curved shape. They do make curved-blade canoe paddles too, both straight-shaft and bent-shaft, again suggesting an entirely different purpose for the curve than for the angled mount.
When I instruct (advise?) noobs on using a bent paddle, I have found that it gets the point across well and is remembered when I tell them to think “broom” instead of “hoe”. That skips all the science and logic and associates it with something familiar.
@Guideboatguy said:
@harry0244 said:
I think that using the bent shaft canoe paddle is confusing to those who have never used them because the principle is the reverse of the euro kayak paddle. Kayak paddlers do most of their forward stroke in front of their hip while canoe paddler do more behind their hip. The curved 'yak blade gives more push early in the stroke while the angled canoe blade gives more late in the stroke.Actually, the bent-shaft canoe paddle acts to keep the blade vertical in the water during a greater portion of the stroke, no matter what. The upper hand will naturally reach farther forward than the lower hand during most of the stroke if the upper arm is fairly straight, which it needs to be to minimize the required effort (try letting your upper arm bend at the elbow to make the top grip stay directly above the blade during the whole stroke and you’ll see what I mean, and this is even very pronounced if you end the stroke as far forward as your knee). The resulting tilt of the paddle (as seen from the side) is corrected by the angled attachment of the blade. Bent-shaft paddlers, and especially racers, end their stroke quite far forward compared to those with a more lazy stroke, but still benefit from the blade being more perpendicular to the intended direction of thrust with a bent-shaft.
For what it’s worth, back when I first started solo canoeing and used a Werner Camano, I noticed that with the curved blade it was exceptionally easy to make a clean entry. It took no skill at all for the entry to be virtually perfect. And I think a “scoop” action is the intention in that case, rather than blade alignment. Consider the fact that the blades of may racing sculls have a similar curved shape. They do make curved-blade canoe paddles too, both straight-shaft and bent-shaft, again suggesting an entirely different purpose for the curve than for the angled mount.
When I bought my first curved blade double paddle, I noticed more pull earlier in the stroke, but your explanation makes a lot of sense too. I guess I fell into the trap of not looking further when I had one answer. Thanks for the insight.
@harry0244 said:
Kayak paddlers do most of their forward stroke in front of their hip while canoe paddler do more behind their hip.
Actually, the power phase of a canoe stroke is done in front of the hips as well. The paddle may travel behind the hips for the correction, but the power is in the front. GBG does a good job explaining how the bent-shaft canoe paddle keeps the blade vertical during a greater portion of the stroke.
Canoe racers, use a short rapid stroke as eckilson said. Kayakers use a similar stroke however high angle kayak paddlers often carry it farther aft. Its a personal preference thing often driven by the length of the paddle.
@harry0244 said:
I think that using the bent shaft canoe paddle is confusing to those who have never used them because the principle is the reverse of the euro kayak paddle. Kayak paddlers do most of their forward stroke in front of their hip while canoe paddler do more behind their hip. The curved 'yak blade gives more push early in the stroke while the angled canoe blade gives more late in the stroke
The proper canoe stroke ends in front of the hip
Cab forward minimizes the need for correction
It’s a common beginners error to carry the stroke in back of the hip
Bent shaft are intended to provide the most vertical exit from the water to avoid lifting water and inducing boat bob