“call the bluff”
“The fact that I called that bluff seems to
have pissed some of you off - so be it.”
The bluff is you never taken a high speed defensive driving instruction and you’re putting other road users in danger by shunning instructions!
Until you do, you’re just one of those same “newbie”. Only you spend hundreds of hours driving and they spend a few tens of hours in kayaks.
BS
What was I ignorant about? That there are driving schools that are hundreds of miles from me in Nebraska or Iowa that I am not aware of? You don’t know that. Nor do you know what I know. Come on.
actually I have
now what …?
From a fluffy lady
I am what you would call fluffy. I never paddled a day on the river in my life until I went on the Schuylkill River Sojurn last month. I paddled for 7 days, over 100 miles. It can be done. I was tired, but I made it. As for instruction, the other Sojurners were more than happy to help. I am glad that they were not elitist exersnobs like the OP.
Elitist exersnobs
Elitist exersnobs - I love it! Congrats on the sojourn!
gnatcatcher
just another bluff
.
Just another red herring
Stick to paddling - it’s not a motorsports forum.
I don’t have to prove my on track racing skills to you.
You think too highly of yourself
no one is pissed off, just disgusted by your arrogance.
The reason nubiles shun technique is
that they believe, with their form, they don’t need technique.
Think about it.
Looking at it like B.F. Skinner, I’m
reluctant to blame the pigeons. If a pigeon (newbie) doesn’t look for a training program, or looks but passes on it, or attends but falls asleep, don’t blame the pigeon. If I’m convinced that training pigeons is vitally important, it’s my job to get them in the Skinner box, to select a desirable reward pellet, and to deliver pellets in a way that promotes efficient learning.
If I think training is important for skillful and effective paddling, I have to find a way to get newbies into instruction, regardless of their inclinations or disinterest. There’s no point in my getting worked up because the least skilled paddlers are (presumably) the most in need of training.
There might be great benefit from putting all parents through child-rearing training. And, there might be great controversy, because there’s considerable disagreement on what is good child-rearing. I used to teach it.
So asking why the pigeons won’t line up for training is interesting, maybe. But Skinner would say, don’t ask. Set up the incentives and the conditions and tweak until you get the results you want.
I tend to look at the dilemna
as you don’t know you need to know until you know just enough to know you don’t know enough.
Left alone we probably would attempt the skill of driving in the same way.
got anything besides catchphrases?
what are you going on about now?
It’s pretty simple willi: you judged a group of people just because they’re unlike you. You could have just left it at “I think new paddlers should take instruction”. But you didn’t.
skinner would say that
…and so would any instructor or paddler who is more interested in growing the sport than in looking down on other paddlers.
read what you wrote dude
There ARE courses available, you don’t have to take a state-certified course. So you’re wrong about that.
Furthermore, the courses are not designed for closed-course high speed driving. Those may be the conditions they take place in but remember the idea is to determine how to respond in an emergency. Yes, most of these companies also offer race training.
If BS was too harsh let’s just say you applied the same ignorance that many here apply on a blanket level to “newbie” kayakers. Well not everyone wants to pay extra to know how to react when your car loses control, and that’s a much more common activity in most people’s lives than kayaking, or canoeing, or paddling, or whatever I’m permitted to call it.
If I’m 65 years old and my drive consists of a mile-long trip each way to the train station, why do I need to pay extra for driver training?
I think you need to read what I wrote
You are attributing positions to me that I did not express. But I am tired of arguing with you and putting up with your insults. Read your own posts. Can’t you discuss an issue without name calling?
Nice
Nicely done
well that’s just not true doctor
– Last Updated: Jul-06-12 4:08 PM EST –
what names?
I live in Michigan
Posted by: Dr_Disco on Jul-03-12 12:33 PM (EST)
and you can only take such a course if you are "eligible", which means you already have points on your driving record but aren't being prosecuted.(1) I have never had any points on my driving record. The only option is a course designed for high speed driving on a closed course (2). I am not interested in that.
(1) No, you CAN take such a course, from a private instructor.
(2) No, there are plenty of course options.
Tell me how I attributed these positions to you wrongly? And tell me how calling your post "ignorant" or "nonsense" is name-calling? Your attitude to the analogy was to toss it out based on false info. Is that not what the OP is accusing "newbies" of?
If you're going to evade your own previous posts, you've no right to hide behind false accusations like "name calling".
Check out the model railroad forums
"This thread and a few others; in particular related to paddleboards, has lowered my opinion of paddlers as a group who I always thought were pretty laid back and accepting."
I read threads like this on other forums for other activities. The rock climbers have the most unspoken rules of conduct and absolutely condemn beginners. So far, paddlers are a bit less elitist.
It’s surprising but Pilots can be pretty negative towards beginners too.
But those model railroad guys; people who play with toy trains; they are by far the nicest I’ve seen. They don’t car what you do as long as your having fun. Of course no one has been run over, fallen off, or otherwise been harmed by their model railroad. Maybe the perceived danger of an activity affects the elitism and condemnation of beginners. Rock climbing has little room for error and you can’t just swim to shore if you get dumped out of your metaphorical boat.
Read stuff on the internet for long enough and you will find that people at parties and other social settings must be holding back a lot of negativity. I think that in person, people actually fear getting punched int he nose if they start an argument like the one in this thread.
Dave
oh but you weren’t paddling
you were splashing. and “god forbid he should give you a tip and you should listen”.