303 Aerospace Protectant on Jackson Journey 14...did I scratch the finish?

Advice
#21

Well…I was loading the Kayak on top of my Darby top loader. I have no problems doing this even with a heavier Kayak as I am a strong guy…and as I was holding it up to put on the top mount (which sits on top of a Toyota Tacoma Pickup truck )…someone decided to try and help out without asking or letting me know he was even there and grabbed the back and yanked up on the rear of the Kayak and pulled it around really hard and fast …I guess he was going to hurry and swing that end over to the rear mount on the back of the truck…and this caused the Kayak to slip out of my hands from a very high height my arms were pretty much stretched all the way up and the Kayak twisted and fell on hard rocks on the bottom hull kinda to the side area…again I was not expecting it so it was very awkward. It was loud…I mean LOUD. Now the whole entire side (at least they are right below water level) not only has scratches but pretty gnarly gashes all along it.

Obviously these Jackson Journey’s with their linear Polyethylene materials are tough as heck because I was certain this thing was cracked in half by the sound of it.

That is not what upsets me though…I strained a ligament in my right forearm really bad from the twist and now have my arm wrapped in an ice pack. It hurts extremely bad and Doctor’s will not give me anything for pain…I had to go to the ER it hurt so bad I thought it was torn.

A’hole could have given me a warning he was going to run up and push the rear end up high and move my Kayak around I mean I had no idea what the hell had happened I thought maybe a vehicle had run into the Kayak or something…again really fast without me seeing him or knowing he was going to do this let me know first!!!

I have my own way of loading my Kayak and it works!! Leave me alone if I need you’re help I’ll f’ing ask!!

#22

@Guideboatguy said:

  1. There’s a guy here with the screen name Magooch who will say that he takes great care not to scratch his boats. On some of my boats, I bet I’m just as careful as he is, but I still get a few scratches and I bet that he does too. When it happens, it happens. That’s life. A boat that doesn’t have any scratches has never given anyone any fun, because all it has ever done is sit on the boat rack in the garage. You may cringe a little each time you scratch it (and hopefully not so much once you’ve been using it a while), but you can still have fun along the way. Just remember you won’t ever have any fun at all if you do what it really takes to never, ever scratch the boat.

Indeed I do take special care to keep from damaging any of my boats and yes in spite of that I have had to make some gelcoat repairs. I also almost exclusively paddle where there is much less chance of scrapping the bottom. The waters around here are very deep with mostly sandy beaches and sandy bottoms. In the winters I do paddle in a shallower lake but still it has not been a problem.

Some might believe that caring for something like a kayak is a fetish of some type, but that’s the way I am; I just like taking care of my stuff. My view is that someone took a lot of pride in designing and building a beautiful piece of work and I will do my best to keep it nice. That might come from my own background of building things for myself and others that I hope will be used, but not abused.

I can assure you that my boats are probably used more than most since I am retired and have lots of time to spend on the water. As a matter of fact, today is my 74th birthday and unless something comes up, I’ll be out there.

#23

Some of the care is simple precaution. Where I now live, there are no sandy beaches, and usually no beach, period. It is concrete ramp and side path, or rocks, or dirt with a few clumps of grass/weeds.

The plastic WW kayak I just shoulder and put on whatever surface it is, but I don’t drag it.

The glass sea kayak is too heavy for me to shoulder-carry anymore. When preparing to unload and launch, I do the following in the parking lot:

  1. Put two old foam blocks on the ground next to the trailer.
  2. Lift kayak and place it on the foams.
  3. Attach a Quantum stern cart under the stern,
  4. Remove the sternmost foam and put it in the cockpit.
  5. Pick up the bow and start rolling the kayak by pushing it (I find it easier to push and steer rather than pull).
  6. While holding the bow up and rolling, grab the bow foam and carry it.
  7. Roll the kayak to the concrete sidewalk next to the ramp, stern toward the water.
  8. There, put the foams under the bow and stern again and remove the portage cart.
  9. Walk the cart back to the truck, then return to the kayak.
  10. Next, shift the foams under the kayak and toward the water, then stand straddling the boat and move it to match the new foam locations. After a few shifts, the stern is floating in shallow water.
  11. Toss the now-unladen stern foam in the cockpit.
  12. Pick up the bow and slide the entire boat into the water, grabbing the other foam on the way.
  13. Store both foams in the bow hatch.
  14. Get in the kayak and start paddling!

Use a similar procedure when taking out. This way, the kayak stays off concrete the entire time. If I put it down on concrete while I am there, that is hardly a disaster, but I don’t trust passers-by not to bump/drag the kayak when I’m not right there.

It’s a lot of steps, but it means no carrying heavy boats, no risk of dropping, no dragging/scratching, and it is easy to do solo.

#24

@SilentWaters said:
I have my own way of loading my Kayak and it works!! Leave me alone. If I need your help I’ll ask!!

I’m also a big guy and I always load my 17’10" fiberglass Assateague by myself from the side of my GMC Canyon into J-cradles. It involves doing something of a “clean-and-jerk” to get it up to my arm’s full extension and then tilt it a bit into one cradle then the other. I have it well practiced and can do it in all but the strongest of winds. I had a similar situation when someone thought they’d be “helping” by lifting one end of the kayak while I was in the middle. I was tilting the boat higher on the back end to get it into the rear cradle. Unknown to me at the time this person was lifting the front, counteracting my tilt to the rear. It didn’t take long to figure it out and I politely but urgently asked them to STOP and let me do it. It doesn’t take a physicist to figure out that when I’m holding the boat at the centre of gravity you aren’t going to help by taking one end!

Nowadays I just make sure there’s no one nearby and I do it nice and quick. Anyone I’ve paddled with knows that I’ll ask for help if I need it. Most people either aren’t tall enough or aren’t strong enough to help get my boat onto my my truck anyway.

I’ll need a revised system some day, and likely a lighter boat as well. But as long as I can do it this way I will.

Fortunately for you, SW, your boat is built to bounce much better than my boat would have in the same situation. Polyethylene is a tough, tough material that can take a real beating. It’s probably the biggest advantage to this material.

Take it easy while your hand heals and rather than get pissed off at those people that exhibit misplaced courtesy*, try to anticipate situations like this and have a plan to avoid problems.

  • Misplaced courtesy: My classic example is where you have a four lane road and someone leaves a gap in front of them with the intention to let someone make a left turn through the gap. What they don’t consider is that they’ve just created an insanely dangerous situation for anyone flying down the lane next to them. This unsuspecting person will slam right into the foolish person that actually turns through the opening blindly because they can’t see traffic beyond the opening. I’m sure you can think of other situations where the motive is good but the action has potentially nasty consequences.
#25

We can talk. I often post here about ways to reduce the effort of getting boats, even very heavy boats, onto and off of car roofs with no more effort than necessary. The fact is, even the majority of very experience paddlers have never tried to find easier ways of boat loading, and are confused when they see it done. When I load a canoe or guide-boat onto my roof, I slide it on from the rear of the car. If I load these boats with help from another person, I use the same method and for the same reason (it eliminates the need for overhead lifting), but whenever another person offers to help, and they haven’t ever helped ME at least a few times before, once we start sliding the boat forward, they react by immediately lifting the free end of the boat as high as they possibly can, and predictably, the other end of the boat simply slams down into the roof of the car. That’s when I want to say, “sheesh, what else could you have expected to happen when you did that?”, but I always bite my tongue instead. Usually I can thwart their efforts in time to prevent another impact against my car’s roof because I’m already thinking ahead about the fact that they are not thinking at all. Still, it’s an unavoidable fact that every other paddler who helps me for the first (or second or third) time thinks they need to lift their end of the boat as high as they can and as soon as they can, apparently because the only method they’ve ever used in their entire life requires both people to simultaneously lift as high as they can. It’s the fact that they are totally on autopilot that bugs me. Autopilot? Damned right. Even as they watch the other end of the boat slam down on the roof and get stuck behind the forward cross bar, they think the solution is to lift the free end of the boat even harder and higher. So yeah, I’m usually happy to load my own boats. It saves me from needing to explain to anyone what happens to the other end of a teeter-totter.

#26

Sorry to hear you got hurt. I often have similar problems when I am loading my kayaks and people (always men) come up without asking me and try to grab the boat to “help”. I’m very experienced at solo-loading my own boats and all of them are under 45 pounds anyway. Whatever their motives are I DO NOT NEED HELP! I have thought of getting a tee-shirt printed with that on it. Like you I’ve had these “helpers” cause me to lose control of the boat and cause it to crash to the ground and also to scratch my car. I wish people would ask first. How hard is it to say “Do you need help with that?” And then to LISTEN when I say “thanks, but no.”

#27

@pikabike said:
Some of the care is simple precaution. Where I now live, there are no sandy beaches, and usually no beach, period. It is concrete ramp and side path, or rocks, or dirt with a few clumps of grass/weeds.

The plastic WW kayak I just shoulder and put on whatever surface it is, but I don’t drag it.

The glass sea kayak is too heavy for me to shoulder-carry anymore. When preparing to unload and launch, I do the following in the parking lot:

14 steps later…

It’s a lot of steps…<

Ya think so??? This strikes me as a case of “the OCD leading the OCD”. :wink:

I understand the need for using a cart for transport, but the dance with the foam blocks seems like a waste of time. As you’ve said, the boat is going to get scratched, but you’re not dragging it around, so why worry about protecting it from a surface that you’re just setting it on? You’ve always struck me as being pretty pragmatic, so doesn’t it seem a bit silly?

For the original poster, the fact that your boat took an unfortunate tumble is probably a good thing, since you won’t be worrying about it so much now. Polyethylene is durable in the respect that it doesn’t crack from impacts (as you’ve seen), but that’s because it’s relatively soft and flexible. Frankly, it scratches if you look at it hard; you can easily scratch it with your thumbnail. When it gets run over rocks, shells or barnacles, it will get deep scratches and gouges; that’s just the nature of the material. If you try to keep it looking pristine, you will drive yourself off the deep end, as there is very little you can do to prevent or repair damage if you’re actually going to use the boat.

Composite boats are harder and less prone to scratching, and they can be brought back to near-new condition if you’re so inclined. You can see how I did this for fun on the deck (only) of a boat that I bought a few years ago.

briannystrom.com/kayaking/tutorials/gelcoat-restoration/

It’s not something that I would do again and I would never waste my time doing this on a hull, as I use my boats for playing in surf and rock gardens, and “leaving offerings to the gelcoat gods” on various surfaces is a regular occurrence.

A scratched kayak is a happy kayak !

#28

I said I do not drag it. If the kayak is going to sit on a concrete path next to a boat ramp while I bring the cart back to the truck, it’s going on foam blocks. Way too likely another boater or a frikken loose dog will bump it. The memory of a kid starting to drag my husband’s kayak on the beach isn’t forgotten. We caught him early, and at least that was on coarse sand rather than concrete, but it is appalling what some people will do with other people’s stuff. The father just stood there smiling his approval at the kid!

The boat gets scratched from being paddled, fact of life. I don’t care to add more scratches while it is stationary or being transported.

#29

Oh…I’m far over worrying about scratching up my kayak…I just want my arm to heal so I can get back to Kayaking! It’s a strained ligament alright…I would have been better off just breaking my arm as those heal much quicker. This reminds me of the time I strained one of my rotator cuffs…took Months to heal and that was with therapy. I do not think this will be as bad I’ll just keep icing it off and on. I can’t take anti-inflammatory’s as they do nothing for me besides make my stomach hurt but there is no bruising or swelling anymore so that is a good sign. The Doctor had me pull hard as I could against him and even though it was painful I managed to pull him into the wall,lol…so no tear just a strain. Took an X-ray as if that is going to tell me anything. If it gets worse or does not get better in a Week or so I will demand an MRI.
I might ask the Doctor if I can get one of those really tight forearm support wraps to wear…then I could at least get out there and just do some light paddling on calm days like we are having right now. I just do not know why nobody gets pain meds anymore because those first couple of days I could not sleep from the pain…I mean what does one have to do to get pain meds from doctors these days?
…does not matter now as it only hurts if I try picking anything kinda heavy up or lay on it the wrong way…or…insert joke I know many are thinking it. :wink:

#30

Sounds like it’s a good time to focus on biking or hiking until your forearm is fully certified for paddling by your doctor.

I’ve also had people approach me out of nowhere and offer help when I am loading a solo canoe; it’s funny how many folks have had this happen. I also can’t believe how often I pull up to a nice deserted put-in and then before I can even unload and launch (takes 2-3 minutes max) someone else decides to pull up right next to me and start unloading their stuff…so the dog comes unglued and a peaceful launch gets complicated.

#31

@SilentWaters said:
Oh…I’m far over worrying about scratching up my kayak…I just want my arm to heal so I can get back to Kayaking! It’s a strained ligament alright…I would have been better off just breaking my arm as those heal much quicker. This reminds me of the time I strained one of my rotator cuffs…took Months to heal and that was with therapy. I do not think this will be as bad I’ll just keep icing it off and on. I can’t take anti-inflammatory’s as they do nothing for me besides make my stomach hurt but there is no bruising or swelling anymore so that is a good sign. The Doctor had me pull hard as I could against him and even though it was painful I managed to pull him into the wall,lol…so no tear just a strain. Took an X-ray as if that is going to tell me anything. If it gets worse or does not get better in a Week or so I will demand an MRI.
I might ask the Doctor if I can get one of those really tight forearm support wraps to wear…then I could at least get out there and just do some light paddling on calm days like we are having right now. I just do not know why nobody gets pain meds anymore because those first couple of days I could not sleep from the pain…I mean what does one have to do to get pain meds from doctors these days?
…does not matter now as it only hurts if I try picking anything kinda heavy up or lay on it the wrong way…or…insert joke I know many are thinking it. :wink:

My forearm gave me fits for years. As long as I strapped it tightly just below my elbow I could paddle. Icing it after helps.

#32

Good luck with that injury. With luck, the worst will be over soon and then you can resume with easy levels of activity, easy enough that they don’t aggravate the problem.

I’ve found that in getting older, a few of what I thought were normal injuries actually turned out to be symptoms of my body starting on its way to being worn-out.

#33

Well I am in my 38 years young and feel like I am still in my 20’s. :slight_smile: I also come off younger and not just in appearance but in the way I act. I still love video games I have a PS4 and an Xbox One…but more than anything I love getting out to just enjoy this wonderful life we have been given that many have taken for granted. I do not smoke nor drink. I used to get prescribed pain meds for my back but chose the gym instead of these pills that can be so addicting…so no drugs as well. The gym and now Kayaking the open waters is my drug. :slight_smile: Indoors video games and movies…I mean what’s not to love.
I broke my back when I was 16 as a supercross racer so that is what got me started with the weight lifting…seriously weight lifting is what really keeps my back pain away or to where it hardly bothers me.

Awesome news…2 nights ago I decided to go to the gym and sort of “rehab” my forearm with light weight curls and forearm exercises. It actually felt really good on my forearm in some odd reason. This morning I woke up and oh my God my forearm pain is next to nothing now…it is just one small spot that feels like a mild bruise but it is definitely healing and apparently I did not injure my forearm nearly as much as I thought.

I will still take it easy regardless and the weather has been horrible lately here for kayaking anyway and this whole Week the weather looks like it is going to be raining.

Thanks again.

#34

303 may get rid of very light scratches, but it’s main job is to act as sunscreen on plastic and fiberglass. A scratch, big or small simply means you’ve been using and enjoying your kayak.

#35

@Oregonpaddler said:
303 may get rid of very light scratches, but it’s main job is to act as sunscreen on plastic and fiberglass. A scratch, big or small simply means you’ve been using and enjoying your kayak.

Trust me…I am so over having scratches on my Kayak as many have accumulated from usage. :slight_smile: I still use this stuff however…still looks awesome and shiny…I just use a small amount and make sure to rub it in really good.

#36

I recently started using 303 on a few Royalex canoes I have been refurbishing. I noticed that after being in the water for a while, there is a dusty, whitish film left on the hull now, which requires copious re-application of 303 to remove. Curious as to the chemical properties of 303, I downloaded the MSDS (Manufacturer’s Safety Data Sheet) which states that 303 is between 75% and 100% water with the remaining ingredients ‘proprietary’. Now I have used Armorall protectant on vehicles since it first came out, and if I compare 303 with Armorall, it looks, smells and feels the same to me (Armorall being a slightly stronger solution, though). If anyone can offer any evidence that 303 isn’t just silicone and water, I’d be all ears, otherwise I think I will go with the less expensive Armorall from now on.

#37

I am fairly obsessive about finishes on my cars and other toys, but not the boat. I do consider the surface of the boat to be akin to bottom of shoes or tire tread. They are work surfaces. I have no idea how you can avoid the contact between hull and unknown objects in the water, specifically when entering or exiting. While I would not drag the boat over concrete too much for fear of functional damage, sand, rocks, driftwood, garbage, etc are unavoidable.
Of course the fact that I bought an old well used boat helps me to feel no cognitive dissonance that I’d feel while chipping a new car, I can see how it can be different with a new shiny and expensive toy. For that reason alone, I would probably stick to used boats. Or make it a point to not baby it in the first while of it’s life, only watching out for functional/structural damage