This Mariner kayak is too big for me, but for a bigger, rough water afficianado, this could be a rare opportunity for your “dreamboat.” Rare for a Mariner kayak to show on the east coast classifieds:
I guess even as the numbers of boutique/specialty builders diminish, future generations of Paddlers, with interest and intention, will still have opportunity to paddle high performance kayaks. Our current generation of paddlers (myself included) are aging out and passing on. We are just custodians/stewards for the kayaks that we can not take with us (unless one wants a “Viking” send off…).
There are myriad reasons why businesses don’t make it. But, blabbing about used boats for sale, boasting about how little you pay for used boats, bragging about how many used boats you bought, advising others to buy used boats isn’t really helpful to boat builders trying to sell new boats and struggling to stay in business.
I disagree as some one who has bought used and new kayaks and waveskis. Yes, builders can close for a number of reasons but the availability of preowned crafts of their line in the market is HIGHLY unlikely a contributing reason.
Personally, I owned 3 used Islander before being ready to commit myself (to the sport) and ordering 4 customed islander waveskis to my size and specifications, followed by a custom Infinity waveski.
No way would I have ordered a customed Sterling ProgressIon until I became more committed to longboat surfing with a preowned Delphin 150 and a Stratos 14s. Probably why I didn’t order a new Mariner early on (with my more limited economic means then).
Won’t even try to count how many preowned touring sea kayaks I owned before buying a new Impex Montauk.
Don’t even need to get Into my white water and fishing boats…
The used market is, in my opinion, crucial to introducing folks into the sport, hopefully good equipment, and then into buying a new craft of their “dreams.”
Ah, yes. All are online retailers that spend an enormous amount of time and resources educating their customer base. Hosting Youtube channels that have online tutorials on the use and installation, providing technical support before and after the sale. Having worked with and for Guillemot/CLC. I know firsthand the investment in all of the supporting documentation that goes along with those items purchased online. All are very specialized in what they offer and online or phone order is the only way to obtain the items you want. The difference in the big online vendors and the ones quoted, you can pick up the phone or drop and email to get a response from either the maker of the item or the person who did all of the “creation” of that item. Nick just concluded a video series for building a Petrel Play. Hundreds and hundreds of hours spent in order to help drive sales on kits and educate builders. The amortization of that investment of time will take years to get back in terms of dollars.
I do stand by my assertion and even I fall into the category of being trained.
People live in houses with families, trucks people use more than a kayak in most cases. People that want to buy 5, 6, 7, 8,000 dollar kayaks are very limited.
GM doesn’t ship cars till they are paid for. I won’t ship kayaks until they are paid for.
CD got out now it’s buy direct when you order one I believe.
I was going to buy a Seaward Passat G3 they wanted paid for it but couldn’t ship it in 90 days. 90 days is past credit card claims. I got cold feet and cancelled the order. Puff 6 + months later they’re gone. Not saying they wouldn’t have done the right thing but I wasn’t going to risk it.
Business is rough I had a masonry company so you bid the job go work at it bill them for what you did to that point and get paid 30 days later if not longer.
I got beat out of about 15 grand in 40+ years. If a company didn’t have an excellent reputation I wouldn’t work for them. Easy to get hammered by rotten people. You’re honest but that doesn’t mean others are.
I did find one “solution” to my inability to find a Mariner Coaster. There is a builder in Italy that offers one with hatches/options though it is expensive to ship/crate up. But still - if you are willing to take a chance - the cost of a new one will still be under $4000. Here is a link:
Pretty cool IF permission was secured from the Broze brothers. Brian Schultz/Cape Falcon SOF got permission with his F1 (Coaster inspired SOF). I think for a short while Seaward Kayaks produced some of the Mariner Designs.
Dan C has built multiple craft for me over the years - he ranks as one of the better builders in the USA IMHO. I contacted him some time back about building a CLC Petrel Play and he mentioned that it had a few tricky parts to the build. (as a first boat to build) I lack that ability - so getting a wood PP would have only happened if someone did it for me.
Unsure about any permission regarding copyright on that score. The pictures sure make it look nice though and they can customize layups, finishes, keelstrips, etc. I think they were asking 1700 Euros to build a crate and ship it to SC. Of course, that doesn’t cover any cost coming through Customs.
He has a limited market with his products and overran it. JMHO. He had a big corporate job lined up the story keeps changing. Can’t find his last video on YouTube where he said he was coming back. Guess it may have changed up again.
@PaddleDog52 I don’t [think I] know you and I don’t think I fully understand the “inside baseball” aspect of all of this…and I know you have been supportive of me…, but I know Joey and I have a solid insight to his heart and his best intentions. Please give him some space to explain his story. You might take inspiration from it. The last thing he wanted to do was to “sell out to a big corporate job.” His passion was to build high-quality, hand-crafted, USA kayaks and make a living out of it. Things change. Life happens. The market changes. We all must adapt and find a way to move forward on a path that we might not have anticipated. If he was struggling to make a comfortable living out of hand-crafting outstanding kayaks one-at-a time, who of us should judge him for using his skills to earn a more commensurate wage to support himself and his wife and family for doing essentially the same work? If you could do your current job at a different place for, say, 10%, 30%, 50%, or 100% more money and not worry about any employees, dealing with directly with customers or worrying about overall profitability, wouldn’t you take a moment to contemplate and reconsider what you are doing and why you are doing it?
No I will never tell the whole story on this. Because, in the end, there are many reasons that I am exiting the business and will never even entertain the thought of getting back in.
TPBW/TPK is dead. The company that was interested in buying the company forwarded an offer that would have me personally financing it and shouldering almost all risk. That’s not going to happen, I’ve been burned too many times in this business. Let me make this COMPLETELY CLEAR. Since the offer to buy was ridiculous and I declined, the molds will be destroyed sometime next month. There will be no speculation about where the molds are. The designs are intellectual property of Nick Schade, he and I have decided the best way to ensure his designs are safe is to cut up the molds.
Now that I don’t have a company to protect, my filter is now gone. Paddledog, you seem to thrive on gossip and other people’s difficulties. “Corporate gig”? Again spouting off about something you know little about. I’ve put on a a happy face and endured your repeated attempts to rile me up on YouTube and here. Not anymore. You can speculate all you want, I am working alongside the owner of a shop that builds Class II APBA race-boats for clients that have very deep pockets. I was offered the job because he saw value in my particular skillset and is paying me accordingly. I have full benefits and am appreciated for my work ethic. For the first time in years, I can take time off. I don’t get texts from customers at 10pm on a Sunday. I don’t have to worry about employees or timelines. I did it for me, my family, my daughter. If you have something snarky to say, do yourself and everyone else here a favor and just keep quiet. I’ve watched you troll anyone trying to do good in this community. You ordered a paddle from someone I know, paid for expedited shipping and then trashed their reputation on Facebook because USPS failed to deliver in an expedited fashion. The seller did everything they said they would, USPS dropped the ball and you took it out on a small business from the anonymity of a keyboard. You have trolled Adventure Otaku, spouting they you did not think he was qualified or skilled enough to be an instructor. Who the hell are you to judge anyone? Brett is contributing something to the community, what is your contribution?
Sorry folks if this comes off as hateful or mean-spirited. I’ve played the nice guy in the face of constant prodding and negativity for too long.
