Avocet RM -- T165 RM

The basic specs on both these boats are similar. I noticed that the top views of these boats show that they do differ quit a bit. Also I assume that the rocker varies. The Advocet has the most beam forward of the cockpit while the T165 places it more at the hips. Pros – cons on this?

Would anyone who has paddled both these boats please comment on the performances differences?

I also remember reading on a post that the there were performance differences between the RM version and composite version of the Advocet. Does anyone know anything about these?


both nice
I own an older Avocet RM and have paddled the T165 a few times. The Avocet feels looser and easier to manuever, while the Tempest tracks better and feels a bit faster. Both feel good on edge, and both are easy to roll. You can’t go far wrong with either one – it’s figuring out which better suits your personality and your goals

The Avocet & I are old friends by now, but I’m always happy to grab a T165 for a while if I see one at a demo day. I wouldn’t sell my Avocet to buy a T165, but if I was buying a new boat it’d be a serious contender.

Cash or plastic
The triple layer plastic on the British Valley Avocet R< is absolutely the best. Stiff and light.

You mean only one
person on this whole net has paddled both these boats?? I did find out that the deck on the poly Avocet is supposedly lower than on the composite. Does anyone know if this is true?


Sea Kayaker

– Last Updated: Mar-26-07 7:13 PM EST –

I believe it was a poly Avocet that Sea Kayaker tested. They measured the fore deck at the coaming to be 11" and rear to be 7.5" (SK measures inside from floor of boat to bottom of coaming)

RM Smaller
I don’t know about current production, but when I was looking at them closely a year or two ago the RM was overall and especially in the cockpit area smaller that the composite. Evident when side by side.

willeyboy, what is your size/wgt
I’ve been considering both for my wife as I’m told these boats may fit a smaller lighter woman.

According to the specs the Advocet is same in depth whether rm or not.

Its my understanding as mentioned in above post that the advocet is a looser, more playful boat that the T165.

I’m hoping to get my wife into a demo T165 and CD squamish in the near future as she needs the stability that I dont believe the advocet will give her over the t165 & squamish.

I hope you get some more responses here, I’d be interested in reading them myself.

good luck


I’ve paddled them both
I rented a glass Avocet and own a roto T165.

They have different feels for sure, though size is similar. Obviously, I preferred the T but I like both. In a nutshell, I thought the Avocet was a bit more maneuverable, while the T tracks a bit stronger. I did not like the minimal thigh braces of the Avocet I rented, though they were adequate. I’d say the Avocet had a little lower primary stability. Not enough for me to call it tippy–just a little less than in the T165. But keep in mind I am small and light, and few boats have felt tippy to me.

I am very happy with my T165.

Demo both, and do it with some wind and waves if you can.

i have an avocet RM
and went straight from a 15ft SOT to the avocet and never felt it to be tippy. i mostly paddle in the ocean (i live in santa cruz, ca.) i do feel that the bumpier the water gets, the more fun the boat is. it is less “fun” for me in totally flat water. i am 5’5" and about 130#, if that helps.

I’m on the smaller side
5’8" and 145 pounds. I’m looking for a boat that would be more fun for playing around in than my QCC 700. She’s a great boat for me for camping and doing the Apostle Islands in but I want something to help build my skills in and playing around in.

Similar to what I’ve heard…
Your pretty close to my size. Most boats are just to roomy for me and to bouyant for me to just “hook into” like the bigger guys do. (5’8" and 145 lbs)

why you picked the 700 and not the 600

You might try a Romany. It is lower volume than an Avocet and even more playful.

IMHO, there is no better boat for skills work than a Romany.

QCC talked me into it

– Last Updated: Mar-27-07 11:55 AM EST –

Originally when I called QCC it was to order a 600. Phil said that a lot more people lighter than me (then 10 lbs heavier) like 'em better than the 600. I was mainly looking for a camping boat for on the Mississippi and Minnesota rivers. It wasn't till a couple of years ago that I got into Apostoles on Lake Superior. From the first paddle with it I never once regretted not getting the 600. For my light weight it's got a lot more rocker than most people think. You can spin around pretty quick with it on edge. My biggest problem is with weather cocking when it's not loaded with gear. The rudder solves this problem easily but really stiffens up the boat when its deployed.

Volume comparison
Just curious. What are the volumes of the Avocet and Romany?

Good question…
that would be interesting to know. The hull design of these two boats differ though.

i have paddled both…owned a t165 for
awhile and now have a 170 in glass…

loved it…

tried out a avocet…seemed flatter…i was quite uncomfortable (born with arthritis in my legs so i am picky aboutt he leg configurations)…

i was only in the avocet in flat water…

just overall liked the 165 more…more stable and def. more comfortable



the widest part of the T-165 is NOT at the hips but at the knee are. It is slight fishform.


Facts? We don’t need no facts!
Stop confusing us with data. Perceptions are so much more comforting to our opinions.

BTW, is a boat fish or swede form when the greatest width at the gunwales is before or aft of the length midpoint, when the greatest width at the designed displacement waterline is before or aft of length midpoint, when the midpoint of the displaced volume is before or aft of the length midpoint, or when the total volume midpoint is before or aft of the length midpoint?

Seems each might result in different behavior in the water assuming there is any perceivable difference between fish and swede form kayaks for most paddlers.