Beach Architecture

Paddlers' Place
#1

How do you feel about “Beach Architecture”? I’m thinking about driftwood structures that are built by paddlers for their use and left in place upon their departure. Maybe a simple wind break on a wilderness beach, or a seating area, benches and table, maybe a pole with a rope to string a tarp over upon your arrival. I’m not talking about a flat tent-sized area that is cleared in the forest above the Spring Tide line but actual, physical infrastructure constructed by someone to accommodate their trip and left in place to maybe be reused by others and maybe not.

What do you feel about “Leave no trace” ethics and how do these structures fit in to those ethics?

http://3meterswell.blogspot.com

#2

I think I would be grateful if I was looking for a place as long as it wasn’t an eyesore. My concern is that some pig would use it and leave pig trash around it.

#3

I’m against it. When I visit a place with no obvious sign that another person has been there for a long time, it adds magic to the place. I go to great lengths to leave it that way for the next person to enjoy.

String brings up the next obvious point. Infrastructure attracts others, and only a small percentage of those others will use it in a way that’s in line with your own intentions. Most likely it becomes firewood. Your pristine beach becomes the next party spot.

I’ve found a lot of “camp furniture” in my travels. Most of it was constructed with green (live) wood. Even if this wasn’t in areas where cutting live trees was prohibited, I’d still be vehemently against it. Metal wire and plastic cordage are central to the construction effort and stick around for a long time. I think people just get bored when you take away their TV and computer. Maybe that’s getting solved now with the amount of cell signal dead zones quickly shrinking and network speeds increasing.

#4

One man’s treasure is another man’s junk.

#5

Beer cans and used diapers are no man’s treasures.

#6

Take nothing but pictures.
Kill nothing but time.
Leave nothing but footprints.
That is the “leave no trace” ethic as far as I’m concerned.

Leave no trace does not include makeshift teepees, wind breaks, tables, chairs, rock cairns, rock ringed firepits, drift wood sculptures, messages in bottles, fireworks, graffiti on boulders or trees or trash of “any kind”.

No BS cop outs, or excuses from the “its all about me” people are acceptable.

If you have a “perceived” need for any of those things; perhaps you should stay at home. You’ll be more comfortable , safe, and secure at home, and you won’t disturb the natural landscape for others.

BOB

#7

@thebob.com said:
Take nothing but pictures.
Kill nothing but time.
Leave nothing but footprints.
That is the “leave no trace” ethic as far as I’m concerned.

Leave no trace does not include makeshift teepees, wind breaks, tables, chairs, rock cairns, rock ringed firepits, drift wood sculptures, messages in bottles, fireworks, graffiti on boulders or trees or trash of “any kind”.

No BS cop outs, or excuses from the “its all about me” people are acceptable.

If you have a “perceived” need for any of those things; perhaps you should stay at home. You’ll be more comfortable , safe, and secure at home, and you won’t disturb the natural landscape for others.

BOB

.Worth Repeating…

#8

Hope I’m not beating a dead horse here but I am truly interested in how fellow paddlers view the “Leave no Trace” ethics. Are they applicable to our travel or were they created by others, for others and suitable only for mountain and inland environments?

There are 7 principles to ensure that our passing is not memorialized in any way. https://lnt.org/learn/seven-principles-overview Principle #4 is ”Leave What You Find” and it specifically says “Do not build structures, furniture, or dig trenches.”

Are these principles reasonable for Kayaking travel? Do we adopt some and ignore others as it suits our travel? Folks seem to agree that creating multiple fire rings is not OK but finding structures that make our stay more convenient may be welcomed. Does that mean that we should remove all traces of fire rings that we find above the high tide line but leave (and appreciate) structures and furniture that suit our needs?

I’m clearly conflicted on this and would appreciate your opinions.

Jon
http://3meterswell.blogspot.com

#9

I don’t remove anything

In some areas I travel it’s a working wildeness
And some of the furniture and structures are historic.
It’s never a good idea to remove artifacts
Fish drying racks and tepee and hunting lodge frames are there to make things easier for subsistence hunters and fishers
Now if you are talking the lower 48 it’s different. The difference is the population and user pressure
Trash however is never acceptable

#10

@Chodups said:
Hope I’m not beating a dead horse here …

I think it’s clear that you are from the majority of responses so far. That, or only those that are against what you propose feel strongly enough to respond.

… but I am truly interested in how fellow paddlers view the “Leave no Trace” ethics. Are they applicable to our travel or were they created by others, for others and suitable only for mountain and inland environments?

It is my view that they apply to anyone, anywhere that hasn’t yet been spoiled by civilization and overpopulation. This means even a tiny little beach with difficult access, or a little rocky island you stop on for lunch.

There are 7 principles to ensure that our passing is not memorialized in any way. https://lnt.org/learn/seven-principles-overview Principle #4 is ”Leave What You Find” and it specifically says “Do not build structures, furniture, or dig trenches.”

Are these principles reasonable for Kayaking travel?

Yes. Absolutely.

Bring it with you if you need it to be safe and reasonably comfortable. Bring it HOME when you’re done, or if you were using natural materials to build something temporary then remove it and return it to roughly the place you found it before leaving.

Do we adopt some and ignore others as it suits our travel?

No. Why are you trying to pick and choose what’s convenient for you?

Folks seem to agree that creating multiple fire rings is not OK but finding structures that make our stay more convenient may be welcomed. Does that mean that we should remove all traces of fire rings that we find above the high tide line but leave (and appreciate) structures and furniture that suit our needs?

I have removed many fire pits in careless and destructive places. I have also dismantled “camp craft” creations and scattered the wood far across the forest floor. The only place I have fires is in the designated area on established and maintained camp sites, and only on very rare occasions at that. I reserve the right to have an “emergency warming fire” any time, anywhere; but the need has yet to arise.

I know that people have forgotten how to socialize with each other in the outdoors without the aid of a massively wasteful, raging inferno of a bonfire and fueled by excessive amounts of alcohol, but that doesn’t mean I give my blessing.

It probably isn’t a coincidence that when I’ve spent time naturalizing an area, I also end up lugging a bunch of someone else’s garbage with me for the rest of a trip. It makes me ashamed to be part of the group called “human”.

#11

I have mixed views on this one. I personally try my best to not leave anything (structural or otherwise) behind in camp. But I have seen and used some man-made natural furniture in the woods that was stumbled upon, and thought it was kind of neat.
Heck, even the USFS sometimes leaves cut log sections for seats around established campsites/firepits.

But it also reminds me of the nasty, stinking bucket toilets (5 gallon bucket with toilet seat affixed) that we see all over the woods along the Ausable.

Someone thinks they are being a really good person leaving those out there for the next group, but the truth is NOBODY will ever haul that thing out of the woods on their own accord, save a few dedicated naturalists like those on here who are committed to cleanup by any means necessary.

#12

@Tortoise said:
Heck, even the USFS sometimes leaves cut log sections for seats around established campsites/firepits.

There’s a big difference between an established camp site and a pristine wilderness area with little/no sign that anyone else has been there recently. This is what I’m referring to keeping pristine. I don’t remove things from established/maintained camp sites unless it’s clearly dangerous, trash, or useful gear someone has left behind.

#13

The difficulty in removing anything that seems out of place in a wilderness is that those can indeed be natural features or archaeological ones
There have been stories about Inuit tent rings being dismantled. And some Pukaskwa Pits have been also destroyed.
I haven’t seen much destruction in true wilderness…ie cutting green logs for furniture. I have seen camp furniture that was made from downed logs… And I have done it too… Many times in Wabakimi we have rebuilt fire rings poorly situated on duff and replaced them with small three sided open front with a capstone functional firepits and built on a rock base,.

Trash is another issue. We encountered an island with decades of trash. It was a Native wild rice community campsite on Crown Land… We gathered up all the trash, put it in the half sunk freighter canoe and left it there but called MNR who was going to have to send chopper crews in. This was in a canoe area where its not easy to pack out volumes of junk…

What irks me is beer cans… If you packed them in surely you have room to pack them out.

#14

“leave no trace” means just what it says.
No matter how you feel about it, that is what it means.
If you can’t adhere to that simple statement, I hope you are not paddling to pristine, un- spoiled places .

Jack L

#15

The topic is now off topic. It was never about you being a slob or you not being a slob. It was about what do you do when you find something at a campsite that might not belong there ( ie is man made)
No Leave No Trace is not about rigid rules. Its about considering how you are impacting the environment. Years ago I took a formal LNT training course.

#16

@kayamedic said:
The topic is now off topic.

I disagree. It’s still on topic.

When I started the topic I was testing the validity of my own interpretation of LNT. I guess that at some point I did ask
if we should remove fire rings but what I was really looking for was opinion on Camp Craft / Driftwood Furniture / Beach Architecture. Its creation and how folks feel about it being left behind by its creators. There have been some great responses but maybe I was being too vague.

Let me ask a few questions in a more direct manner:
Do you make a point of leaving no sign of your visit when you leave a site? If not, what sort of signs are OK to leave and why? Windscreens?
Benches?
Driftwood chairs?
Clothes lines?
Tarp lines?
Fire ring?
Firewood?
Other?

Should outfitters who use a public site for their group have a different set of “rules” or consider their impact to the environment through a different lens and get a pass on infrastructure that they leave behind? (Not wanting to go down this rabbit hole but would appreciate a simple yes or no).

Is there a common definition of “impacting the environment” that wilderness paddlers have any chance of gaining consensus?

Jon
http://3meterswell.blogspot.com

#17

How about windmills to joust?

#18

@string said:
How about windmills to joust?

Haven’t come across any of those before but I would be four-square against them. ;<)

Jon
http://3meterswell.blogspot.com