I probably didn’t pay attention since it was a bit above what I considered for used. I’m sure it was a good deal, but may have been too much boat for a beginner.
This is not a set rule and is flexible. But my current considerations are:
new 12-14’ up to $1K
used of the above up to $500
One of those 10’ nutshells the rental places use for <$200 to save rental fee and sell after I find one of the above.
The higher the price, the more of my requirements it has to meet:
Kayaks don’t come with replaceable keels. Plastic ones just get scratched up (though it’s best to try to avoid that) and it doesn’t affect performance. People with injected molded or composite boats (fiberglass, kevlar, carbon, etc.) are more careful about protecting their hulls. My folding kayaks have sacrificial black rubber tape along the keel line to absorb any scratches and I can tape over them when they get badly gouged.
A week ago I had recommended a used CD Whistler to you that popped up in your area for $450 plus a Werner Skagit paddle for $100. Don’t know if you checked them out at the time but that and the Kestrel listing prove there are good deals to be had in your area so it would be worth checking listings religiously and, once you have the rack, responding as soon as one posts.
By the way, most sit in kayaks over 12’ tend to have dual bulkheads. Like the popular Pungo, which has only a stern bulkhead in the 12’ model but both in the 14 footer. As was already mentioned, the Perception Conduit 13 could be a good value and appropriate boat for you – new ones were only about $700. More common similar boats would be Wilderness Systems Tsunami 140 and Perception Carolina 14. SOme of the mid sized older Necky kayaks often turn up too, like the Looksha 14 and Manitou 13.
Any kayak that has two bulkheads will have two accessible storage compartments. However, use dry bags for anything that you don’t want to get wet to be on the safe side. Except for a day hatch, these compartments are not accessible when paddling unless you are paddling with other people who can access them for you.
Pretty much all kayaks 12’ or longer have bow and stern carry handles. I’ve never heard of one that wasn’t old and well worn that failed.
If you buy used in good shape you can pretty much always sell it for about what you paid for it, sometimes more. Outfitters often sell off some of their rental fleets in the fall and dealers often offer steep discounts to move out older models to make room for new ones. However, it’s often easier to sell a boat in the Spring, just like a motorcycle.
There’s no real advantage to buying a new first boat, as after a season or two, most new paddlers often have a better idea of what they want and either move up to a different boat or quit kayaking altogether. If you buy new, you probably won’t recover much more than 50-60% on resale.
I don’t get why you’d be willing to pay up to $1000 for a new boat but wouldn’t pay that same amount for a better-quality used boat. I mean, if your budget is $1000 you can either get a $1000 new boat or a $2 or even $3000 used boat. Do you have some kind of general idea that a boat which retails for $2000 is somehow going to be too advanced for you? It might be perfectly appropriate for a beginner, but be overall better quality, more comfortable, lighter weight, have better features etc. That doesn’t make it any less beginner-friendly.
But of course everyone is different and as always YMMV.
I guess i don’t know enough to appreciate a $1k used boat. I’m just making up numbers to demonstrate my logic:
A $1K used kayak is a $2K new price. But a $2K kayak may have features or qualities a beginner won’t appreciate. So my idea is as a beginner I’m more a $1K guy and that would have a used price of $500. Like if I can buy a new Toyota for the same price as a used Lexus. but if i consider buying a used Lexus, I’m also ready to buy a used Toyota (for even less)
I’m ready to be flexible on that, of course. Used ones sometimes include paddles, or other items.
That Perception conduit 13’ for $700 new would be my yardstick to compare values. As a noob I’m sure a used kayak that cost $900 has some advantages, I just may not see them.
From my biking hobby I know it takes some years to appreciate the higher end equipment.
I shouldn’t have said replaceable keel. It seems to be called skid plate . So it protects the keel. I know in an ideal world boats don’t get dragged, but since I’m alone, this may happen. Some kayaks have keel-wheels.
Good advice on the outfitters selling old kayaks. I will investigate that.
I check FB and CL a few times a day I just had to focus on getting my roof crossbars ordered and hopefully installed this weekend. Then I’m more ready to strike.
Only heavy sit on tops and fishing kayaks have a keel wheel, and those are rare. And touring kayaks don’t typically have skid plates either. As I said, scratches don’t affect performance and are part of the typical wear for plastic boats. For about $30 or $40 you can buy a collapsible two wheeled cart that straps to the kayak so you can solo tow it to the water. Then the cart can fold down or come apart and stash in the kayak hatches.
From what I’ve noticed, there are far more touring quality kayaks that show up in your metro area than mine, and at good prices. You’ve got some quality dealers in Wisconsin and a lot of lakes and prime paddling locations in the upper Midwest so that is not surprising. I’m sure you’ll eventually score something pretty good for a decent price. I
But don’t expect there will be many of the usual rental end-of-season deals though this year. The outfitters I know are either planning to hang onto their fleets or sell them to preferred customers who got shut out by the shortages this summer.
The OT rec kayak we bought has a removable plastic insert in the stern keel that is there to be a skid plate I’m told. It has 2 screws to get it off and I haven’t tried taking it off.
A few times when she was in a hurry I saw her dragging it along.
It looked like a good idea to me I doubt she will ever wear it out but if she did it wouldn’t take much to make a new one out of a bar of nylon or similar. Looks like I could buy a nylon cutting board and make 15 out of it.
As to this boat buying dilemma. IMO this type situation can quickly become a case of (Paralysis by Analysis). You will know what you want when you see it and when the time comes trust your gut and go for it. Worst thing that can happen is you sell it and break even or lose a few bucks.
Just relax, there is no “perfect” initial boat buy. Sometimes we stumble into something that turns out to be ideal – but I think most of us get something decent to start off and figure out a few years later that we want something a little or a lot different, once we’ve paddled for a while and have a better sense of what we want a boat to do.
So don’t obsess too much about this. A kayak is a toy that is supposed to be fun, not a life or death decision.
It’s not like with a perfectly serviceable car where the manufacturer has to come up with more gee-whiz gizmos and cosmetic design features every year to convince people that they need to upgrade to the newest model. Once a design proves successful, most kayaks change very little from year to year other than some minor tweaks, if at all.
Once a new kayak hits the water it loses 40-50% of it’s value, and with a bit of seat time might prove to not be the one that you really want. A boat bought used can generally resell for about what you paid for it. However, if you are totally convinced that a particular boat is your lifetime boat, then by all means, buy new if that is what it takes to acquire it.
I understand kayak design doesn’t really progress a lot anymore and they don’t really wear out or require more maintenance as they age. So the comparison to cars probably wasn’t the best.
My understanding is seat quality can be a meaningful difference between expensive and cheaper models. So that is something I’m willing to pay for.
I’m not sweating it nor am in a rush. I kind of have an idea what new ones to consider and most won’t be available before fall. I only would buy a new one in fall if there is a good deal. I look daily for used ones. If a really good deal comes along, I try to buy it. If not, then I don’t. This thread, and other research, gave me a much better understanding what to look for. And while I wait for a good opportunity, I keep researching. Researching doesn’t take away from looking for a good option. I’m sure by next spring I will be 100% boat ready and have everything I need inc. kayak.
I probably will miss out on some really good deals since it will take me some effort to drive far (take off from work, juggle other commitments). But if I take a day off to look at a kayak (and that may be a dud), I also lose money. A new one isn’t the worst idea assuming time is money.
I analyze and research most things I buy. That is part of the fun. I realize this won’t be my last kayak. But if this first kayak I keep for 4 years instead of only 2, it is worth it to me.
Lots of really good deals on used fiberglass and carbon/fiber kayaks around the nation. You may have to drive a few hours, but great deals are out there on quality kayaks.
Aren’t those more fragile? I fear for a beginner boat I may want something more robust.
I’m also not able (or willing) to drive across state lines. first, this makes me commit ot a boat, it adds quite some cost in $ and time, and my first drive with a boat on my roof i prefer over a short distance at lower speeds. they also may require more inspection by someone knowledgeable.
I came across the hybrid kayak category, like the Native Ultimate FX12. they kind of remind me of the Sea Eagle inflatable I mentioned above. But it looks like their main disadvantage is they don’t have any buoyancy built in. So self rescue will be difficult. I saw a video of a guy adding pool noodles.
they are supposed to be comfortable with better seats and ability to move around, though.
The Natives are wide flat bottomed kayaks for fishing. They are meant to be a platform for fishing and at 31” wide, are very sluggish. You started this thread saying you want to paddle around small lakes.
There are several useful sections on Paddling.com you should read which will broadly cover all the aspects of different types of kayaks and what criteria you should consider based on your expected use. I think it would be more helpful to you to study those to gain a better understanding of the tools of the sport rather than calling on others to explain the aspects of each of the various diverse boats you discover in your product browsings.
I’ll suspend my my search for a hard-shell for now and focus on inflatables like the Sea Eagle or something similar. So this thread can be closed. It zig-zagged enough.
I got my cross bars yesterday, installed them, but the plastic towers started to break. When I torqued the bolts to the car the washers went right through the towers. the 10Nm torque wrench never clicked and the the washer went 2mm through the plastic and would have gone all the way through. It is even more scary since without a torque wrench I would just have fastened them and wouldn’t have noticed. So to make this work on my roof, I would have to buy a much more expensive roof solution.
I also had some second thoughts about storing it in my garage. It can be done, but is an added hassle. I’m not saying I won’t visit a hard-shell boat later. But for now a good inflatable seems to be a better beginner choice for me since it limits all problems to just the boat.
I thank everyone for the responses, I learned a lot.
I just had to focus on getting my roof crossbars ordered and hopefully installed this weekend. Then I’m more ready to strike.