4/3 wetsuit
I liked my 4/3 wetsuit okay; unless I was paddling really hard or the sun came out or . . .
then I broke down and got a drysuit - worth every penny. Common sense goes a long way - i.e. decent clothing for a quick dip and seriously close to shore; but if you are serious about winter paddling consider making the investment in a drysuit. It is worth the peace of mind and freedom to explore - if you are like me, my boat seems to forget my instructions to stay close to shore sometimes. 
Makes sense to me too, but …
– Last Updated: Sep-09-09 1:20 PM EST –
...I already know your words are falling on deaf ears. He's blasted me for saying the same thing three or four times now. Some people who are totally focused on big-water paddling are simply unable to comprehend this at all, but you really CAN safely get through a dump when near shore on small bodies of water simply by climbing out onto the bank and changing into your spare clothes. Applying open-water principles to little rivers and near-shore lake paddling is great if you can do it, but if you can't do it, actual experience shows that being able to get out of the water quickly and having dry clothes to change into will work just fine in normal weather. Think about it - How many people do you know who have fallen through the ice in the winter, and walked a mile to the car to change clothes, and then gone back to what they were doing? It's a common enough thing around here that nobody gives it much thought. Sure, NOT being able to get out of the water (whether that means falling out of a boat far from shore, or falling through the ice where your ability to climb out again is "iffy" is a whole different matter, but that's not the situation you were describing.
Common sense is the bottom line. I know I'll be fine if I get dunked when near shore during typical late-fall or early-spring weather, but if OTHER circumstances, like unusually cold air temperatures or very strong wind reduce the margin of safety, I'll take that into account and wear a dry suit or even stay off the water completely. No matter what, though, I wouldn't want anyone dismiss the danger of cold water no matter how many thousands of prepared people have survived flips near shore compared to each unprepared person who died. You have to take this seriously, even if you DON'T need to apply open-water paddling precautions. My biggest fear is not getting soaked, cold, and needing to change clothes. My biggest fear is the gasp reflex. Lots of people die from that. I expect that a dry suit reduces that risk a lot, besides just being the best way to deal with cold water.
Possible Dry-Suit Deals
I agree completely with the comments here about dry suits. I love mine, even though I haven’t had to put it to the test “so far”. The convenience and comfort even if you DON’T fall in the water are unbeatable, especially when combined with what the suit will do for you if you DO fall in.
Here’s something that might be worth checking out if you want a dry suit but don’t have much money.
http://www.paddlin.com/
I got my first dry suit from these guys - $200 for a breathable, military-surplus model. They had dozens of them on hand back when I bought mine, and they still may have some, as they were not a hot-selling item. Sad to see these guys go out of business, but dry-suit deal seekers might be in luck. You’ll have to call them about availability of dry suits, as the military-surplus ones were never featured on the website. They may have name-brand suits still in stock too.
…
Your a college student with a mortgage? There’s your first problem wouldn’t you say? Get rid of the mortgage get a full time job and buy yourself a dry suit.
…
Your a college student with a mortgage? There’s your first problem wouldn’t you say? Get rid of the mortgage get a full time job and buy yourself a dry suit.
Easy there!
Some people find house payments to be the way to go. I haven’t been in the market lately, but I have met a number of people who’s mortgage payments are about the same as the monthly rent on an apartment. It costs money to have a roof over your head either way, but with house payments you get something back eventually - either a place to call your own, or money from the sale when you move. I knew a few people in college who went with house payments instead of apartment rent, and it turned out that they were a lot smarter than I was (I paid rent). Give the guy a break - he might be spending his money more wisely than you give him credit for.
There’s nothing to "get used to"
If you trim your latex neck seal to fit, it will be comfortable immediately and you’ll forget about it in the first few minutes of paddling.
If I was just surfing like you…
…I might go the same way, but that’s very different from typical paddling. There’s also little likelihood of long-term immersion, as might occur in an offshore mishap.
I’m in Northeast Pa and paddle in cold
weather. Here’s what I do. 3mm farmer John with neo jacket. neo booties and neo gloves. hood if it’s raining or snowing. I use very long safty lines-25 feet. I test my gear and acclimate to the cold water early in the cold weather season by dumping and swimming the boat to shore.
The long safty lines allow me to find a place to stand before getting to shore. I paddle with ice in the water and never had a problem. I am cold but not disabled.
“offshore”
“offshore mishap”?
Off what shore? Read the OP’s following up!
Test your gear
I use neoprene waders and they work great, but I wouldn’t recommend them because I don’t want to get into a stupid fight. Before I used the waders I used a wet suit. I went back to a wet suit after having a dry suit failure. Trust me a dry suit failure is much worse than a wet suit or wader failure.
No matter what you use. I recommend that you do a test swim at least once a month with your paddling clothes. Also I’d recommend that you used a neoprene hood whenever you might be in cold water deeper than waist deep.
My oldest dumped his in cold water and he wears regular fleece clothing. Naturally he wades/swims very quickly to shore with his dry bag and changes in record time. By the time I’ve brought his boat back to him he is ready to get in it again. This usually happens in the first five minutes of the paddle so we carry more than one set of spare clothing.
Skull cap
Dry suits are fantastic. Not everyone can aford one. When we started paddling it was a light rain coat and fleese for white water. We then after one or two seasons up graded to a farmer john wet suit and rain coat. Next came the paddling jacket and years later the dry suit. Mind you this was on rivers so some of the swims were short but some were long with the current. So back to the original question. A pair of neoprene gloves or mits and a skull cap sure heip with warmth.
RR
What’s a safty line?
Here are a few pics from my winter
paddles. There is something about the winter paddles that I really love. These paddles are done in a drysuit. I do not support the use of any wet suit for these paddles. You don’t buy all this expensive sh*t so you can deal with what is known. You buy it for the unknown. Forget notions of “if your close to shore”, “if your roll is bomb proof”, if “you are not injured”, “if you are not alone”. When this life saving gear is called upon, you can forget about the if’s. Significant immersion time in 32 degree water in clothing that is comfortable to paddle in requires the use of a drysuit. By the way, you can count on nothing, drysuit included. All you are doing is lowering your risk while trying to enjoy the event. I have sailed, windsurfed, paddled, and been diving in 32 degree water my entire life. Wet suits are more than capable of keeping you warm for extended immersion, but not in the same comfort as the drysuit. There is some truth in every post so far, save yourself the hassle and buy a drysuit if you plan to be in open water that is near freezing and when doing so, don’t do it alone (open water/good swin in). Bill
http://s44.photobucket.com/albums/f4/Wolverinemw/Winter%20Paddles/
Immersion…
I am more “immersed” while surfing my waveski in one session than most people in the whole winter. Not sure what the point of that is.
Fact is all equipment is a compromise of comfort, judgement and skills to minimize risk.
I have two top of line drysuits that I have not used in several years… even when paddling around “offshore” (how offshore do folks really go?). For me, these aren’t the panacea.
sing
“Offshore” is relative…
…and perhaps not the best choice of words. What really matters is whether you’re within a distance that you can swim to safety before the temperature of the water renders you helpless. That distance can be a lot shorter than many people think. You don’t have to be a long way offshore for it to become an issue. In a river with a swift current, you may not be far from shore, but you may not be able to get out of the water, either. Water temp and immersion time are what matters.
Frank, I have waders also and they work
better than a wetsuit for me as well. I also avoided the fight because I wear a neo jacket with the waders so it solves the problem.
Not deaf, just prudent
– Last Updated: Sep-11-09 6:06 PM EST –
Sure, it's easy and convenient to say, "I'm always close enough to shore that I can just swim over and put on dry clothes", but assuming that is just plain dumb. Circumstances on the water can change rapidly, as can the weather. The fact that one "gets away" with being unprepared doesn't mean that it's a good safety strategy, it just means that your luck has yet to run out. Recommending being unprepared to other people is irresponsible, as you don't know their paddling skills or their abilities to cope with immersion.
IME, people seem to greatly overestimate their ability to cope with and swim in cold water, and the amount of time they'll actually have before, they are no longer able to self-rescue. That's nowhere near the amount of time it take to succumb to hypothermia, which can be quite a while. It's the amount of time you have until your hands become useless, which can be as little as a couple of minutes in really cold water. They also don't understand the effects of the shock of cold water on their bodies and how long it will take them just to get their faculties back after a dunking. Pond/lake shores and riverbanks don't always provide an easy and quick exit, so distance from shore is not the only consideration.
As you pointed out, gasp reflex is a huge consideration, as it can effectively result in instant death if one sucks in water. It's probably the most common cause of the "he fell in and never came up again" type of drowning. Both wetsuits (full suits and some shorties, but not Farmer Johns) and dry suits do a good job of preventing it, as they both protect the neck and chest areas that are responsible for triggering it from sudden immersion. Clothing that doesn't do that provides no protection against gasp reflex.
Do whatever you want with your own life, but I'm going to continue encourage people to err on the side of caution.
It’s all matter of scale
– Last Updated: Sep-11-09 8:01 PM EST –
This is the first time you have answered a post of mine about tipping over on small sheltered waters without resorting to additional open-water examples. That's good. However, there's still the matter of scale, and the matter of applying hard and fast rules regardless of scale. You say it's "dumb" to expect certain conditions during a trip, and that "circumstances on the water can change rapidly, as can the weather". Sure, they CAN change in some cases, but does that mean I must always plan for that? A river that's always been knee-deep or less and 20 feet wide on previous trips won't "change rapidly" into something different on THIS trip, and if the weather is 60 degrees and sunny and it's supposed to be that way for the rest of the day, the forecast may be wrong but I'm pretty confident it won't suddenly be 30 degrees with rain before I get off the water three hours from now. Sure, some shorelines don't allow an easy (or any) means of getting out, but that doesn't mean shorelines that WOULD allow easy exit need to be treated with the same degree of caution every single time. Sure, your hands can become useless pretty quickly in "cold water", but is that true for ALL water that people would normally call "cold"? There's always the scale of the situation to consider, and there are no rules that must be followed ALL the time. Some people (like me!) will completely dismiss a person as a blowhard if that person insists on resorting to blanket, worst-case generalizations that clearly don't apply "right now", so I think the best thing is to talk to people about specific dangers, rather than taking a "these are the risks that are always there" kind of approach. Even more important than that, people can be prone to doing dumb without even knowing it, which is why I think that encouraging people to understand cold water and to think for themselves is ultimately a more effective plan than saying "this is what you must do". A good example is a buddy of mine who goes ice fishing every chance he gets. The standard "rule" is to ALWAYS stay off ice that's thinner than four inches, but he goes fishing on shallow backwaters of the Wisconsin River when the ice might not even be two inches thick. However, he knows how deep the water is (finds out every step of the way) and simply wears waders so he won't be inconvenienced if he falls through. That plan of action would be foolish out on a lake, but he's not on a lake. It's just another example of taking reasonable precautions based on the scale of the situation.
Drysuit Vote
I was always taught, dress for immersion. Started with farmer john with long sleeve rash guard with a step in jacket which really hindered paddling. Then went to wicking layer with fleece with rain gear which wasn’t very good. Now I use the wicking layer with fleece and a drysuit…much better. I also wear a wicking cap with a neoprene hood, gloves, wool socks and neoprene booties. Yes, there are times when I feel clammy in my drysuit but I’m not cold. And yes, I feel my mobility is sometimes restricted but not as much as the two layers of neoprene.
One thing is for sure…if you do opt for a drysuit, make sure you burp it and get all of the air out of it before you get in your kayak.