I have an older Hurricane Kayak Santee 116 that was bought second hand, I was doing some maintenance and noticed a crack at the base of the vertical wall of the coaming. I went to reinforce it with some extreme hold tape before a permanent repair and noticed the coaming is cracked at the base about 60%-70% all the way around the cockpit. Is this a common problem with these boats? I guarantee you I will never put pressure on that coaming again getting in or out of the boat.
Thanks
mjac
Welcome to the world of older Hurricane kayaks. Luckily no one has attended a class I have taught with a Hurricane kayak in about 5 years. I can remember only one Hurricane which did not break in some fashion while attempting a rescue or while learning to roll. They may be light to carry, however that does not serve Hurricane’s well in the realm of sturdiness.
That is the question I have, I am to beginning to believe they are not as well built as I thought and definitely not worth putting money into. I saw that one crack in the Coaming, I thought it was from a bungee I hooked to it to keep the Kayak up against the wall of the van. When I went to reinforce the crack I discovered the Coaming was cracked at the base a good 60% all the way around the cockpit. I was shocked, I don’t know what was holding it on. Right there I decided no money is going into this boat, just going to use it up. Should have learned, launched the boat one time on a roller launch and cracked the side. The guy before me cracked the stern on a waterfall. I was going to do some repairs but now I will keep running with flex tape, did so for about a year. Give me some brands so I can start looking, want something about 12’ for poking around bayous and small local rivers.
Thanks
mjac
The ADA roller launches are terribly destructive to many kayaks, not just Hurricane’s. Avoid them unless in some version of a “plastic” kayak.
Your question about brands for 12’ foot kayaks is not my area of expertise as I primarily focus on sea kayaks (14’ and up). Two characteristics I would want in a shorter kayak would be: at least one watertight bulkhead with a hatch (two bulkheads if a 14+ sea kayak), and rotomold/plastic construction.
Why a bulkhead? Because a sealed compartment gives some inherent bouyancy should you flip. And, why rotomold/plastic construction? Because they are both relatively durable, forgiving in most paddling conditions, and are easy to repair. I have carbon fiber & fiberglass kayaks, however my plastic boats get used in most teaching, oyster bed prone, and rocky/jetty conditions because I do not have to be as careful with them getting scratched/damaged.
If weight for ease of portability is a great concern for you, consider using a kayak trolly (I do 95% of the time with my long kayaks) when a friend is not available to team carry. And, figure out a way to load/unload your kayak solo without having to hoist all the weight simultaneously - get creative while keeping the operation safe, I have to.
Also, most kayak damage I have seen over the years happens when they are strapped down too tightly on a car, truck bed, or trailer. Snug is good…overtightening tiedowns breaks kayaks because the straps/ropes put pressure on areas of the kayak which are not built to withstand stresses.
Hope this helps.
“ADA Roller Launches are terribly destructive to many Kayaks…” NOW YOU TELL ME.
I would not own a kayak without two sealed bulkheads. Hurricane use to make the Santee 116 Sport with only one Sealed Bulkhead, I think they have corrected that misstep.
I like my Thermoformed Boats, just have to find the best built one. I mean if you have $7,000 to blow you can go visit Bill Swift.
Thanks
mjac
I’ve liked my Eddylines. Even the '08 model still looks good and the only maintenance (other than cleaning) was to reseal the bulkheads awhile back. On the other hand, I never did roller launches or shallow rocky rivers with them. I doubt there’s a thermoformed boat out there that can stand up to a good quality RM poly boat (not the thin and bendy big box junk) in terms of every-day toughness and impact resistance.
Just take a look at @DruckerinSCarolina 's Loon in the Dollar a Mile thread. The thing is, there are hundreds, probably thousands, of boats just like his all over the country still taking their owners where they want to go with no pain in the wallet. Just don’t store them upside down in the summer sun with cinder blocks piled on the hull. Don’t ask.
Good call on owning a kayak with two sealed bulkheads. I wish the recreation kayak industry would adopt your idea on all the kayaks they offer.
Sorry this is the first you have heard about the problem many kayaks have with ADA roller launches…it has been pointed out/discussed on this forum in the past.
CASE 1: User error. Mjac, your photos show a used and greatly abused kayak. It doesn’t sound like you understand the properties of thermoformed kayaks. You should stick with rotomolded and then you can treat it however you want.
[quote=“kayakhank, post:2, topic:129423”]
Luckily no one has attended a class I have taught with a Hurricane kayak in about 5 years. I can remember only one Hurricane which did not break in some fashion while attempting a rescue or while learning to roll.[/quote]
CASE 2: Exaggeration and lack of evidence. We need numbers here before you make a blanket criticism of a brand. How many Hurricane kayaks were involved in these rescues and rolls? And you claim that all but one broke? Unless you have numbers that’s not a credible claim.
From immediate recall, 7 of 8 Hurricanes broke in the cockpit area during class/easy training/rolling. 3 during T-rescues/scrambles. 4 while rolling. Various models of Hurricane, but the rolling issues were all Tracers.
And a student’s thermoform Stellar cockpit broke/cracked during a T-rescue. I have enough history witnessing termoform kayak failures that students who want to come to any class are encouraged to use a plastic kayak.
[quote=“kayakhank, post:9, topic:129423, full:true”] From immediate recall, 7 of 8 Hurricanes broke in the cockpit area during class/easy training/rolling. 3 during T-rescues/scrambles. 4 while rolling. Various models of Hurricane, but the rolling issues were all Tracers.
And a student’s thermoform Stellar cockpit broke/cracked during a T-rescue. I have enough history witnessing termoform kayak failures that students who want to come to any class are encouraged to use a plastic kayak.[/quote]
Let’s see . . . 7 out of 8 is 88%. So 88% of the Hurricanes broke? So it should be easy to find mentions of similar incidents, right? I googled “Hurricane Tracer” and “broke” and came up with nothing. I did find 34 reviews of the Tracer at paddling.net, average 4 stars. Only one review mentions any problem with the coaming:
“I practice rolls in this boat, and I’ve probably done several hundred. . . So I’ve jammed my right knee upward into the kneebrace that’s molded into the combing a few hundred times – and that’s where it separated. It’s not difficult or expensive to repair: for $15 worth of epoxy and an hour’s labor, it’s good as new.”
That guy seems to have had better luck than your 8 students?
I think your information may be outdated. The Hurricane Tracer was discontinued some time ago. About 10 years ago Hurricane overhauled its lineup. One of the improvements was a stiffer deck. I’m not here to defend Hurricanes. I just think your comments need some context.
I’m not sure if you’re critical of Hurricane kayaks specifically or thermoformed kayaks generally? Both Eddylines and Deltas, the top thermoformed kayaks, are manufactured for rugged Northwest ocean conditions. I would say that Hurricane is more of a recreational kayak, and that’s the niche they’re trying to occupy. In that category, I think they rank pretty well. Hurricane no longer has any sea kayaks in its lineup.
As for the Stellar you mention, Stellar doesn’t make thermoformed kayaks.
Poly Boats have their place, I would like to get a hybrid poly or even a full whitewater poly to do that occasionally, there is one river in my two state area that approaches high two or low class three at high cfm, the flow is monitored and published and you are right, poly boats are extremely durable for just general running. But on every paddle stroke you take in that boat you sacrifice glide, you can’t carve, doesn’t track as cleanly and doesn’t have the attractive appearance of a good Thermoform. I mean those Thermoform still look great after years and years if you just take a little care of them and you are paddling, carrying and loading a lot less weight. I mean it is a recreational boat, it is meant to have fun with. Do you think the Eddylines are better built than the Hurricanes?
You did not actually do the Cinder Block thing did you?
Thanks
mjac
It is sacrilegious to produce a recreational Kayak without two sealed bulkheads, it is inexcusable. These boats can be used by very beginning paddlers, things happen. Then they can use the re-entry techniques you taught them.
Have not been too much into forums, peoples’ etiquette…
I’ve never owned (or even paddled) a Hurricane. As you can see, there are widely differing opinions on this site! My only experience paddling thermoform boats is with Eddylines and a Delta once or twice. I have no helpful comments on the Delta, it just didn’t feel right for me. I’ve had no issues with any of the four or five Eddylines (Merlin, Night Hawk, Raven) I’ve had over the years other than poorly sealed bulkheads on the 12’ Skylark I keep for guests to use … an easy fix
Now I mostly paddle a solo canoe, so I have no horse in this race.
I can not speak for kayakhank, though I feel his comment was sincere and an honest assessment of which he is entitled to his opinion. But I indeed can speak for myself and I have an excellent and thorough understanding of the Thermoform building process, the materials used, the evolution of the system, the repair of boats built with the process, the advantages and disadvantages of Thermoformed Kayaks, what they are best suited for and what they are are not best suited for and how best to push their limits. As was stated above, the stern was cratered by the previous owner’s brother. For some unexplained reason he was towing the Santee116 behind a more Whitewater boat on the Okatoma which can get high class 2 in high cfm, so he could have something to do some recreational paddling in ponds along the river. Going over a waterfall the nose of the 116 dug and the stern whiplashed against the ledge of the Waterfall, the rest is history. My mistake was using a roller launch but the damage did not occur in the traditional way, compressing the bottom right after the bulkhead, the side actually split, so I think the hull is older then I realized and was a little brittle.
Thanks
mjac
Good enough for me.
The man is speaking from experience, you are using conjecture. Unless you feel he is dishonest.
I contacted a Paddling Club once expecting a majority of them paddling kayaks because they are so much more efficient and that is what they would desire and virtually every single one of the veteran, experienced members of the club paddle a canoe, for various reasons, packability, aesthetics, comfort more graceful, on and on.
Simply stated on this paddling forum is my experience with thermoform Hurricanes while teaching & training kayaking.
It is good to read that Hurricane has improved its product - unfortunately there are too many which still frequent the used kayak market. The few Eddylines that I’ve worked with have held up in training situations; I’ve yet to see a Delta other than in advertisements.
I took up for you…now you have to teach me how to Eskimo Roll…I always wanted to do that.
Drop me a direct, private message if you are ever in the area. Rolling is fun once it is learned and practiced lots to become proficient (at least it is for me). And, then down the road is learning to roll in “conditions.”
