I’m trying to decide between a top-of-the-line dry top and a lesser one. Specifically, it’s between an IR Competition and their new X Jacket. The main difference seems to be that the X Jacket has “seams are ultrasonically welded rather than sewn”. The Competition also has a rubber seal at the neck but not a full latext gasket.
http://immersionresearch.com/products/redesign.html
I can get the Competition for $170-180. The X Jacket will set me back $300.
This (with a wet suit) is a dry suit alternative for sea kayaking and training in shoulder seasons and for when the dry suit is out of commission (which seems to be all too common with Kokatats these days).
I really want it to stay dry inside even with frequent immersion (for training, surfing, etc), dry enough to support a fleece liner. My impression is that low and mid-range dry tops do not really stay dry inside against frequent immersion, the way a dry suit does. Is this true? Does the IR X Jacket technology look like it will?
Thanks. --David.
Had an older style Competition top
it was dry for 2 years then began to leak through the seams.
How much immersion did it get?
Quite a bit actually
http://tinyurl.com/kgf93
got 2 winters on Tahoe and other Sierra Lakes. Swam in it every outing.
A couple of recommendations…
Get a dry top that has a Velcro waist that expands for donning and doffing. I will never go back to a dry top with a tight-fitting waist that forces you to do the “dry top dance” as you struggle to get it on and off. Both my short sleeve (Bomber Gear) and long sleeve (Stohlquist) dry tops have this feature and they seem to be just as dry as my old, tight-waisted dry top was. However, they are DRAMATICALLY easier to get on and off.
If you really want to stay dry, get a latex neck seal.
I really use my short-sleeve dry top a lot for warm weather paddling. Sierra Trading Post has a Bomber gear short sleeve dry top on sale for $80.
Latex neck gasket vs IR Competition
Thanks for the advice on latext neck gaskets, Brian. I hear ya.
The IR Competition has a neoprene gasket but with a band of soft rubber -- not latex, I believe -- against the neck to make a seal. Yeah, I'm skeptical too, but I'm going to test somebody's this afternoon in the lake -- both rolling and swimming with a lot of thrashing.
Also, re the "dry top dance", that was what kept me away from dry tops all these years. But within minutes of shipping my dry suit back to Kokatat, I discovered -- to my delight -- the velcroed expansion systems on today's dry top waist bands. I've seen them now on NRS and IR, almost identical. Who came up with it first, I wonder.
--David.
Another non-Latex contender
I like the neoprene collar arrangement that IR makes but there is another contender in the non-latex neck gasket category. That’d be the Stohlquist Freeryde Jacket. Similar material as the IR jackets. Big difference is that last year they introduced these with a smooth skin silvery mock turtleneck like neoprene neck seal which allows about a 1.5" contact area with the neck so it doesn’t have the same “gasket neck” feel as some latex neck gaskets. Works extremely well. They incorporated this into their Body Pod semi-drysuit (which actually is very dry). Long inner tunnel, double velcro waist closure, comfy fit. Good garment.
See you on the water,
Marshall
www.the-river-connection.com
Bomber Gear
I liked my Bomber Gear drytop (long sleeve) with the latex neck and excellent build quality so have never tried the IR one.
As to the semi-dry neo necks - unless you have a large neck I wouldn’t do it. Mine leaked like crazy with my 16 inch neck whenever I rolled. Not a bad thing in warm water - but not for me when water temps go below 65 degrees.
Now I use a short sleeved stohlquist semi dry in the summer with neo shorts and then go straight to my kokatat meridian w/booties & relief zipper when fall arrives. My bomber gear dry top and kokatat dry pants sit in my closet unused…just like the one piece-peace of mind in cool and cold water.
Scott
Loose fitting latex vs neoprene
I’ve often wondered, what if you trim the latex until it fits loose enough that it’s pretty comfortable. (Obviously can’t have slack.) As long as there’s some tension around the neck, but not choking, would it still seal better than neo? If so, the only issue left with latex would be periodic replacement. Tearing and wear should also be reduced though with reduced tension.
I’ve got a used Kokatat Wave which I like very much. I would consider it top of the line. The double tunnel seals very well around neo spray skirt. Has the Velcro waste strap. You can have them used for around $150. The Kokatat lifetime warranty on the Gortex does not transfer across owners. Upon receipt I trimmed the neck gasket to just tolerable plus lost 20 lbs since then. At this point it’s border line comfortable. I don’t notice it when paddling, but do very much if wanting to take a 10 minute siesta on the beach with it on. Certainly doesn’t leak yet. I’m gonna lose a lot more weight so will be finding out about the limits of low latex tension.
The whole gasket pulled out though the last time I took it off!, which goes to the replacement/repair factor. (It’s not the original neck gasket, and no rubber from the original was left on the Gortex collar during replacement. I think the original one melted.)
Paul S.
The IR Competition neck gasket…
…is great. I rolled a dozen times, exited and thrashed around like a dolphin twice, and nothing at all came through the neck. I was wearing a 100 wt fleece sweatshirt underneath, and the only part that got wet was the bottom – that’s probably because I did not roll it up away from the tunnel.
The only issue is that the neo neck did get damp, but there was no flowing water.
'Taint perfect, however, and I have a couple of suggestions for IR. The velcro cinch tabs on the outer waistband point backwards; it they pointed forwards, they would be easier to cinch; there’s not nearly as much leverage pulling backwards around the hip. The inner tunnel might benefit from being a bit loose with a cord cinch, like NRS; without that, there is still a bit of a “dance” getting the inner tunnel fully down over your butt. The wrists could use a velcro cinch on the coverings; I had to peel the covers back to get at the gaskets for flattening and sealing, which was a bit of a nuisance.
But generally it’s a very nice product. The outer fabric sheds water like gel coat; the seam taping looks top-notch; the feel for paddling is very comfy and it is overall quite light.
–David.
Bomber Gear available
on eBay. Search by that name and go to Rick’s (bomberRob)eBay store for what remains of his new/old stock. A few drytops long and short sleeve left at verrrrrrrrry reasonable auction starting bids or Buy it Nows. Very limited but S/M/L sizes there. If nothing else a good back up jacket or you can try a shortie for nominal cost and keep seeking your dream drytop.
Last month I got a two layer shortsleeve with wrist and neck gaskets (HydroFlash) for $50 and a three layer, hooded touring jacket, wrist gaskets,latex neck (Nimbus) for $70. Both jackets have the waist tunnel, dry pockets up front (Nimbus adds a wet sleeve pocket) and the adjustable velcro waist tabs that make them much easier to pull over, on, and off. The fabric is Toray II breathable fabric. Workmanship seems very high at first and second glance.
I’ve only used the HydroFlash a half dozen times in rain, light breeze and whipping wind it’s been muy comfortable and easy to paddle in, even on a day with 70% humidity. It’s still too warm to use the Nimbus, even up here in MI 
Latex seals
"I’ve often wondered, what if you trim the latex until it fits loose enough that it’s pretty comfortable. (Obviously can’t have slack.)"
You SHOULD trim your latex seals until they’re comfortable. If you can’t easily insert a finger behind the seal, it’s tighter than it needs to be. It doesn’t require much tension to create a good seal.
“As long as there’s some tension around the neck, but not choking, would it still seal better than neo?”
I would think so.
“If so, the only issue left with latex would be periodic replacement.”
Yes, but it’s relatively easy to do.
“Tearing and wear should also be reduced though with reduced tension.”
Correct.
“The whole gasket pulled out though the last time I took it off!, which goes to the replacement/repair factor. (It’s not the original neck gasket, and no rubber from the original was left on the Gortex collar during replacement. I think the original one melted.)”
When replacing neck seals, the standard practice is to leave at least 1" of the original seal to glue to. This is usually pretty easy, as there’s typically at least that much overlap between the fabric and the bottom lip of the latex seal. It sounds to me like the person who replaced the seal didn’t do it properly. If it’s properly glued, it should not come off under any circumstances. I’ve replaced several neck seals (including multiple seals on the same garment) and the bond between the original latex and the fabric on them was always intact, even if the surface of latex was looking a bit aged and/or cracked.