Well I think we can say QCC didn’t
spend much time engineering this setup, they just slapped it on there. Too bad.
Thumbing through kayak magazines in the bookstore I saw another bizarre design, the rudder was attached to this parallelogram superstructure above the rear deck. The retraction action kept the blade vertical as it went up.
Looked goofy, and the magazine didn’t think it worked too good either.
Mike
Speed/handling clues
While these pictures don’t show the hulls in detail, there is still enough there to venture some speed/handling guesses.
To my eye (and limited photos with reflections and shadows could mislead):
The Epic has a sharper bow entry, slightly less volume in the ends, a more rounded mid section with slightly flatter bilge, sharper chine forward - softer aft, chines located a little closer to keel, less rocker, and it’s extra 1/2" beam is well above waterline. Might actually be narrower at waterline.
These differences should all give it a slight speed edge when both boats are being pushed. Consistent with the design intent.
The QCC has a bit softer (wider) bow entry, with a little more volume out toward both ends, maintains a somewhat consistent shallow V hull the entire length, and the chines are located a little farther out from the keel and degree of softness more consistent along their length, and has more rocker.
The differences should give it a little better sea keeping and general handling characteristics. Again, consistent with the design intent.
Really splitting hairs here though, as both are pretty fast and paddle well in slop too. Some of the factors sort of equal out for things like surfing: To some degree Epics finer ends makes up for less rocker, it’s flatter bilge makes up for slightly narrower chines, etc.
Very different craft that come from different thinking and design intents that are very similar due to shared emphasis on efficiency. Convergent evolution.
All of the above might just be BS - but I think it has at least some relevance for someone trying to decide. Looking at it narrowly - and way over generalizing - more “hard core” racers (wouldn’t be in a sea kayak anyway! - right Ice?) might be happier with the Epic. Tourers both inshore and offshore might do better with the QCC (and things like skeg option, larger hatches, more customization choices, and layup options come into play more here in a more general market).
Hard to go to wrong with either.
Epic vs QCC
The QCC has a lot more rocker than the Epic. The QCC is a much greater volumn boat, more versatile for camping, etc. That’s very good for me. The “being a bigger boat” also makes it heavier. My carbon/kevlar QCC is heavier than my Epic was. I sold my Epic to a novice “slow then/very fast and confident now” woman in my kayak club. The Epic is a little more stabile than the QCC. A lot of novices could easily paddle it and in trying conditions, I believe. The Epic and the QCC have similar water line lengths. The housing or either boat does not drag in the water and moving the rudder up higher on the stern of my QCC did not cause any binding or cable chafing that I can tell. My QCC is not the flawless boat I keep hearing about and although Epic puts no great warranty info on their web site, Greg B. stood by my problem and satisfied me almost immediately. No fuss, no fanfare. I believe my QCC is by far the fastest boat in the club and is awesome at riding waves, but, I believe the Epic may be slightly faster. But for me, a non racer todate, the QCC may be the best all around boat you can buy. But if weight was important , if camping was not interesting or if I wanted to race, I’d probably still own the Epic. And, as I suspect, if on my next trip to Charleston, Epic has indeed improved their quality the way I think they have, I’m buying a carbon 18 just for giggles. I also wish they’d hurry up and come out with their surfski! I hope I can wait that long! Franklin
TrippS volume question
Pretty sure what you are seeing is more rocker. That’s why the ends are higher.
The rocker is only really noticeable when placed next to a flatter kayak. When seen alone - the Q700’s clean lines make it appear rather straighter/flatter that it is.
I think the Q700 does have a little more volume out at the ends - but not extreme. They are fuller and don’t pinch back in like the Epic.
Reselling Swedge’s returned 700
I suspect that most customers don’t have this problem for two reasons:
- They rarely paddle over 5 mph where the stern squat comes into play in a noticable way (symptom of speed, not obstacle).
- They are lighter paddlers. Swedge is a big boy. Ask JackL if his drags.
For them, the boat would be fine. Reselling makes perfect sense. The hard part - finding someone who want’s his color choices.
Two Epic skis last I heard
A fastest of the fast model to compete with Mako Millenium, and a good all arounder to compete with Mako XT…
SealLine Rudder after-market add-on
I am still tweaking the Sealline rudder assy added onto my cedar boat. Made it so it would sit lower and have the rudder’s “indicater line” at the waterline, yet have the unfaired section and housing above the waterline. Big improvement in response with 50% more rudder area. This required drilling and tapping and cutting the housing at the right point. It is now where I want it, but have to fix the looseness I caused in the new cut joints and my tiller control system ratio.
Sealline responded promptly to my questions, and then 5 days later wondering how it was going. The design change that might help most of us would be to tap the entire pivot hole of the housing all the way down and cut pivot plate locations every 3/4" down on the housing. Anyone seen a 5/16-18 tap 6" long?
Both are very nice boat!
For racing purposes: Due to USCA classification, the T18 is at the top of the Sea Kayak category, and for a couples of inches, in the touring one, the Q700 has a lot of competition with the EFT. In races where both can compete together, the difference will be the paddler not the boat.
For touring purposes: also, either one will work great, so it is matter of personal choice which one. The difference between those boats might be a couples of seconds per mile.
As you said if someone “really” wants to race, the Unlimited or ICF class is a must.
Regards,
Iceman
I was waiting too!
but I got tired. According to Barton, the ski was going to be available by the beginning of this year, and now, they are talking for next year.
Anyway, one or two years of good international races results are needed to see its truly potential, so might the next one 
Regards,
Iceman
I’d be interested in hearing
about your fix.
I just today took delivery of a friend’s new QCC 400X and I was inspecting the skeg control. My first thought mirrored your comment.
What is the nature of your modification?
As an aside, this is only the second QCC I’ve been involved with personally and I must say the company certainly delivers a lot of bang for the buck. Rabid QCC fans aside, ;), its really nice to see such an American success story.
Holmes
Well, not sure …
…what Swedge has in mind, but here’s my skeg control fix using a SealLine Trim Tab kit:
http://community.webshots.com/album/120051991ThGiEQ
6" Tap
McMaster Carr PN# 2589a27 $17.31 ea
Let us know how it goes…I too have one of these “Sealine Rudder Thingies” I’m working on doing a little modification to also
Jamie
Thank you N/P
L
– Last Updated: Oct-25-04 7:25 AM EST –
The color was John deer green *L* it was supposed to be Olive!! But they got it right on my Skeg boat, Tan & Sage... yeah I think if you are under 200lbs you wont have a problem with the rudder set up.