Very interesting - and slick!
Nice job! What are the actual dimensions, and how did it handle in different conditions? Thanks.
Dimensions
– Last Updated: Nov-24-13 2:22 PM EST –
It was about 17.5 feet long by 21" wide behind the seat. It would catch the smallest waves surfing and easy to paddle. I wanted a Cetus MV on a budget ;) I feel it was just as maneuverable and probably just a bit slower. Can't complain for the about $300 I spent on materials.
Because of how sharp the chines turned out under the seat it was a bit of a handful in steep following seas. Did not have enough time to play with it as I sold it.
Was meant to be a fitness-oriented kayak, could paddle it with knees together or brace on the sides. I actually raced it downriver along wild water boats and my time was comparable (easy white water, class I and II; the younger chaps in the wild water boats were stronger paddlers than I, but I still placed in the middle of their pack, so I think my kayak was at least if not faster than theirs). The bow had very slicey top too, so while it would spear through wind chop rather than ride too high over it, it would shed water very quickly and not slow down in the process. The catch area at my feet was very narrow too, allowing for efficient paddling.
The odd shape in front of the cockpit is because I had to rework this area for more space for my knees and feet. So I had to slice it open after I skinned it, add some taller structure, then stitch it back together adding a slim triangular piece over my legs to close the gap.
No screws or glue was used, only wood glue was used at the front ad rear where the ends meet. The rest is lashing. About 35l-40lb and it uses heavy weight skin and two-part coating (could have shaved at least 5lb with regular skin and would have been strong enough). Turned out pretty tough and nice to paddle. But I can do better than that, maybe next one ;)
Look up kayaknoise.com
Spike Gladwin, renowned designer and the guy many in the WW
industry credit with introducing planing hulls to WW
has designed a 14 ft surf touring boat witha flat rocketed
hull, and rails, and fun boxes. You can read about it
on his blog and about some surprising speed findings.
I own the first proto of that boat as I worked with him
on that and a few other boats over the years.
It’s way more fun in many ways than a trad touring yak.
Turns 180 with one sweep and surfs superbly.
Would I paddle it to Alaska? No, but a longer version
With more storage?? You bet!
Sea kayakers are a very very conservative crowd and as
Such stuff like this will likely never go to market.
Right now I think P&H are pushing the envelope more than
any others in sea play touring. Most of what’s out there is just another version of another version. Just add hatches and fancy
Outfitting…,
Agree that some designers are just artists but many are
schooled in the applicable science. Perhaps the paddle board revolution will cross with sea touring and well see some
cool fun change? Not many young athletes seem attracted to sea paddling vs surfing etc.
Check out Spikes Vipor.
Apologies for spelling. iPhone challenge
yes
If you look at the guys finishing Molokai challenge, the winner’s surfski is flattest and widest.
…and now for something completely
– Last Updated: Nov-25-13 3:17 PM EST –
different.
http://www.songofthepaddle.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?43597-Currach-in-Oregon
Just thought you would enjoy this.
Spike’s Viper
Here is link to his blog
http://kayaknoise.blogspot.com/2010/03/kayak-noise-flat-hull-seakayaks.html
Perhaps he could release his model to the public so they could build it either in strip of s&g?
Hmmm?
http://www.cobrakayaks.com/cobra-kayaks/cobra-special-performance-fit-out-servive/cobra-re-vision/
I agree with that
Good point about design. The original designers had their own feedback inputs, they just didn’t quantify them the way we can and do now. They saw a change in design associated with a certain outcome in performance, and used that change in design in future designs.
Naughty-naughty, seadart!
You know one’s not s’pose to show a SOT version of any already existing hull form on P.net!
Now how’s that song go? “Everything old is a-new again…”
Salty, note the partial resemblance
of Spike’s Viper to my 1982 Noah Magma. Vladimir Vanha, the designer, released this flattish, edgy ww boat, and then a flatter, sharp edged kayak in the early 80s, but then turned to shortening (Jeti) and user friendly (Aeroquatic) hulls. The Magma at 12’ 6" is quite fast, especially in attainments. Spike’s viper includes several things I’d like to have in the Magma: flatter, sharper edges, a bit more bow volume, much lower stern.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ezwater/8656668618/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ezwater/8656669550/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ezwater/5615339420/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ezwater/8655563777/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ezwater/8656666902/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ezwater/5723973166/
Yeah, I erred in my first reply to
the OP. Low rocker, roundish hulls are fastest in flat, non-turbulent water, but the right design with a flattish bottom, edges, and the right rocker profile can be fastest in a turbulent or wavy environment.
Fun stuff
I think there’s exploring to do with designs and way more fun ocean play boats to be developed. Actually though Spike has been given huge credit for planing hulls in WW he’d be the first to shrug off any absolutes as there were various flattish hulls decades before. I think it is fair to say he brought planing hulls to play boats etc and rotational molding. Who knows what we’ll see in the next 20 years. Be cool if it was something different than the same ol.
Flat is Superior
You really can’t beat the versatility of a planning hull:
http://www.vimeo.com/14426723
Now round is fine on my surfski and solo outrigger, but heck, this is just as fun.
An unusual definition of "versatility"
I agree that it looks like a helluva lot of fun, but like every other SUP video I’ve ever seen, it shows endless miles of speedy downwind surfing. A hull worthy of being called “versatile” would be able to do several things pretty well, rather than excelling in one, very specific setting. Show me a bunch of folks getting their boards up on plane for miles at a time without the help of surfing, or show them paddling AGAINST the wind to get back to their starting point like anyone in any other style of boat would do, or maybe even take them into an environment where they must turn frequently. Maybe even find a video of them in a non-ocean or flatwater setting, yet still beating the pants off regular kayaks. To me, these SUPs are the epitome of “specialized”, which of course is the polar opposite of “versatile”. That’s not bashing the SUPs or what they are for, of course, just disagreeing with the choice of adjectives.
That is interesting
I am imagining that these were originally used for fishing in coastal waters, but I’ve never heard of them before. What’s even more interesting is that apparently the fabric covering is in keeping with tradition (other than the choice of material, of course), not a modern modification of an original all-wood design.
Flat Bottom Craft
Are very versatile. The flat bottom SUP video demonstrates this by showing how stable, maneuverable and fast the hull performs in the open ocean. Now, if I had my grandfather’s old 3 boarder canoe, I’d personally show how this flat bottom canoe performs going upwind and sideways to the wind in the open ocean.
ps: there are videos showing how fast SUP’s are in the flat too and going around cans.
flat, wide and speed?
I’m thinking maybe they were on to hydrofoils, possibly launched off cliffs with seal-gut catapults.