Whatever Mr, Wizard
I guess your certified in emergency AND sports nutrition now too. Man that BCU training is comprehensive stuff! 
Any idea how long it takes for proteins to become available as energy? How much more water is required to process? How the process creates energy? Interesting stuff.
Like I said, fine for getting food into them - once/if stabilized (and nearly unconscious is hardly stable) - and if youâre stuck somewhere waiting for assistance that may take a while. Still on the water? Different story.
If just looking for heat - maybe it helps - but is this hypothermia only, or diabetic related complications as well? How will you know? The diabetic is likely to have no clue - or they would have taken steps earlier. Judgment and perception is usually the first thing to go when their sugar/insulin is off. By the time the problem becomes obvious to others - it can get very serious very fast. Pretty big symptomatic overlap with hypothermia and insulin troubles. Need to know what to treat, and what the priority is is both are present.
For kicks, consider getting a heart rate monitor the calculates calorie use. Theyâre not perfect, but as close a measure as youâll get. Then see how many calories you burn per hour paddling. Then see how far some warm jello water will get you (or anyone else).
For reference - I burn around 900 calories per hour when paddling 5+ mph (my average speed most paddles) getting me something like 4-5 strokes per calorie (your jello might get me 1 1/4 mile - if Iâd eaten it many hours prior). I can easily burn 3000+ kcal on an 18 mile loop I do. Add the gear prep and wash, carrying the boat and such, and I have had many 4000 calorie burn day paddles (with only maybe 3.5 hours of paddling).
200 calories of slow to assimilate protein may be better than nothing - particularly when other foods are not an option - but is fairly insignificant if they still need to get anywhere (smaller paddlers are more calorie efficient - a lot more). Fuel needs to be available (pre-loaded) to be effective.
Fortunately, slower paddling taps fat more than other fuel, so while slowing the pace may prolong the danger, it also puts someone who is sugar/insulin sensitive in a much kinder metabolic state. Walking vs. medium to fast cycling.
Rambling - as usual. Winding down from 12 mile race this AMâŚ
The Kind Of Instruction Iâd Like
I would enjoy instruction a lot if it was like going on a day trip and getting critiqued and advised along the way. I like to paddle my boat.
oh yeah
my favorite class is what we call the âDayTripperâ. It is free form and basically is a journey or trip from point A to B. itâs really all about coaching skills learned in a core course and how to use these skills out in the field. I also throw in a ânewâ trick or 2, depending on the group.
Thereâs plenty of time for critique, either along the way, at lunch or in the post trip debrief. these are also a bit less expensive, especially if enough folks join in.
The core classes are fun, as well, tho the traveling on water is limited as sooo much of the info is new and the journey confuses the learning process.
soooo⌠DayTripper in NC in January? I may be out early in the month is the latest word! 
steve
Friends of mine run a Woods Hole trip
like that and it is one of the finest days you can spend on the water. I have paid for that trip four times. Finally the instructor said< âThatâs it! I will not toake you on thei trip any more, you are too accomplished to pay me for it againâ
So now I go with freinds when I cna find them. I do not give much if any instruction though.
And here all this time âŚ
I thought you were fully certified!
Cheers,
JackL
Nowhere impied. Certifiable though
Thanks for the compliment!
My only complaint with the BCU tests
are that they are very rigid and donât take into account individual differences.
For example, I paddle with a friend who is every bit as good a paddler as our 4* friends.
However, he has some shoulder problems (almost needs shoulder replacement surgery). As a result, he canât do a perfect high brace.
He failed the 3* assesment because he couldnât do the high brace on one side. His response was that in a real world situation, if he couldnât stay upright by using a low brace, he would just roll up. His roll is as bombproof as they get.
Yet his physical limitation make it impossible for him to achieve a 3* rating, much less anything further although heâs certainly capable.
sucky
This seems like it would be workable in the âreal worldâ and the assessor could see beyond the end of his nose. But i guess standards are standards.
Too bad about his shoulder.
steve
NC Waters
Brother Flatpick! Fire me off an email when your plans get firmed up.
yeah Bro,
Iâll still paddle with yaâ if I get a chance!
if you need help Iâll just charge yaâ BIG $$$$$.
hehe.
actually what we do is let folks come along on the DT and just NOT charge 'em. Weâre working on a scheme where once you get your award, you can participate on lower level classes w/o paying. this encourages more people padling, support from the better paddlers and all and all more FUN.
my mission statement is to get MORE paddlers, paddling MORE often, with HIGHER skills in MORE challenging conditions. It ainât about the $$$, tho I do base a good percent of my livelihood on EDU.
steve
you got it! (NT)
BCU, ACA, etcâŚ
First, I don't have anything against flatpick or anyone that believes in those certifications; however, as I have stated long time ago, to me, most of those certifications are pure BS, and they don't say anything about the real capabilities of the paddler, but that he/she is capable of taking exams.
I believe in education, I believe in college and master degrees, I do also believe in PhD, etc...
However, how can I believe in a BCU or ACA certifications when most of those paddlers perform a horrible forward stroke acording to "my own standards" and paddle in such stable boat like the Explore. In those boats, anyone paddles in rough waters...
In order to understand winds, waves, currents, weather, climate, tides, or even plate tectonics, I took real classes and labs in oceanography -5hrs a week per almost 4 months- in college level, and I have an "A" in my records.
In order to learn to paddle on rough waters, I paddle on... always pushing the envelop.
Regards,
Iceman
Of course a good leader carrys other
things too like the extra cliff bar or two or electrolite solution.
I watch out for my diabetic friends or companions. My fave paddling partner occasionally monitors her sugar while rafted up, she is a great friend and a great paddler.
Not perfect but we do what we can. That's the point.
Been a while since I studied up on my biochemistry (like about 25 years) but if we are talking about a one to two hour wait befor evac the hot food might make a difference. That is the scenario I face in new england. I'd rather dose soemeone with hot electrolites plus sugar but if in doubt I'd go with the hot unflavored gelatin.
Here is a site for the effectnevness of protein for endurance expenditure of calories (like staying alive when you are cold.
"You need more than carbs. Protein, fat, and fiber are all important ingredients to consider when shopping for endurance food. Their complex molecules require a longer digestion and absorption process than that of carbohydrates, causing the absorption of any carbs eaten in conjunction to be slowed as well. When these ingredients are combined into a bar, the net result is a slow-burning fuel that provides a long and even energy release."
http://climbing.com/equipment/food234/
And yes much of my college work centered on biology and I've taken a graduate level course on nutrition, (about 25 years ago). I've heard that MR wizard insult since I was six usually fron thos who se mouth has far overrreached their knowledge and ability to support it. so your chhildish insult does not mean that protein is not a good choice for a diabetic if you are in doubt about which way to go on the sugar. I'd probably risk about 60 calories of cliff bar in any case if I could get it in them , not likely they'd have high sugar on the water.
I could not find the elapsed time from ingestion of unflavored gelatin to energy realese but I bet it's not so slow. All of that protein should be metabilized and unavaible in about 8 hours, that's why folks catabolize during sleep. If anyone can find it I'd love the reminder.
And brother Sing it's only a requirement for one day, you can always borrow one.
We all gotta eat!
I do not know anybody getting rich on sea kayaking nobody does it for that.
Dave just wants me out ther making more paddlers, and having kids is way too slow.
He still let's me pay him for other trips, which I gladly do on occasion.
I pay him extra when I get to rescue folks in bigger conditions than I have ever done a rescue in before. Experience like that with a monstrous back up is what it's all about.
The elders at NSPN are so generous in this reguard and never charge, but it's definietly worth my money to sometimes pay for instruction and trip leadership in big currents and dynamic conditions.
Hey PeterâŚ
my reply was to Kudzuâs, not yours.
Maybe Coffeeâs post on the proper place to click the button was not so bad after all!
cheers,
JackL
I am with you Iceman
After reading all of this nonsense, I was wondering if any one paddles for the shear joy of paddling.
From now on when I am at a put-in and there is someone else putting in, and they ask me if I mind some company, instead of immediately saying sure, I am going to give them a test.
I am going to ask them if they are cerified. If they answer, âyesâ, I am going to tell them they flunked the test, and I would rather them not paddle with me.
Cheers,
JackL
PeterâŚ
I have my own thermos. I don't plan on being certified. I don't need that special thermos that has embossed on it. "BCU 4 star approved gear." ;)
sing
PS. I have never claimed, nor will I ever claim to be anyone's "good leader."
dude
thatâs just lame-o.
steve
YOu might not ever claim to be
but when you are taking out the less experienced Iâm sure you try, in your own way.
Oh, Iâm picking out a Thermos for youâŚ
âOh, Iâm picking out a Thermos for you
Not an ordinary thermos, for you
But the extra-best thermos, you can buy
With vinyl, and stripes, and a cup built right in
Iâm picking out a thermos for you
And maybe a barometer too
And what else can I buy, so on me youâll rely
A rear-end thermometer too!â
Steve Martin in âThe Jerkâ
http://www.moviewavs.com/cgi-bin/moviewavs.cgi?Jerk=thurmas.wav
http://www.moviewavs.com/cgi-bin/mp3s.cgi?Jerk=thurmas.mp3