Garmin - Boo!

Vapor penetration and condensation…
… - which is what you experienced - is different from immersion - which is what the units are rated for.



With temperature, pressure, and humidity variations water vapor can penetrate all but the most heavy duty seals (which you can’t get with such small/cheap devices).



Warning to all you aquapac (love 'em) and other dry bag users: These can actually encourage this sort of failure. A drop or two in the bag will vaporize as it heats up on deck - penetrate the unit as temperatures flux, and condense later when it cools.



My Garmin rides unprotected on deck - in hot salt water - and sees many dunks. No issues.



The weak points are the battery doors. Even these are OK in water. It’s when I leave it sitting in a damp bag or hot car that moisture gets in and corrosion starts. When I remember, I make sure to air the battery compartment out.



My GPSMAP76 is probably tougher than the eTrex, but it’s a few years old now. I’ll replace it soon, as like has already been said - these are electronics with limited lifespans - and it’s given a few warning signs.

Of course . . .
Now that you spell it out - the answer seems so obvious. I couldn’t figure out where the leak was, but vapour is obviously much more pervasive.



Thanks.

PProper protection
I use one of the silica pack in my Aquapak case. Same pack that goes in my underwater camera case.

A True Garmin Story…

– Last Updated: Jun-17-06 11:48 PM EST –


At a store that I worked they offered an extended warranty that would repair or replace the item if it failed. Someone came in with a product that didn’t work and we told them that it would be sent in to see if it could be repaired first. The customer didn’t want to wait for that and walked outside and threw it against a wall, brought it back in pieces... We replaced it on the spot...

Very true
but judging from the replies above, once it gets vapor inside, its on its way out.

For a tough as nails handheld, the Garmin GPS 12 shouldnt be overlooked. Its old, big, heavy and basic, but its tough. In addition to my Etrex that is about a year old and collects water vapor, Ive also got a GPS 12 that is around 7 years old and is bulletproof. I believe it either is or was the handheld GPS choice for the military.

Lowrance
I take my GPS thru whitewater and everything. It is still waterproof.



The target market for Lowrance is fishermen, not backpackers and geo-cachers. So waterproof needs to be waterproof.

Etrex service
I’ve never been that happy with Garmin’s service.



They have a flat fee policy with non-warantee service. I’m disappointed that they didn’t flatly replace your unit that, as you mention is supposedly waterproof (IPX 7).



I had an Etrex Vista that broke the click stick on it, instead of offering me the part that broke, they wanted me to send the stinking unit and $125 to them for them to “fix” it. This is after I already took the unit appart and saw the piece that needed to be replaced. The click stick still worked, just the rubber nob broke off of it. So I opened it up to see if I could jerry rig something, which I eventually did.



I managed to haggle with them to lower the fee to $75 which they did. But it was a PITA to have to haggle with the idiots.



Jay

Very true
I have seem my Pelican boxes fog up due to a drop of water getting inside whilst open. Always keep a packet of silica gel in there to absorb any errant moisture that you trap inside.

Was it still in warranty period?
I think some of the warranty issues listed above, like the waterproof issue Mr Canoehead had, was because the unit was outside its warranty period. You cant very well expect a company to offer warranty repairs long after the stated warranty period has been exceeded.

Out of warantee
It was certainly out of warantee. I didn’t want them to replace it, I wanted to buy the stupid little nub and fix it myself. Garmin said nope, you must pay $125 for a fricken 5 cent piece. And of course, the nitwits in tech support aren’t technical at all, might as well talk to the salesmen at Wally World. I eventually used a soldering iron to glue the plastic piece the nub sits on and stuck a pin in it so I could use the click stick.



Jay

Didn’t do enough homework
Never take a claim like that—from ANYONE—as fact. Look for the basis behind their claim. In this case, you have to check the specifications button and read more. “Waterproof to IPX7 standards”. Yes, the units ARE completely waterproof to IPX7, I’ve dunked mine (intentionally) in the lake while moving ~8-10 mph in a boat. And I know if you had looked at your product materials, it mentions ACCIDENTAL immersion for up to 30 min in 1 meter of water.



Sitting in water in the bottom of your boat for several hours is outside of those guidelines. If you want completely waterproof, look for a unit rated to IPX8. Here’s a hint. You won’t find one–even Trimble units (survey grade) aren’t rated to IPX8.

Oh, I see
I thought you were expecting them to fix it for nothing, you were just trying to get a part from them. I never thought about getting replacement parts.

Cost of parts
Garmin is incorporated in the Cayman Islands, with subsidiraries in Taiwan, USA, and Europe. Most of the parts are made and assembled in Asia, and sold elsewhere. I assume these things are done to keep the cost of production down, and reduce the contribution Garmin has to make to the public good (i.e. taxes).



In any case, I suspect that the “repair” cost would cover an unskilled worker replacing the broken piece with a new unit that cost less to produce than the price of paying a technichian to fix the original.


Yup…
Actually, I wasn’t even going to fix it for $75, I think it was after I believe it did get wet and stopped working. I don’t recall now but I know something else happened to it in my travels and then I eventually took them up on their offer to replace it for $75.



Don’t forget to haggle! :slight_smile:



Jay

garmin vs magellen
I have the etrex as well, although i think it is worth the $100 i paid for it, i wouldn’t submerge it in water.



I wouldn’t even consider a magellen. I have tried many of them as Navi devices in my car, and they just don’t compare to Garmin.

Update
I initially didn’t want to fiddle with the GPS as it is a semi-sealed unit. However, when Garmin assured me that they wanted nothing to do with it, and I would have to pay shipping and repair costs (and in Canada that was $40 just to find out what was wrong with it), I decided to go in.



I pulled off the rubber rim, pried open the case, and removed the display/circuit board. There, I found a tiny bit of corrosion, which I removed with an old toothbrush. The display still wasn’t working, so I then wrapped it in an old towel and baked it in the oven at the lowest heat for about 20 minutes (put garmin in oven, turned oven on to 150, then turned it off and let it warm/dry for 20 minutes)



Finally, I reassembled the whole thing using liberal quantities of Aquaseal Seal Cement (which made a huge mess of it - a different adhesive might be better, like the urethane aquaseal perhaps)



It seems to be working now - the display cleared right up, and the buttons (though harder to push through all the aquaseal, all function). I don’t know if the repair will last, but with nothing to lose, it was worth a try.

Food dehydrator
Glad you got it to work. I was just talking to a friend whose cell phone was caught in a drenching downpour. She used a food dehydrator and brought it back to life. Something to keep in mind.

Yeah
I had an Etrex that got all cloudy behind the screen. I switched to the Garmin MAP76 which really is waterproof. No regrets.

now there’s a proven…
CPR idea for dead GPS’, cell phones, etc. (Results may vary)



PS: Garmin must be doing something right…they’re extremely profitable, have plenty of market share & their stock is about to break 100 (wish I’d bought some).

GPSMAP76Cx
Greyak,



My GPSMAP76 also rides unprotected on deck. No issues either, except occasionally some moisture enters the battery compartment. I open the compartment and let it dry after each trip, no problem.



However, I have recently ordered a GPSMAP76Cx, (color screen, extensible memory). These units now incorporate a memory card that is located in the battery compartment. That concerns me a bit – I’m not sure if I’ll start using an aquapac or not (with a dessicant like silica gel inside).



BTW, the new units have a much improved sensor – and are reported to work well under a full canopy of trees. My old unit would often lose signal in a mangrove tunnel or even on the open ocean, with just my body “blocking” the receiver. I’m looking forward to trying it out. (amazon is running a good deal - $100.00 off, free shipping).



Greg Stamer