Whenever I happen upon a group of obviously new paddlers (kayakers) it’s very common for about half of them paddling with their paddles upside down. I don’t like to be too dogmatic about it, but I can’t help myself and I almost always ask them if they know their paddle is upside down. About half the time the answer is, yes, that’s the way I like it. The others might say, really, how can you tell? Most often, that will be the female paddlers. Of course, that generally leads to an explanation of the paddle design, for which the ladies are grateful, but not the guys. As they paddle away, the guys stubbornly stick with “the way they like it.”
The other thing I just can’t help myself with is giving a quick demo of paddling with torso rotation instead of the arm thing. Again, the ladies seem to appreciate the advice, but most often the men go off more determined than ever to prove how strong their arms are.
There are so many things that I learned for myself by reading, watching videos, live demonstrations and experimenting, but never had anyone volunteer advice. I remember asking for advice a couple of times, but I was told by a very wise and great paddler, “you’ll learn.” I often wonder how I would have reacted to unsolicited advice in the early times.
Yes, I have often seen people paddling with double-bladed paddles with asymmetrical blades holding them upside-down. Unless I am somehow in a role of supervising, advising, teaching, or leading them in some fashion, or they are a personal friend, I keep my mouth shut.
I have learned the hard way that unsolicited advice is often taken poorly regardless of how well-intentioned it may be.
I have often been involved as an assistant trip leader for guided canoe day trips. Some of the individuals on these trips have never been in a canoe before. Understandably, some need, or would benefit from advice on paddling and steering. It has generally been my experience that the females are much more receptive to this than the males, especially if they are teens or very young adults.
I usually keep my mouth shut. I did offer gentleman some advice when I observed that he had his hand too close together, I gently suggested that he try to spread his hands more. He obliged and was stunned by the difference. He admitted to me that it was only his second time paddling.
I have always readily accepted good advice. Tact really helps when offering or receiving it.
If the ‘advisor’ can help out by sounding like a fellow enthusiast instead of an egotistical know-it-all I think the ‘advisee’ is much more receptive. Just speak to folks the way you want to be spoken to. I’m not saying anyone here talks like a know-it-all. I’m sure there are people who don’t want to be corrected regardless of how tactfully it’s done.
Yeah, I’ve seen that a lot. Thinking back, I think you’re right about the difference between the sexes. I don’t recall any backlash from women, but men are as likely as not to either take the advice gracefully, ignore me completely or tell to “mind my own business” or “f-off”. The way I see it, I did the right thing in trying to educate and help someone (good paddling karma); what they choose to do with that is their decision.
I’ve seen upside down paddles many times. Sometimes they were far enough away I didn’t do anything. Maybe two or three times I said something like, “Oh, by the way, your paddle is upside down. It works better right side up.”
I never got a rude response, but one guy responded with, “It felt OK.”
If you think men react defensively to men giving them advice, see how some of them react to a woman giving them advice! Even though not rude, they seem to be put off that a female might know more about something sport-related.
Saw that several times last summer, all involving rental kayaks. Made me wonder why the rental guy didn’t give his customers basic instruction at the launch site. Never said a word because I was never close to those boats. Had I been, maybe I might remark that their paddle will work better with the long edge up, after a bit of friendly chit-chat.
As to technique suggestions, I’m not qualified to give advice. But if anyone asked why I have strips of blue tape on my boat at 10 o’clock and 2, I’d explain.
I have received unsolicited advice: the day I purchased my first kayak (a short fat rec boat), the store employee told me I didn’t need to wear a life jacket. She also told me it was necessary to feather the paddle. I knew she was wrong about the PFD but was too clueless to question the feathering so I wore my PFD and had some crazy angle on the paddle until a local lily dipper told me that was all wrong. That turned out to be a good suggestion.
It’s easier to be gracious than rude. On the other hand, my testosterone level is much lower than a guy’s.
I will offer suggestions to people I don’t know, but before I do, I ask one question…
“Would you like to hear a suggestion that will help you improve your paddling skills”.
If the answer is no; I have nothing left to say, I’m outa there.
If the answer is yes; I offer the suggestion, and volunteer to demonstrate the technique.
I don’t argue, and I don’t get into lengthy discussion, no matter what their answer is.
If they’re drunk; I ignore them.
Have to admit; I love to see them crash & burn…
I only offer advice within our group which often has beginners. I have let people try a good paddle when that is an obvious problem.
The only time I tell anyone something is to wear their PFD, which is a published group rule. Actually, I ask a female member to make tbe “request”. Guys accept her directions better than mine.
I know any unsolicited advice is apt to be ignored or taken badly… So unless I come across someone not wearing a PFD in waters that could be dangerous or holding their paddle upside down AND backward I keep the yap shut.
Holding the paddle upside down is OK in some of the meetups where you paddle two miles in two hours… Not worth the hassle… Sometimes its possible to strike up a conversation about something else and drift the talk toward good paddling technique.
The PFD on the back deck is a thorny thing on a big lake… I suggest they might want to wear it. Usually the reply is they can put it on if they fall in and get it off the back deck… I tell them to try that sometime just for kicks as its harder than they think… particularly if they also hold on to boat and paddle. and then let it go… Sometimes they think about that and put it on… sometimes not.
If it is a club trip and they are not following the rules (like PFD use), I’ll tell them the rules. Otherwise I generally leave them alone. I did tell a couple that they were in the canoe backwards once. The lady in the bow (which was actually the stern) couldn’t figure out why there was no room for her legs, and the guy in the stern (which was actually the bow) kept looking back at all the room behind him. They knew something was wrong, but they couldn’t figure out what.
@eckilson said:
If it is a club trip and they are not following the rules (like PFD use), I’ll tell them the rules. Otherwise I generally leave them alone. I did tell a couple that they were in the canoe backwards once. The lady in the bow (which was actually the stern) couldn’t figure out why there was no room for her legs, and the guy in the stern (which was actually the bow) kept looking back at all the room behind him. They knew something was wrong, but they couldn’t figure out what.
Oh, you must have been there the day I took my daughter and her husband out.
My wife, the trip leader often as not, gives advice to both sexes and often gets little results out of both. The women are just more gracious about it and do the same thing as before after a short try.
It took many of us awhile to know we had our blades upside down. For the most part, it’s not like Driver’s Ed, where you get instruction before going out. And that’s a good thing.
I’ve never found offering unsolicited advice to be particularly helpful. Sometimes the urge to be helpful overcomes my best intentions, but I can’t remember the last time it actually worked out well.
I used to fish solo in a canoe a lot. In that case, I did sit in the front seat and turn 180 degrees…but I was solo. That helps my weight be closer to the center. I see people soloing and sitting in the back seat…with the bow sticking way up! I just chuckle to myself and keep going.
The thing I notice is when a kayak club heads out with new members, they NEVER teach the new people how to paddle and the older people take off leaving the new paddlers to flounder and do the best they can.
@RikJohnson said:
The thing I notice is when a kayak club heads out with new members, they NEVER teach the new people how to paddle and the older people take off leaving the new paddlers to flounder and do the best they can.
@RikJohnson said:
The thing I notice is when a kayak club heads out with new members, they NEVER teach the new people how to paddle and the older people take off leaving the new paddlers to flounder and do the best they can.
You need to find a better club.
This problem has two sides.
In both clubs we rate our paddles in a 1 thru 4 skill and condition rating (1 = beginner). Often as not nobody comes to the level 1 and 2 paddles and some level 1 paddlers come to the level 3 and 4 paddles. At one club the members will request training or specifically assisted rescues. You schedule the training, people signed up and no one showed up. Its frustrating for the trip leader to get that kind of response. Even more so when a level 1or 2 paddler tells you he ignores the trip level ratings and just goes anyway.
In some events we split the group and do a short level 2 while the big group goes off on the level 3 paddle at a higher distance and speed. The main problem is that you have to put a “old” member with the new ones to do the shorter, slower paddle.
I think many of us were attracted to paddle sports because we perceived the activity as something we could do independently or with a group of personal friends/family. In reality it is safer to paddle in a group of similarly or better skilled individuals.
The Aca suggests that the simplicity of the appearance of design of canoes and kayaks may lead many to incorrectly believe that paddling the boats is also a simple endeavor.
As you venture out into more demanding environments you will be more likely to seek out help. However, I believe at all levels, and in all environments, even in the less intense situations, that we all can benefit from working with a more experienced group or coach.
Most of us will choose the instant gratification of a trip rather than the practice a skills clinic provides. However if paddling is something we do regularly, we would be wise to invest in our skills Many of us will spend time, money, and effort on new boats, gear, and travel destinations but skip the instruction. I’ve been particularly guilty of that to my own detriment.
But there is something nice about being able to pursue a hobby/sport without being judged by someone else. As my physicality decreases I find my need for skill increases and thus the need for help. Many of us don’t want paddling to be a competitive experience or if we do compete, we only want to compete with ourselves. The great thing about paddle sport is the individual gets to decide their own goals and determine their own measure of success. For many that may mean climbing the ladder of difficulty, For me, I’m just trying to hang on and not slide off one of the few the remaining rungs toward the bottom of the ladder.
Sometimes I find myself paddling with my own paddle being upside down. No big deal, I just turn it around when I do notice. I have to look closely at the foot cups to determine the bow from the stern on my raft. Again no big deal.
As far as help goes- I’m all about it, especially if you’re offering to help carry my boat.!
