That’s it? You’re going to hang your hat on that link to call everyone else clueless?
The study was first published in December 2020, three years ago, a lifetime in terms of virology research. It was 72 patients studied. The study itself says it is preliminary and that larger studies would be required to validate it.
A year later and NIH, JAMA, NEJOM, etc, are all reporting its ineffectiveness based on the more and larger studies your smoking gun called for.
And the vaxxes are safe and effective too. 
No trust here for the “healthcare” system since 2019, but we are all free to believe what we will.
Cheers.
Ivermectin is a very effective antiparasitic drug for both humans and animals when given in the appropriate dosage. It has not been shown to have antiviral properties in an overwhelming number of properly run studies to date. Studies have to be large enough to account for the fact that many people will recover from Covid naturally without any drug intervention.
Ivermectin carries some risk of liver damage and GI upset, even in therapeutic doses.
Yes, they are safe and effective. Period.
Whether you respect the science or the conspiracy theorists is your choice.
My wife and I both had the shots both had Covid. My wife lost sense of taste for 2 weeks, mine was like a cold. Friends of ours the whole family had it much worse. Their son who was very fit and active and had all the shots was hospitalized and now has long term covid and can’t work.
A lot of people may have had it and probably did not even know it. In my opinion the “lock down and mandatory mask” accomplished nothing. But that is another topic for another thread.
I am neither “clueless” nor offering “opinion” in my dismissal of ivermectin.
To begin with, I worked as a lab tech at a university connected research institute for a pharmacologist in which part of my job was to locate, review and collate synopses for him of other researchers’ peer-reviewed white papers to support the projects he was working on, so I know how to drill down to find and read the most current findings in medical research on any subject.
Regarding covid (and for any important health related subject) I don’t rely on mainstream media, the babbling of politicians and talking heads or anecdotal gossip from neighbors to inform myself on the safest protocols and practices. I’m fortunate to still be able to access research publications since my ex-boyfriend (board certified ER doc and pathology clinician) shared his login and password with me to source white paper databases which are not on public platforms. I can see which timely investigations have passed quality reviews and what data has been derived from them.
And I have family members from whom I can source best-practiceinformation who are board-certified pharmacists working in major hospitals compounding and dispensing, also friends in hard science, among them a PhD biochemist who has authored over 300 papers on the affects of various chemical compounds on mammalian and human cells. My first cousin, Dr. Tris Parslow, who recently retired as dean emeritus of Pathology at the Emory University medical school, was also consultant to the National Institute of Health on viral diseases since he is a leading expert in RNA viruses who worked on the early research in deciphering HIV-AIDS and developing treatments for that and for the original SARS-2 outbreaks (he oversaw one of the teams that developed a vaccine for that.) I trust what these folks have to say.
Thanks for your “opinions”, but I think I’ll stick to what my pretty legit sources have shared about the relative virtues of any potential preventive or treatment.
Might want to remind some of you about the outcomes of some popular “miracle drugs” of the past, thalidomide in the 1950s and laetrile in the 1970s.
Wife and I have had it once. Very tired and mild fever for two days.
Some “miracle drugs” are truly miraculous (think penicillin, Salk’s polio vaccine, and yes, the MRNA Covid vaccines …) but many more are not … except to the bank accounts of their huckster promoters. It’s not always easy to tell the difference except through the rear view mirror so, like @willowleaf, I too will stick with advice from legit sources. They’re not 100% infallible, but they’re a much better bet than the alternatives.
Now, what am I going to do with all those apricot pits I’ve hoarded these last fifty years?
Supplements help and due to longstanding date with Crohns I have taken more than most for over 40 years now. Only diff as I got older was that the doctors started recommending more of them that I was already taking. And around 70 they upped my daily for Vitamin D.
But I also happen to think that we know far too little about what leaves some more naturally resistent. And that if we really knew that answer I would have those attributes. Even accounting for getting the vaccine, I seem able to walk thru the valley of CoVid and not get it, at least not a case that goes symptomatic. With others around having acted similarly and getting the same meds getting it.
I am not a super hero. Something physically present has to be helping out.
I had Covid in 2021 in Maine. I picked it up from another coworker. For 2 weeks I had a slight fever and light headache. I am not vaccinated. Covid doesn’t bother me, the flu on the other hand scares me.
Ironically enough, I’ve had it twice despite having had all vaccines, boosters…. First time was the Delta strain and I became quite ill quickly. Fortunately my physician got me into a hospital for the monoclonal antibody infusion. 36 hours later; no symptoms.
Second time was just about the same as a mild cold.
It isn’t that ironic - the vaccines don’t completely stop you from getting it, but can make it much milder when you do. If you get a mild case that doesn’t last very long, it’s less dangerous for you and less likely that you will pass it on.
The Delta strain was also much more virulent than the strains that came after as it had a much greater propensity to descend to the lower respiratory tract.
My wife and I are both fully vaccinated and boosted. So far, we’ve been Covid free although we’ve been lucky as many friends and family have had it. None have had anything other than mild cases though.
My theory on natural covid resistance: While SARS coronavirus 2 is novel, it does share some protein similarities with the 4 endemic coronaviruses. Given the random nature of the human antibody and T-cell library (generated from a few genes to millions of possibilities in each individual by active enzymatic mutation of lymphocyte DNA), it is likely that some individuals, in mounting an immune defense to the common cold, happened upon a T-cell receptor or antibody which also bound adequately to some component of the covid virus.
Are you talking about a degree of cross immunity?
A lot of the IVM studies were designed with dosage and duration problems.
I would characterize the IVM results as “mixed.” In any case, it is not the FDAs role to tell physicians they can’t prescribe it. The root of many of our problems is regulatory capture.
Fortunately, Europe recognizes the superior robustness of natural immunity.
Keep an eye on the excess deaths and which countries this is occurring and what the temporal associations are.
How legit has Pfizer been with safety data in the past? I use medications on occasion but I prefer to observe the Phase lV trials (post marketing surveillance)
Pfizer does not share their data with regulators and I believe we need independent regulatory oversight. We have a revolving door which is the definition of regulatory capture.
Had the discussion about vax status at my annual visit to my primary care doc last week’s doc visit last week. He is on the same page as me - vaccines are generally a good thing. Hesitations about the RSV shot only, not recommending it unless someone is in a crucial risk group. He does not like the numbers on AFIB.
Re the most current CoVid shot, his take is that it won’t hurt but also does not accomplish as much against the current state of the disease as earlier ones. Because the shot is about 40% effective and what it is preventing is basically a head cold these days, not the earlier variants of CoVid that aggressively attacked peoples’ lung capacity.
Interestingly we did find something that was worth giving me. Short of shots for traveling to more exotic parts of the world like typhoid or a fresh polio shot, there isn’t much to find for me. I even got the shouldbelifetime Hep A and B series in 2005. Figured that if I ever was going to need them I did not want to bother with having to go get them again ahead of a given trip. But it turns out there is a newer version of what was the new pneumonia shot I got a few or several years ago, when we did the “new” one and the older one at a year interval from each other. This one is an upgrade from the older new one, the name ends in 20 rather than 15. Had an annoying post nasal drip (no, not CoVid been testing my arse off) chasing me for the next several days after that shot.
I am guessing it found some immunity capacity worth boosting.
Yes, whether or not to recommend a vaccine, or any medical intervention, has to be based on the risk:benefit ratio, individualized to the patient, and administered with the patient’s informed consent. The only exceptions to these rules would apply when the patient is not competent to make an informed decision. Unfortunately, this government’s highly-politicized approach to the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic has violated all of these principles.
Blanket recommendations have been made regardless of age and individual risk factors, and an accurate risk:benefit analysis has been made difficult to impossible because of the way the governmental agencies have filtered and sometimes censored potential risks and also magnified potential benefits during the latter part of the pandemic. Serious risks need to be disclosed, even if their occurrence is quite rare, for an individual to give informed consent.
One thing is very clear, the risk:benefit ratio has changed dramatically during the course of the pandemic because the serious risks of infection have greatly diminished as the virus mutated and evolved. Another factor that shifted the risk;benefit ratio is the fact that the great majority of individuals in the US have now acquired immunity, either through prior infection, or vaccination, or both. Just because you have not had symptoms of covid-19 infection does not mean you have not had it. Subclinical infections are not uncommon. This government continues to ignore the protective benefit of naturally-acquired immunity even now, despite the fact that multiple large studies have indicated that naturally-acquired immunity or hybrid immunity is probably much more durable than immunity conferred by immunization alone.
You are probably aware that the approach to the pandemic taken by other western nations has been dramatically different from that taken in the US. Take the latest covid vaccine as an example. Switzerland made the news by not recommending further vaccination of its general population this Spring and Summer. France also stopped recommending further vaccination this year and Denmark did so last year.
Here is a paper that is worth reading.
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/eci.14136
It is a population-based, retrospective, observational study done in Austria that looked at the effectiveness of a fourth dose of the covid-19 vaccine in preventing death or infection of previously-infected individuals. The total number of patients included in the study was 3,986,312. Of these, 1,545,242 had received three doses of the vaccine and 281,291 had received a fourth dose. The remainder had received zero, one, or two doses. The study was conducted between November 1 and December 31, 2022 with extended follow-up to June 2023. The study compared relative risk of death attributed to SARS-CoV-2 infection and risk of infection for individuals who had received four, three, or fewer doses of vaccine. The study was published in the European Journal of Clinical Investigation, a well-recognized, peer-reviewed publication.
All of these individuals had some degree of acquired immunity even in those who had received no vaccine since they had all had prior infection. The total number of deaths among these 3,986,312 the number of deaths attributed to SARS-CoV-2 infection during the two month period of initial follow up was 69 total among all groups and the number of confirmed infections was 89,056 for a case:fatality rate of only .0011%, reflective of the greatly-reduced virulence of the predominant virus strains by this point in the pandemic. Comparing the risk of death from infection between the three or fewer vaccine and the four vaccine cohort groups, the observed rate in the four vaccine group was actually a bit higher (0.1 per 100,000 patient-days) than in the three or fewer vaccine groups (0.02 for three vaccines and 0.01 for fewer than three vaccine doses). Because of the overall small number of deaths this difference is of questionable significance, but there was no evidence that a fourth dose of vaccine protected against death from covid-19 infection in this very large study group.
As for protection against infection conferred by a fourth dose of vaccine, the results are very interesting. A fourth dose of vaccine did reduce risk of infection modestly by 17% within the two month primary period of observation. But this protective benefit diminished rapidly over time with peak benefit observed at 3-5 weeks after receiving the fourth dose. When the same individuals were followed up until June 2023 the infection rate in the four vaccine dose cohort was 17% greater overall than that for the three or less dose cohorts 95% CI:-15-19%).
So the bottom line in this study was that in previously-infected individuals who had received three doses of vaccine, a fourth dose did not reduce the risk of covid-19 death. A fourth dose did modestly diminish the risk of covid-19 infection (by 17%) for a few weeks, but on extended follow up the four dose individuals actually had a higher observed rate of infection.
Three months since my latest shot. Likely not the 4th for me because I also qualify for the extra ones between Crohns and age.
BUT - I have had CoVid all around me again for a month now. I generally get word that I have been with someone who tested positive the morning after I was working with them. No symptoms at the time so no one masking.
I still test religiously negatory. I got all the free kits I could from the feds in the last two rounds. I could afford another window or I will have to actually buy the things.