has some really purty ones.
I started with a monster Werner San Juan, then a carbon Camano, but haven’t used a Werner for years. It’s not that I don’t like their quality, they don’t make any Greenland paddles or wing paddles, so they currently don’t make anything that I prefer to use. I would be interested if they branched out into other paddle types, but those markets might be “too niche” for them (and unprofitable).
Sure…and I don’t use any racks but Yakima. Yet I’m about to put Thule bed racks and Hullivators on my truck.
I only have five paddles, three euro and two gp. Canoecopia is in a couple months, I will see what catches my eye. 
@gstamer said:
I started with a monster Werner San Juan, then a carbon Camano, but haven’t used a Werner for years. It’s not that I don’t like their quality, they don’t make any Greenland paddles or wing paddles, so they currently don’t make anything that I prefer to use. I would be interested if they branched out into other paddle types, but those markets might be “too niche” for them (and unprofitable).
I switch off between one of my GP’s, an ONNO wing, and a Werner Kalliste. I generally prefer a GP, but I go faster with the wing/high stroke. Also, the Kalliste and the GP’s are all about the same length 220 cm, and I use a very similar low stroke, except that the Kalliste grabs the water much earlier in stroke. It is a superb paddle, and very light.
@gjf12:
No reason you can’t use a high stroke, or even “wing” technique with a GP.
In Greenland GPs aren’t used as “low angle” only paddles, rather you adjust the paddle angle depending on how much speed you want – low = energy saving, more stability and slower, high is more effort, less stable, but faster.
Many Greenlanders I’ve observed hold their paddle at about 45 degrees for normal touring, and higher when sprinting.
Best,
Greg Stamer
@gstamer said:
I started with a monster Werner San Juan, then a carbon Camano, but haven’t used a Werner for years. It’s not that I don’t like their quality, they don’t make any Greenland paddles or wing paddles, so they currently don’t make anything that I prefer to use. I would be interested if they branched out into other paddle types, but those markets might be “too niche” for them (and unprofitable).
I’ve been thinking about the “too niche” I’m not so sure that the Greenland Paddle fits this. Everyone says it does …but it seems as tho this is more because it s promoted by no major or even minor production paddle company the has a store distribution system. I believe that the wing will always be the elite racers choice or at least among their choices.
The GP however fits the cruising class and like the modern Euro , it has actually gained quite a foothold. Hundreds of small cottage industry mail order business have been filling the gap. Even without any store distribution, the GP has claimed quite a following. I believe that it is becoming more and more mainstream. Companies such as Werner are just cruising with what they have always made and ignoring the GP hoping it just “goes away”. They make what they understand. If Werner were to actually make a quality GP {not one designed by a committee} and promote it the way they have their other offerings …The GP would be soon seen as mainstream
It does promote GP paddle making classes and GP cottage industries to have it thought of as a niche item. which is not all bad. But other that “everyone” saying it is “too niche” I’m not really convinced that it still fits in that category.
Best Wishes
Roy
@gstamer said:
@gjf12:
No reason you can’t use a high stroke, or even “wing” technique with a GP.
Maybe you can, but a GP is not ideal for a wing stroke. A wing paddle is better for a wing stroke than a GP. And a GP is better than a wing for a low angle cruising stroke.
My ONNO is adjustable between 205 and 215 cm. I find 205 MUCH easier to get good wing stroke form than 215. My GP’s and my Werner Kalliste are all about 220 cm, and are all much harder to use in a high stroke than my 205 cm wing. YMMV.
Kalliste blade is not shared for high angle strike and I find it very uncomfortable when used like that.
@gjf12, sorry but I disagree, there is nothing about a GP that lends itself to favor a low-angle stroke, that’s a common misconception. A GP works low, medium or high angle , no problem, due to its symmetry and depending on your technique. That said, longer paddles will often favor a lower stroke and short paddles a high stroke, to facilitate burying the blade to the correct depth, but that’s a fit issue. A GP can be long, short, narrow or even relatively wide (5-6" wide among some racers in Greenland).
Roy produced an adjustable-length GP for me, that is very sweet. I’m definitely a fan of adjustable length – it’s gives you a lot more options.
@gstamer said:
@gjf12, sorry but I disagree, there is nothing about a GP that lends itself to favor a low-angle stroke, that’s a common misconception. A GP works low, medium or high angle , no problem, due to its symmetry and depending on your technique. That said, longer paddles will often favor a lower stroke and short paddles a high stroke, to facilitate burying the blade to the correct depth, but that’s a fit issue. A GP can be long, short, narrow or even relatively wide (5-6" wide among some racers in Greenland).
Greg, I know you use both wings and GP’s. Are not your wings shorter than your GP’s? Therefore does not your longer GP favor a lower stroke over the higher stroke of the shorter wing? I opine that is not the design of the GP that favors the lower stroke vs the wing, but the generally longer length of the GP.
Werner made a Wing. It was called the Pegasus made specifically for the '86 Olympic spring racers. It would be heavy by today’s standards and it was a big blade arrangement. Not something for all day touring.
As to Werner making a GP, unlikely. I’ve asked over the years. How many with Pelicans, sit on tops or other rec kayak paddlers are going to look at a GP and think “That’s not a paddle.” Some niches are worth pursuing, like something of the whitewater/wildwater racing niche that has redeveloped hence the Werner Odachi. From my perspective, GP enthusiasts carve their own for that perfect fit or go with a super light arrangement like Gear Lab or Superior Paddles.
See you on the water,
Marshall
The Connection, Inc.
Hyde Park, NY
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The Greenland paddle I usually use is 2 cm longer than the Euro paddle I use {when I use one} This is not really a determining issue as to use a low stroke over a high angle stroke…many people out there may not actually be using the proper length or width etc for their body dimensions and their stroke style. Most people are really just guessing or asking a paddle maker to guess as to what size they should use. When sized properly there are not limitations as mentioned here in this thread. Strokes and maneuvers such as hanging draws or side slipping are done the same without tripping over length. If these limits are being found then a person should re-evaluate their chosen paddle size. Same with if your paddle is too fatiguing over the miles. Or if the paddle doesn’t allow a smooth continuous stroke
@roym said:
When sized properly there are not limitations as mentioned here in this thread. Strokes and maneuvers such as hanging draws or side slipping are done the same without tripping over length. If these limits are being found then a person should re-evaluate their chosen paddle size. Same with if your paddle is too fatiguing over the miles. Or if the paddle doesn’t allow a smooth continuous stroke
This is also a problem with Euro paddle sizing…but as seen by the paddlers comments in this and many other threads…the paddling community as a whole is rather use to just trying a different paddle when it involves a Euro paddle. With a Greenland paddle , The people trying one out just to see, tend to make many assumptions without trying several different paddles that are all called Greenland paddles… Most GP makers only make one style of GP…there are basically three different styles , that all feel slight different when used.
The style seen mostly is the 1850’s and newer style where the blade tapers from the shoulder to the tip as a single line . The widest point of the blade is at the tip. The second most common style has a taper from the shoulder for a distance , then the sides of the blade run parallel until the tip. The third and least common is a variation of the paddle with the parallel sides , only towards the tip, the blade tapers down and becomes narrower. The last style tends to be the quietest and most efficient for distances…