Kayak for expedition - need help

How about an Island Kayaks Expedition

– Last Updated: Feb-04-08 7:09 PM EST –

Not many left in the US but great price for a responsive fiberglass boat with ample room for expeditions. I suspect the added agility may be helpful in the waters you mention. There is a Low Volume version as well if you are going "backpack" light that might fit your build.

Even with shipping would probably be less than the Delta and on par with most quality roto boats. You can use the search function on this site and enter Island Kayaks Expedition and get some relevant threads.

http://virginiaseakayakcenter.com/island_kayaks.htm

2nd that
There nice kayaks and for 1399 almost new demos.

There standard version & LV, can’t go wrong &

really nice layups. If I was closer I would have

picked up LV expedition.


Can anyone recommend any good expedition worthy boats in plastic?



Prijon Kodiak. I agree with above. Works for Jon Turk and 11k miles with Renata Chlumska, should works for what you;re thinking about MAX.

Valley, Necky, Wildy, CD… Boats
RM Valley Aquanaut and Nordkapp, Necky Chatham 17, Wilderness Systems Tempest 170, Current Designs Sirocco… all all good boats that are fully expedition capable.

scratch the chatham
Chatham 17 is way too low volume for expedition work. And the sirocco is too slow for my liking if you actually plan to cover a lot of miles.

Chatham 18 is big
I’d be curious to compare a Ch17 to other hulls. Yes it’s low freeboard but the sinkage rate, how much weight it takes to sink it down 1" may not reflect a low volume hull. The glass boat has a bit more freeboard.

Chilco vs. Quest
Yes, I considered the Chilco, but unfortunately I couldn’t find any used, and the full retail price is a bit over my budget. The Chilco is actually 22.5" in beam, compared to the Quest’s 20.5"; which I would think will make the Quest even more tippy!

Nigel Dennis
Yes, Nigel Dennis, not Harris :stuck_out_tongue: My apologies - type too fast, think too little :stuck_out_tongue:



I am also very surprised that the total volume for the Explorer is stated as being so low - considering that almost all the Seaward boats are 160L and up, compared the the Explorer’s 150

Chatham 17
I agree, the Chatham 17 is a tiny boat; great for day paddles or playing around in rock gardens or the surf, but it will not hold much gear…



I was told the same goes for the Tempest 170 - it’s definitely a bigger boat but the plastic has very fat foam bulkheads which take up lots of room - I do not think you will be able to get away packing it with gear for a 2-3wk unsupported trip

Nordkapp - wow! Volume?
Wow; that looks like a really great boat! Do you know if someone on the north west coast sells them (British Columbia/Washington)??



I wasn’t able to find actual volume measurements for the boat; do you know how much it is in Liters? How does it compare to something like the Nimbus TelkwaSport or similar 17’ boats?

Chatham 19 & 17

– Last Updated: Feb-05-08 4:31 AM EST –

>I meant Chatham 18 & 17<

Feel like very different hulls to me - though Salty is more familiar with the Chatham series.

More boats, more options!!
Hey everyone, thanks so much for all the input; I feel like I learned an entire encyclopedia worth about kayaks over the past week!! :smiley:



Looking around I’ve found quite a few used glass boats that I am considering.



Options now opened up but I’m having a hard time trying to narrow the list down, any ideas/recommendations from the list below:


  • TelkwaSport (I know this one is quite roomy, how well does it compare in rough water/speeed to some of the narrower Seaward boats such as the Chilco or Ascante?)
  • Nigel Dennis Explorer - this boat looks like it can move fast and handle some rough conditions. Any ideas on the volume?
  • Seaward Chilco (I know this is a nice boat but I think it’s on the low volume end of things as far as expedition boats go)
  • Ascente (I hear it’s a great tracker but not as maneuverable as some boats)
  • Saguenay - Boreal Designs (no idea about this one)
  • Solstice GTH



    I’m leaning towards the Nimbus TelkwaSport - it’s a beautiful looking boat and definitely has lots of room I would say; main concern is ability to handle the rough stuff as well as speed…



    Looks like I’m back and step one and trying to narrow the list down again; oh well, options don’t hurt!

NDK Explorer
The Explorer has been used for more notable expeditions over the past dozen years than one can count.



It is a very reassuring boat. It can handle anything. It has plenty of volume for your purposes - or anyones for that matter.



The Explorer has become the reference point for many paddlers when discussing an expedition length boat.

NDK Explorer

– Last Updated: Feb-05-08 11:33 AM EST –

There are a bunch of boats that have similar drag coefficients once they are at a comfortable cruising speed. The Explorer is not the spriteliest of them to get to that point on the flats, the Valley Aquanaut is probably better there. The Aquanaut seems to have less of a following on this side of the Atlantic, but has replaced the Explorer for many coaches and guides in the UK.

However, just to completely confound the discussion, I know of a number of people who say that the Explorer is faster in conditions and messy stuff because of its greater manuverability than the real hard fast trackers. My best summary of the explanation is that it handles really messy conditions with more aplomb than a hard tracker that will lose a lot of inertia from being knocked hard around and having to be set back on course.

I do NOT state this as anything scientific. It's just what I've heard - which probably means that MAX will hear it too. The engineers and designers can argue about whether it is hallucinatory.

The Valley Aquanaut is stiffer than the Explorer and still handles conditions beautifully in the opinion of anyone I know who has paddled it. It just gets real solid. That said, it is also a boat that really wants a lot of edge to turn in closer quarters like around rocks/surf. That characteristic is one of the contributing reasons for my husband to add the Nordkapp LV to the fleet.

There is one expedition consideration to mention - not a reason against the Explorer but it does require a little advance planning on gear. The Explorer has at the largest 10 inch round hatches, as opposed to the ovals that many other manufacturers use. The ovals make it easier to get longer and wider objects into the bulkhead. Using the Explorer involves smaller components because of the hatches, for example separating the tent poles from the tent or skipping that really cushy camp chair.

re. Solstice series

– Last Updated: Feb-05-08 11:03 AM EST –

The Solstice series like the Necky Arluk series are kind of signature designs of two old builders of glass boats. Hard tracking with distinct features. I had a Solstice 15yrs ago. The very fine and long ends with wide broad midsection makes for a twitchy transitions in stability in rough water. I took one on a trip in Mexico and paddled it in S.F.Bay a lot.
I'd rather paddle a QCC400 or CD Extreme/Nomad

volume
a kayaks capacity to carry weight is reflected in the volume of the HULL , I wonder if the volume measurments you are looking at reflect a measurment of AIR above the sheer.



You could have two kayaks with identical interior volume measurments but with different hull shapes and very different ability to carry the same weight.

RM T-!70
I’ve owned and paddled a T-170 since 2003 and am quite satisfied with it–I use it for day paddles and expeditions up to 5 days and find it has plenty of storage space–in fact the more stuff in it, the better the boat paddles–when empty it sits a little high in the water and has a tendancy to lee cock in windy(20+knots conditions) but this can be corrected with the proper technique(bow rudder to windward followed by forward sweep on leeward side–repeat as needed) I would add that this is not a problem when the boat is loaded with gear. And the downwind and beam wind headings are no problem at all. Very little weathercocking and if it is a problem simply deploy the skeg about halfway. The other good thing about the RM version of the boat is the price—retails for around 1600 now but if you shop the end of the season sales you can get a lot off—Mine retailed for about 1550 in 2003, bought it brand new in October of O3 for $896.00–difference between RM and FG is that FG glides better—whether it glides 1500–2000 dollars better is a matter for your personal style and wallet. As far as durability goes, my boat has not oilcanned and still retains its origninal shape—despite very heavy usage. The other boats suggested here are all good boats but for the money, you really get a good deal on the Tempest

just guessing
but I think the 170 has more volume than an Explorer

Maxx
I did that trip and several others in BC and Alaska of many nautical miles in a Romany 16 and I had plenty of room. I now paddle a CH 16 and have plenty of room, as I would in a CH 17, or the non-market boat I paddle.



I prefer smaller more playful kayaks to bigger longer hulls, and I frequently pulled 40+ nautical mile days in slow boats :slight_smile:



But others here know better than I!



Here’s my advice which you can take with a grain of “salt”.


  1. Your ass will be in whatever boat for a LONG time. You will encounter big water. Get whatever boat you feel at one with and works the most naturally for you. Forget the specs. They mean almost nothing to what you’ll average a day. Forget “speed” and focus on handling, comfort. At the end of each day you’re true speed differences would be marginal anyway, so get what feels right.


  2. Once you find said boat adjust your gear to work with it. Most pack way to much crap and the truth is that many with strong opinions have very very little true expedition time to their credit. Before the almighty Explorer folk were paddling Nordkapps all over the mud ball, and still are… And, hard as it may be to believe, there are people paddling on extended trips right now in boats people here in the USA have never heard of!



    Explorer is great, and may be your boat (hatches are fine for packing), but I for example much preferred the Romay, or an Avocet, etc.



    Talk to people with legitimate experience, try many boats, follow your own instincts, and go for it. Believe me, on the north side of the Brooks in a 15 ft. sea you won’t be thinking about this or that boat! You want the one that handles best for you.



    Pack like an alpinist, carry two tarps in a bag in front of your feet (one tarp always over tent, other a cook,camp shelter), snacks in ditty bag on your lap, all food in day hatch to isolate it and keep weight central. (that’s going to freak people out)…Plenty of room. If any of these boats is too small for your gear, re-think your gear! Also, going light helps with bad landings, and hauling the loaded boat etc. Soon you’ll understand.



    Need anymore help email me. Enjoy.

that’s me, a little experience
that’s why I recommended he talk to people who have actually used the boats in those conditions with those loads. The Chatham 17 doesn’t feel tiny.