Check out the Jackson All-Water
Due out in March:
http://www.jacksonkayak.com/articlesrec/article.cfm?article=200812081
All-Water
the profile and dimensions of that All-Water look a lot like the Dagger Approach!
I will try to demo a crossover this may
rocky mountain adventures has some approaches in their showroom. hopefully I can get my hands on one at their absolutley fun demos. Currently, in larimer county, I’d say RMA is the best kayak retailler. Great selection of boats and gear, not to mention the best demos. Their demos are just PACKED. hundreds of people, and like 80 boats. However, when we first went there it smelled like natural gas. I e-mailed them and told them about it, and they said thats the “new kayak smell”!! LOL, thats interesting, since I never smelled that at any other kayak store, and my kayak didnt smell like that when I got it. of course, the smell disapears a few weeks after the e-mail. They could of just admitted it. New kayak smell?? Seriously??
I wouldn’t say so.
Corran designed the Sun Kayaks (soon
became Riot kayaks) Velocity and flight for that purpose about 8 years ago…
there was 2 version s of each boat bulkheaded/skegged/hatched and the basic no frills versions…
they were 13’…
i would not hesitate to take the rockhopper into a class 2 river…with its flat hull i can spin on a dime to catch a small surf on a a wave…
i am interested to see teh All-Water…i have chatted with EJ about it a bit…see what happens…
Fluid has one too
I can’t remember model name but it is a big boat with a big hatch in back. Never paddled one but I did see one with the open hatch at Gauleyfest with a prodigious amount of Bud on ice
different perspective
there are a handful of plastic sea kayaks that would work fine as river running touring boats, better than this new LL boat and the others mentioned. for many of the rivers that people are running rivers with in canoes, the WS Tempest, Valley boats, etc, would be great choices, but don’t expect to hit micro eddies or front surf steep waves. i think it’s all in the approach one takes to the river. i see some of the “white water” canoes that Wenonah makes, and they seem like slightly detuned flatwater haulers to me, and the assumption is that the paddlers are practicing point and shoot river running techniques, not Dagger Caption-esque sport tandem play. same goes for kayaks. i wouldn’t hesitate to run a large volume pool and drop river in a plastic sea kayak, if tripping was the goal. smaller, tighter rivers, would require the XP and it’s peers.
The All Water 9 is my size : )
The All Water 9:
Length 9"4"
Width 25.75
Height 13.5"
Optimum Weight Paddler 155 lbs
Maybe that’ll be the river kayak that I like.
Hopefully, I’ll get to test paddle one.
agreed
the Tempest is ideal for river running, it’s my favorite big kayak. I’m amused sometimes when people tell me I can’t run a river in a 17’ sea kayak. Well, why not? Is it any harder to run a rapid in a moderately rockered Tempest than it is with a moderately rockered 16’ or 17’ Old Town Tripper? People have been running Class III rivers for centuries with 16 and 17 foot canoe but its only just recently catching on with sea kayaks. It’s easier with a Tempest and similar sea kayaks because they are more manuverable and more sea worthy than most canoes, even the ones with fabric spray covers. Snapping a Tempest into a boat length eddy is easy, doing it with a 16 or 17 foot canoe is hard. Dedicated whitewater canoes of course are in most cases more manuverable, but when the Tempest can turn out 5 knot speeds on the flats the ww canoes will struggle to make 3 knots.
for sure, and how bout some others
if one didn’t want a really long skinny boat for bigger water, there are a number of quality cross over touring boats like the WS Tsunami’s that are shorter and wider, higher volume often than the narrower sea boats which would be great for carrying gear. mind you, i like canoeing and river running in a canoe, so that would be my choice most the time. easy in and out, nice view down river, easier to portage. all depends on the river, the party and objectives of course.
tradeoffs
My problem with some of the shorter, wider boats is that they’re harder to edge at my weight, and often have litle or no rocker to maximize tracking. I can turn faster in my 16’ Avocet than in some shorter boats I’ve tried because I’m comfortable laying it over.
Fusion from Pyranha - spring 09
skeg, hatch, touring WW - fun - forgiving
more soon.
Pyranha - Asheville
Thanks!
It’s great to see this new generation of hybrid boats. For years we’ve been saying “don’t run whitewater in a rec boat”, but there haven’t been many good options for folks who wanted something with more versatility than a whitewater river-runner. Now there are a lot more to choose from.
Didn’t Wavesport just make a Fusion?
Here’s all I can find on the Pyranha Fusion, looks interesting, so does the Speeder. What’s it like to paddle a Speeder?
http://www.hbcanoekayak.co.uk/Kayak-Pyranha.html
you guys think the Remix is big??
not compared to my Pamlico 140. I have a pretty large kayak I geuss.
Problem = 2 BIG + 2 small
They are too long for “playboating” & too short for tripping in a straight line at any reasonable speed (even compared to your Pamlico).
They are just right for going downriver with some load though…
Remix XP is ideal for what it was made
to do, and that’s haul a big paddler and a big load on a whitewater camping trip. Cruising speed of 3.5 mph with the skeg down is pretty good for pools in a whitewater river like the New River Gorge from Sandstone to Fayette Station. Excellent camping boat for rivers like that where the longest pool is 1 mile long and the rapids are big and boisterous Class II-III-IV, but totally too slow for flat water cruising. BTW, I once used a Pamlico tandem as a solo for a long river trip and it worked really well. Fast enough, turns pretty good, and carried me and my gear easily. I just had to watch the wave trains to keep the splash out. There is a big skirt that has 3 openings so you can paddle solo or tandem. The skirt was pretty loose and only worked if the gear was piled high enough to hold the skirt up from imploding. While we’re on the subject of possible river running touring boats how about this Old Town Cayuga in the boat sweepstakes? Anyone ever paddled one of them?
Yep, the 146 and 160
excellent kayaks. Fast and effiecent. Suitable for long distances.
Most of us don’t rush through the pools
in the New River Gorge. We can use a little extra time to think about what we have to do in the next rapid.
Of course there would be no reason to use an XP10 for the New River Gorge unless that was the only kayak one happened to own.
XP10, Old Town
The shops around here won’t get XP10s until early May. Old Town seems to be getting out of the touring/light touring kayak business. The Cayuga 160 has gone by the wayside. The Adventure XL139 and 125 are history as well. Perhaps Johnson is shifting the touring kayak segment solely to the Necky division ?!?