Just an object, or an…
… object lesson?
I value learning. Hard lessons can be learned from events such as this, without needing first hand experience or “all the facts”. That is precisely the benefit - turning tragic events into less costly learning opportunities for others - and really the only good that can come of such events.
To me, silence out of respect is not some sort of noble and caring gesture - it’s wasting an opportunity to get the message out about paddling safety while we have people’s attention.
I certainly do understand your sentiment and concern for the friends and families, but sentiment never prevented an accident. Analysis of this tragedy (even some of the wilder extrapolations/assumptions from limited data) and sharing these thoughts can. It’s really all outsiders can do.
There were many mistakes made, and no amount of kind words, or holding back criticism/analysis (good and bad), will change that. We learn through our mistakes and those of others, not by turning a blind eye.
I may be a cold person. Someday I’ll be a lot colder, so I’d like to learn everything I can from events like this to delay that inevitability for myself and others (and those who may grieve our passing) as much as possible.
A different kind of compassion.
Not saying we should not learn
Hey, give me a break OK? Never said don’t learn. My message is not meant as a giant guilt trip either. If you don’t see much to what I am saying OK, really!
Time/Place
I jumped early on this one, and would endeavor not to do that again. That’s the timing part, for me anyway. This is the first time there’s been a thread on a fatal kayaking accident since I’ve been spending more time on this board, and given this experience I would tend to wait for a long time should there be another.
Much of it stems from my thought a few days in that someone closely associated with these families was likely to find this board.
The posts that directly advocate penalties for the outfitter, however well intended, are stepping into a decision that should belong to the families involved. There are a lot of other posts that advocate very specific tools or actions that should have been employed, which may have been of use but can also become ammunition in a much larger fight should there be legal action. I am aware of the posts saying that there won’t be any suits filed, and for the sake of the outfitter I hope that remains so. But a week after the event is too soon to know if everyone will hold to their first response.
As much as this may be the place for a discussion of what could have been done, and regardless of whether events seem to have borne out some of the stated concerns, reactions this close to the event seems to have upped the ante in an uncomfortable way for this reader. (My own included.)
What really happened
… will never be fully known on this web site.
Despite the emotional testimonial by “Set The Record Straight” (which provides no clarification or explanation of what happened or why), no one directly involved has posted on this site[they are foremost students]. The best [and only?] direct source is the interview by AJC with one of the girls on the trip, post above.
Despite lack of communication technology available, and apparent lack of preparation that also played a role in the tragedy, I think 2 fundamental issues are the keys:
- Did the boys in the separated canoe not have the basic abilities to keep up with the group [should have been demonstrated in the first 30 minutes] and/or inablility to join the group when it was clear they were separated. and
- Why the trip leader did not haul butt to them when it was FIRST realized that they were separated, not closing in and still in sight.
From reports, the participants appear to be a close-knit group that must be going through tremendous grief and anguish having witnessed and participated in the unfolding events. The trip guide has to live with his actions/inactions the rest of his life.
Son’t go on the ocean without
Checking the weather forecast! Use immersion gear! Maintain reasonable “guide” to “client” ratios. Work for the enlightnement of all sentient beings. give to yourself first, then give to others.
Time and place…
All of us feel tremendously saddened by this incident, and I’m sure I speak for most when I say my heart goes out to the friends and families of all involved, including the guide.
I very much appreciate HHDavis’ posting. This incident is even more heart wrenching when reading the thoughts of those left in it’s wake. It’s very clear, from all I’ve read, that Steve Hall was a much-loved, popular teacher who loved his students very much. I can only hope he continues to receive the same support once the final report is published. The 2 boys who perished also brightened the lives of their friends and family, and will be terribly missed.
I don’t think there is a single one of us here who hasn’t made a mistake that could have led to very serious consequences at one time or another, either paddling or in life. The key is to learn from those mistakes so as not to repeat them.
The fact is, many mistakes were made on the Gulf that day. Each one, on it’s own, in good weather, would probably not amount to a such a sad ending. But events conspired against them and things went south very, very fast. This discussion is about what could/should have been done, or been available to stop that chain of events.
For this reason I firmly agree with Greyak’s comments. This IS the time and place to discuss the issues involved. All the discussion here, even the occasional extreme view, is appropriate. It’s all about safety and preparation. Some folks think that should include an extra motor. While I don’t hold that view, it’s his right to have it. Obviously we all have different levels of safety “comfort zones”. But we do need to have a safety “baseline”, and that is what I’m learning reading through this thread. Hopefully, when it’s all said and done, I will have learned enough to possibly save myself some day.
I have a couple of follow-up links. Make of them what you will:
http://sptimes.com/2005/03/01/news_pf/Tampabay/Trip_paddled_into_dan.shtml
http://www.darlington.rome.ga.us/news/viewstory.asp?storyID=13387
This thread is
. . . important to the extent that we maintain our humility and don’t get bogged down in harsh criticism. Our discussion brings us together as a community with compassion and a desire to make the sport safer for all who participate.
My take home lessons are:
- There, but for the grace of God, go I. My children are a gift to be cherished.
- Those involved need our prayers. Having long ago lived through a somewhat similar family tragedy myself, I would also speculate that they would appreciate our truly sincere efforts to create whatever good we can out of what happened.
- I need a VHF radio.
Peter K is right
Not only do you not go on the water without checking the weather forecast - BUT you don’t have beginners launch when there are small craft warnings posted.
If that rule had been followed, nothing else that went wrong would have happened.
The guide’s web site states that you don’t need any special clothing - just what you already have in your closet. I disagree. With 60 deg water temps, you need a wet suit or farmer john.
I don’t know many non-paddlers who have that.
The list goes on----I’m sure the teacher/guide was well loved and appreciated. But that does not make him a good guide.
All of the other things that have been said before go into determining whether or not someone is a good guide.
I’m with you
This is a paddling message board and it is entirely appropriate to discuss this issue whenever people choose. I have, in the past, seen very cold posts about 'darwin awards' for victims and I hope we don't see any of that again.
There is great value in this discussion for most people. There are some real experts here and there are some who come off as infallible. Well I'll admit to doing some things that were dumb and thanks to nothing more than good luck, there were no negative consequences. The lucky ones get older and wiser.
Here's the takeaway: Do NOT turn your personal safety over to a guide. PERIOD. You are always the #1 person responsible for your safety. That doesn't mean you shouldn't use guides, it just means that you take responsibility by checking out the guide, asking questions, and demanding that you and your group have sufficient safety surrounding you. That includes instruction, craft and equipment, clothing, guide:customer ratio, communication devices, signaling devices (I didn't read about the kids in the lost canoe having a whistle), and most importantly - is the environment right now suitable for this event.
There were screw-ups here and I don't need much time to see it.
1. Completely inexperienced young people in canoes in the Gulf. Can be done, but you'd better have a lot of things to see that it goes right (see #4).
2. Small craft warnings. This is damning, I mean what more does a guide need to say, 'this isn't a good idea with novices'?
3. The guide had no means to communicate with boats, CG, police, whatever. Unbelievable!
4. Layers of safety. There was one thing - a small, powered boat - that lost it's power and then was more useless than the canoes. That was false safety. Taking young novices out in the Gulf on a long paddle would demand extra layers of safety. You might get by with a dumb idea if nothing goes wrong. I have. But having multiple layers of safety ensures recovery from a bad situation. Here we had two simple things go bad: the weather (which was predicted)and his motor. He had only one thing to deal with a problem - a motored boat. Nothing else.
You must hold a guide to a higher standard otherwise a good profession is meaningless. Taking responsibility for young people is a very big burden and EXTRA precautions would typically be made. Here I see nothing. No radios, special clothing, extra hands, second powerboat, just nothing at all.
I'm sure the guide is a great guy and loved by all but this was a major screw up.
My condolences to the family and friends of the deceased and some sincere empathy to the guide. May we all paddle safely and enjoy the sport.
Should have had a VHF
I can’t believe the guide did not at least have a working VHF on the catamaran.
It doesn’t say in the article whether the boat was found, but I would be willing to bet that the canoe or kayak or whatever it was probably got swamped or capsized and the two boys very likely ditched it and tried to swim for the raft. They could probably see the lantern and hear the other kid’s voices and didn’t realize how far away it was and didn’t make it.
The boat probably did not sink, and if they had hung onto it they might have had a chance.
Last year a hobie cat capsized in the River near where I live during a freak gust of wind. One of the guys on the cat decided to swim several hundred yards to shore. The other guy hung on to the capsized boat. The guy who decided to swim for shore drowned. The capsized sail boat eventually drifted to shore several hours later, and the other guy walked up on the beach.
Always, always, always, stay with your boat!
VHF - range and boat traffic
I agree with the comments about having a VHF, but there is more to it than that. No device is a guarantee - but another ring of defense is a good idea. Having basic comms seems pretty obvious if paddling offshore.
Reality? Might have helped, might not. Range is limited and the area is a bit more remote than some might think. With a small craft advisory up, they may not have had a heck of a lot of company out there (and in radio range).
I paddle mostly in pretty high traffic areas, and help is usually very nearby (often in line of sight (and equiped with more sensitive and powerful console VHFs). That part of the Gulf probably doesn’t have near the same boater density.
Here, I often have boaters check to see that I’m OK (some just come closer for a better look - some actually ask) when I am clearly in no distress whatsoever - even on flatwater days. They assume unmotorized = risky (except when they’re broken down and I paddle on by). The more conditions pick up, the more they think it’s odd to see a paddler and the longer they watch - but the fewer of them there are out there to notice.
If there were other boaters in the vicinity, odds are pretty good one would have come over to see what the deal was with canoes out on the Gulf that day - in that WX - and so close to sunset. I don’t recall any mentions of any other people or boats nearby. Sounds like they were pretty much alone out there.
Odds are there was someone within VHF range - and they should have had one regardless - but it’s no more a guarantee of a safer outcome than taking the cataraft along was. If in range, but not in sight, could they have even directed a boat to their location? In the dark? It took the Coast Guard several hours of active searching to find the larger cataraft. A cnoe? Good luck.
The critical mistakes occured in the planning before they even launched - and in group control after. No motor and no VHF are not things that should have lead to loss of life in this situation - even though having either could have changed the outcome.