First off, I am NOT studying mechanical engineering just because I want to design kayaks. That would be ridiculus, and unrealistic. I am going to go into it because I love transportational vehicles in general (boats, cars, airplanes, etc) I can do math, and I have suffered through chemistry and physics in High school with B’s and A’s.
But, I was just wondering, if you had a degree in mechanical engineering, could you end up as a kayak designer? chances are that is not a job I will ever get as an engineer, probably more in the automotive, marine, aeronautical, computer type position, which would still suit my interests. Just curious. Because I mean, kayak designer- that would be a seriously awesome job. I imagine with the study of things like fluid and aero dynamics and chemistry kayak design would be related.
Sure
ME’s study aerodynamics, fluids, dynamics, and most of the stuff that factors into a good boat design. But, if you add a new gizmo it sells boats, so maybe marketing and advertising help too.
I’m a former ME
Really, there’s only so much engineering that can go into a kayak design…you’re better off designing and building kayaks to get at kayak design. Once you’ve done your sophomore level classes you’ll be able to pick up and understand the marine engineering stuff - buoyancy, dynamic and static stability, composites and strength of materials.
Same Old Question
No offense, but don’t you get tired of asking the same basic question on this forum? Do you expect a different answer each time you ask it?
Different Answers
He does get different answers no mater what question is asked, also some on this board have grown fond of Pamlico so it’s no longer open season on him.
if you had a degree in floral design
you could be a kayak designer.
how about
Marine architecture. With the rich getting richer, you could design yachts, then kayaks for fun.
Ryan L.
if you want to be an engineer
you should never call yourself a designer.
Naval Architecture
To be completely accurate, the field of vessel design is Naval Architecture. I know this for sure as I've been involved in accreditation of our program in that field recently (this is both more painful and more boring than it sounds). Marine Engineering is more concerned with design of the mechanical systems that make the vessel work. Naval Arch = hull and interior layout, Marine Eng = engineering design of all subsystems.
Anyway, Pamlico, you do in fact keep asking this same question. If you're studying mechanical engineering and would like to be prepared for boat design, make sure to take as much 'soft' engineering as possible (e.g. fluid mechanics, aerodynamic, gas dynamics, heat transfer, turbomachiney, etc.). 3D drafting and materials science would help as well.
I am a mechanical/aerospace engineer (bachelor's and doctorate) and have designed some kayaks. My finish carpentry background has helped as much as my academics. I work with a number of naval architects, who can design any kind of boat they like. One of the best (he has a firm that has designed some of the classic racing sailboats of the late 20th century) has a bachelor's in civil engineering and a master's in naval arch. My boss has a bachelor's in naval arch, and a doctorate in industrial engineering.
Professional kayak designers come from many backgrounds. Nick Schade of Guillemot Kayaks has a degree in electrical engineering. Brian Schulz of Cape Falcon has no degree and designs fantastic boats because he thinks naval arch all the time, and has a rigorous methodology. Same goes, but doubled, for the Broze brothers at Mariner Kayaks.
details
There’s ore to a good boat than the hull design. I’ve seen a lot of details on kayaks that could have been improved by good basic mechanical engineering – undersized fasteners, weak fittings, corroded metal parts, flimsy seats, etc.
Suffered through physics?
I’ve got news for you.
A huge part of mechanical engineering is understanding and applying basic physics.
If high school physics was really suffering for you then you will certainly not enjoy the mechanical engineering curriculum and in all likelihood will never be a really good mechanical engineer.
Pam has entertained us for years…
Pam has entertained us for years…
Starting with this one…
http://www.paddling.net/message/showThread.html?fid=advice&tid=438612
Better study economics
Think fairly low sales volumes - high start up costs
Perhaps this may help aid you for reference material
References :
http://www.guillemot-kayaks.com/guillemot/information/kayak_design/kayak_stability
http://www.atlantickayaktours.com/pages/ExpertCenter/Rolling/Rolling4.shtml
http://www.seakayakermag.com/PDFs/Kayak_Reviews_Info.pdf
http://www.sksa-ltd.com/resource/BoatStab1.pdf
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/centre-gravity-buoyancy-d_1286.html
http://www.topkayaker.net/Articles/Instruction/HullDesign.htm
Old post humor
Laughed myself to tears, thanks for the walk down memory lane.
I geuss I worded that wrong.
I did decently in Physics, and pretty good in chemistry.
I do better in science and especially math than in any other subjects. The problem with physics was that my counsler never told me that you were supposed to take chemistry and algebra 2 before you take physics. So I took it with no prerequisets (my math was a year behind and I had not taken chemistry until after physics.) That being said, I still got a mid B first semester and a B- second semester. In College Algebra, I got a solid A and I got As and Bs for Chemistry. These classes didn’t have as many curves as my other subjects either, except for the chemistry final, which curved so much I got As both semesters in Chemistry. I graduated senior year with a 4.0 GPA. I have a passion for Physics. I can explain to all those people driving so aggresivley in those big trucks while tailgating my midsize sedan why trucks are not stronger than cars. It is about momentum. P=MV
Momentum= Mass X Velocity. The mass of a truck is double that of a car, so the truck beats the car in damage in an equal-speed head-on collision. I also enjoy investigating crumple zones in cars. Did you know, cars built 1959 and onwards were NOT stronger than modern cars? Most people don’t know that. Modern cars are built better than ever, with a front and rear crumple zone, which are crucial because of the conservation of energy. There is some transfer of energy to sound and heat, but alot of it is comming towards the people inside the car. Therefore, the hood must absorb as much energy as possible to minimize injury. You can’t create nor destroy energy. You can only conserve it.
My main goal is to be an automotive engineer. I love the science of cars.
Good for you
Yep,
my mom is making me take macroeconomics.
Looking for a kayak design engineer for an electric kayak.
Good luck with that. What you describe is not going to “perform like a real kayak.”. It appears you may not actually understand with how a “real kayak” works, the body mechanics of it or the reasons most people choose to kayak.
Hate to pop your bubble but a powered version will never “revolutionize” a sport where the major draw is the pleasure and convenience and exercise provided by a highly portable craft that can quietly (emphasis on that) convey you into and through beautiful waters. Motorcycles did not “revolutionize bicycling” and snowmobiles did not “revolutionize skiing”. Jet skis have not replaced surfboards for thise who love surfing. And ATVs and jeeps did not “revolutionize hiking and mountaineering” (despite what all the idiotic TV ads of drivers supposedly blasting up steep cliffs to reach pristine mountain lakes would have one believe. ). We choose human powered sports for a range of compelling reasons.
A kayak is an inherently human propelled craft that is an extension of the person using it. Stick a motorized propulsion system on it and all you have is a motorboat. Those already exist in countless versions for anyone who wants or needs them.
Actual kayak designers base their metrics on how the placement and actions of the paddler within the structure of the boat affect its interaction with the water in various conditions. Adding mechanical propulsion under or behind the hull skews, even obliterates, those critical balances. Vastly different from bicycles, where the propulsion by either human or motor is in the same dimensional planes and the vehicle performance does not have to take into account the forces applied by immersion in water.
There are sometimes situations where having an auxilary propulsion would be handy, especially in an emergency or to augnent for a user with disabilities. People have rigged everything from electric trolling motors to battery drills with homemade propellers, even turbo jet rigs, to accomplish this on their canoes or kayaks. But there is little demand for this. And the vectors of such a power source are quite different from those applied by a paddler or even by wind propulsion in kayak sailing. Once you have designed a hull optimized for single point linear propulsion it’s not likely to respond as a well-designed kayak does to the forces of human propulsion and control.
If your patent application did not include an actual boat design that you had field tested, it seems like you have not really “invented” a product, just an idea for a novelty that you want to market as a kayak but likely wouldn’t really perform as most kayaks are intended to. Your best bet if you are confident in your propulsion patent’s viability might be to try to peddle it to a company like Hobie (who already markets pedal drive kayaks.) Or to the burgeoning stand up paddleboard industry where there seems to be some demand for adding mechanical assistance to the things. If you really do have a new and unique idea those might be the most likely to have interest in partnering or licensing.
Thank you for sharing your opinion 