Newbie needing a Canoe....

FYI: Dick’s Sporting
Dick’s is running a 20% off sale this week, FYI. Ends Saturday Feb 18.



Glad to see a recommendation for the Adventure 16, plan to pick one up during this sale. My wife’s been hounding me for fifteen years over my hobbies not being something we both can do, so we rented aluminums down the road a few times & had fun, but she wasn’t very comfortable.

The plastic thang might be nasty to canoe snobs, but it’s looking perfect for us Saturday afternooners. Was about to buy a Spirit II based on weeks of reading around here, not many talking about the 16.

A couple things stand out
to me…



Quote: “While you can fish from a paddling canoe, paddling a fishing canoe isn’t as much fun.”



This makes me think I might want more of a paddling Canoe…since…I can fish from it anyway…and since I would be a newbie at fishing…my needs would be basic.



But…this quote also stands out, about fishing canoes.

“We use them when we don’t want to damage our good boats due to rough conditions and we can also lend them out without worrying about them getting damaged.”



This makes me think I want the durable fishing boat to start out with.



I want a boat that I’m not going to worry about damaging that much. I want to beach in lots of places and not be concerned about the bottom being damaged. I want to paddle some and enjoy some sight seeing…but I also want to fish some



So…can a person solo paddle these fishing canoes…and ENJOY it…or is it just a chore. There may be times I want to go out alone. If it’s a chore to paddle and to heavy to load by myself then I dont want it.



I’m thinking I’m leaning towards the durable fishing canoe…as long as I can get some basic paddling enjoyment out of it. Seems it will provide a better over all match…plus…I can bang it up while I’m learning…



Then…later get a longer Canoe more specific for paddling.



Thoughts?

Witt





BTW, thanks for all the replies so far…I plan to re-read them several times before making a choice. I’ll also post my progress and some pictures once I get my canoe…because I will get one…just trying to decide what kind.
















go for it
If it’s all that you can afford, or are willing to

pay, by all means buy your fishing canoe.



If you love being on the water you will have fun.



However, I don’t think you need to be calling us

“snobs” because we know more than you do.



If we were snobs we’d be telling you to buy some

ugly kevlar thing for $2,000 or more.



My paddling group has a couple who see nothing

wrong with their fishing canoe and they tell the

rest of us that we are wasting our money

when we spend more than $600 for a new canoe.



They always have fun and we enjoy their company,

but they are also the first people to get tired

and go home early.



The few times I’ve had one of them in the bow of

my canoe they’ve paddled like crazy people and I

have to tell them to slow down and take it easy.



Despite their years of experience, they don’t know

about the concept of “glide” since their fishing

canoe needs to be constantly paddled to keep it moving.



Enjoy.


Why limit yourself to just local
fishing? Later you might want to go to more remote fishing areas like in the BWCA. There are plenty of good canoes that paddle well and are excellant for fishing. I have a 15 ft Royalex MR Explorer that is good either solo or tandem. Small for tripping but if you are careful can go out for several day. Last year I went down the Buffalo tandem and with two dogs with it. It isn’t bad to paddle solo and like it because I can bring it on trips and either paddle tandem or solo. Get a canoe that paddles well or you won’t be happy. Don’t get a fiberglass boat if you want to bounce down streams.

Hey Red, what did I miss?
“However, I don’t think you need to be calling us

“snobs” because we know more than you do.”



I re-read everything Witt posted and I didn’t see anything that even insinuated anyone being a snob. Quite the contrary, he seemed appreciative of everyones comments.



Enlighten me and I’ll happily concede to you.

Keep the advice coming…

– Last Updated: Feb-14-06 2:13 PM EST –

Also, Jonathon....Red wasn't posting to me regarding the "snobs" remark.

I really am glad to get both sides of the coin...fishing/paddling...otherwise I'll be making a blind purchase.

Witt

My apologies Red. Who…
were to refering to?

The snobs thing
Looks like I caused a bit of a derailment.



I say snob in the same tone others will say connoisseur, my way is just easier to spell.



Have a nice day.

Double (not kayak) paddles…
…I paddle solo, and use a double 95% of the time. I’ve never used one in a tandem canoe, but don’t see why both paddlers couldn’t use one. Much easier to learn to use. Look in the archives-this comes up all the time, and there’ve been several threads in the last year.

RE learning: your local library probably has books & videos; join a club.

canoes
I say you should buy the best canoe you can. My dad borrowed money to buy the Wenonah Echo That I paddle well over 20 years later. I have learned the same lesson a few times now. Buy quality once or junk over and over. The Echo i paddle is a 16.5 footer in tuffweave. It does every job I have asked of it form river fishing to BWCA trips. It weighs about 63 pounds. A 16 footer is a great size for versatility. Most stlyes in that length are made for general use.

Witt,
My main purpose I purchasing a canoe was fishing. That said, I wanted a boat I could easily carry as I knew I would be doing 90% of my fishing solo and would want to be able to carry it to some small out of the way lakes where I may not be able to drive it to the waters edge. I also wanted the ability to take a friend on occasion. Hence the need for a tandem. Having paddled several types of canoes in the past, I also realized that, while I wasn’t planning to “race”, speed and glide were important for efficiency. I opted for a Royalex symmetrical designed tandem. The Royalex is cheaper then kevlar and composites, very durable and reasonable in weight. It will take a lot of abuse. I was heart broken when I got my first scratch but I realized that I bought the canoe to use and with use come scratches. Symmetrical is important in a tandem because your can turn it around and paddle solo from what is normally the front seat and be closer to center for weight distribution.



I have since purchased 4 additional boats, 2 solos and another tandem and a kayak. However, all are designed to be decent fishing platforms as well as good trackers with good glide. All are Royakex except the kayak (which is poly link 3).



I say do your research, as you are, and investigate several boats. Look at both used and new. Check on the reputation of the dealer. Find out if he or she paddles and knows anything about boats and if they offer service should you need it. Finally buy the best boat for you and your purpose that you can afford. Then get on the water and enjoy your purchase and don’t worry about a scratch. Don’t intentionally abuse it but use it and enjoy!

What do you mean…

– Last Updated: Feb-15-06 11:52 AM EST –

...when you say "Symmetrical is important in a tandem because your can turn it around and paddle solo from what is normally the front seat and be closer to center for weight distribution."

What is symmetrical and what's not? I get why you want symmetrical...you explained that...but dont understand what a symmetrical canoe looks like as opposed to a non-symmetrical.

Witt

What I’ve learned so far…
Weight is important! Especially if you plan to load and unload by yourself on top of a car or suv…and if it’s heavy you will probably not use it as often. (Fishing boats are usually heavy) Royalex is a good material for lighter weight and durability.



I need to think about how important glide is “to me” and buy with that in mind.



Buy the best Canoe I can afford…and one for the long term. Buy Quality first…instead of medicore.



The big ticket stores have limited information regarding the needs of paddlers.



There are plenty of canoes that paddle well and you can fish from.



Most Canoes can be fitted for rowing, after purchase.



Lower than 60 pounds is a good bench mark for “light weight”.



Consider length…b/c as my kid grows and my needs change, I could outgrow my canoe.







I have also noted the different models posted. Thanks for the specific suggestions.









Other Questions.





Should I be thinking about heat? As in hull or surface heat in the sunlight. The northeast hull was a dark…almost black color…and I’m now wondering why some hull’s are white…I dont want a Canoe that fries eggs in the summer rays…is this a concern…are they all the same?







What causes a boat to be tipsy? Hull shape or Width or both? Can I get a good paddling canoe and it not be tipsy? If so what basic width range should I look at?



What is the BWCA? I keep seeing that come up…



I have a single car garage. If the canoe is long, it will be left oustide…what should I consider regarding care? Is warping an issue?



Thanks again.

Witt

Voice of dumping experience…
…the one time I went over (on Willapa Bay, WA state), I got my shoulders beyond the gunwale of the canoe. There may be a simpler way to state that, but the key is not getting topheavy. That’s why kneeling (which I don’t do) is the safest paddling position.

I’ll try to address several things.
Symmetrical hulls are the same shape for and aft. They will react the same whether gouing forward or backward if trim is the same. Some canoes are asymmetrical meaning they are a slightly different shape forward and aft. these canoes do not work as well when paddled backward.



Hull color. Most canoes have a neutral color interior (like a light tan or sand color). If left in the sun, a dark hull will obviously heat up quicker. However when in the water you really won’t notice much, if any, difference. I have red, green, almond, black and blue boats.



Hull shape and width affect stability. Generally the wider the boat and the flatter the bottom the more stable it is. this is a generalization as there are many things that affect stability and there is both initial stability and secondary stability. I am sure someone more knowledgable regarding hull shape will weigh in here.



BWCA stands for the Boundary Waters Canoe Area, a wilderness area on the border between Minnesota and Canada that is a popular canoeing destination. there are 100s of lakes and rivers that allow almost limitless routes. Many routes involve portages (carries) between various bodies of water.



Prolonged direct sunlight is not good for Royalex hulls. If you can not store the boat inside, you can cover it with a tarp, but do not let the tarp lay on the boat. Make some type of rack to hold the boat off the ground, store it up side down resting on the gunwales and have a support to keep the tarp from touching the hull.



Hope this helps.

I live near…

– Last Updated: Feb-15-06 2:19 PM EST –

....Mt. Island Lake in charlotte, NC. I know someone made an offer to paddle sometime..but...as you can see I'm in NC. I live two miles from Mt Island Lake...which is the reason I want a canoe.

I found this in another thread:
http://www.mrponline.org/
Loooks like a club in my area...

If you are in my area and see this thread let me know.

Witt

Kayak Paddles

– Last Updated: Feb-15-06 3:56 PM EST –

Adventure Racers go with 3 kayak paddles in a canoe all the time. Efficient and easy and you can also keep paddling while falling asleep :)

Dark Inside Hull DOES Matter

– Last Updated: Feb-15-06 6:28 PM EST –

Many royalex boats and some polyethylene with an olive color on the outside is olive on the inside. That dark olive color DOES absorb heat and make the boat more uncomfortable to paddle and after awhile to touch on hot summer days here in MO. I had an Olive Wenonah Adirondack and an Old Town Loon 138 and both could get very uncomfortable. Take an olive canoe with an olive interior and any other color with the "Standard" tan color and you will quickly notice a difference on a 90 degree day. Also, the "Fishing" vs "Paddling" canoe and weight issue has grabbed my attention. I started out paddling to fish, now I often paddle just to paddle. You can learn to fish from almost any canoe, but IMHO you really should focus on one that has comfortable initial stability right now. If you start out feeling you're going to flip the boat every time you sneeze, you're going to end up selling the canoe and buying a john boat or a bass boat. I think that OT Osprey would be one of several good boats to start with. Others would be the Mad River Explorer, Wenonah Adirondack, and if paddling primarily rivers, the Mad River 14TT (this boat likes to turn too well to work well on lakes). Another boat that's new enough that I haven paddled it, but LOOKS like it would do well for solo/tandem is the 15' Wenonah Heron. As for weight, remember that you willsometimes be lifting the boat at the end of day of exertion. Much over 70 lbs is pushing it, and the lighter it is, the more likely you'll feel like loading the boat for a quick trip. Hope these opinions are of some help. WW

What else will I need…
…when I buy my Canoe. I’m close to buying one…



I have a Honda CRV…with a luggage rack…can I transport my Canoe on that? What Will i need…the kind of straps and such.



Paddles? Cheap and durable…any sug’s?



PFD? What kind…



Anything else I need to think about?



Will i need some kind of permit on the lake?



Thanks,

Witt

A permit - check with your state boating
laws and get a registration or a permit or whatever they require. Get and use whatever safety equipment, especially pfds, for all onboard. You can have a great time paddling, and still be legal and safe. As far as all the gear at entry level, get the best that you can afford, check the reviews, and look for sales. Read the articles under Guidelines, and study basic techniques of paddling strokes and water navigation. Keep in mind that after a couple or a few years you can move up in a canoe model and gear.

Happy paddling!