no dispute that std nav lights allowed
I haven’t heard anyone dispute that. And perhaps they are even superior to just a white light ready to use before a collision. The question has just been a) is just a white light ready to use before a collision allowed and b) how soon is “too soon” to use said light. The part about how soon is too soon seems left to the judgment of the person and may vary considerably based on the nature of boat traffic. I understand I’m wrong on this, but don’t know why from my reading of Rule 25.
going to disagree Salty
Most kayaks and canoes are traveling so slowly that they can effectively be treated as stationary by faster vessels. I think that is why the regs only require a white like for signaling. Nav lights are an option. It is up to the operator of the slow vessel to take his slowness into account. Where I play, it doesn’t much matter if someone is approaching me from port or starboard, they’re going to go astern or in front at their discretion irrespective of the regs.
I also think the rules are written with the assumption that row boats, small sail boats, canoes, etc… aren’t out and about much at night.
Now, if someone is going to be operating in a busy area at night (which I flat don’t recommend anyway as it is ridiculously hard to see anything in a congested area at night, the lights all just run together if you ask me) then they ought to get full nav lights. On a lake or river inland out star gazing? Just be visible as the rule requires.
When I’m running the river at night for work I appreciate vessels that are running having their lights give me directional indication but for slow or anchored vessels? I’m just happy if they’ve got their white light. I’ve never had a problem avoiding boats anchored up for the night or the occasional group of night canoes marked with white lights.
My early AM workout lights (I share the lake and attached river with a couple of crew teams and an occasional early rising crappie fisherman) are an obnoxious white stern light visible from sides and aft (it’s the brightest water resistant bike headlight I could find). I don’t want a 360 light because I’m usually going 7-11mph depending on the piece I’m going and really need my night vision. My forward light is a red LED headlamp that is visible for about 120 degrees of whatever direction I’m facing. And it looks like it if flashing since my paddle shaft passes in front of it 50-100 times per minute depending on the intensity of the piece. Everybody is give way to me mmmmwwwwhhhhaaaahaaaahaaa. Seriously though. Nobody around here knows what the hell red and green mean anyway. It’s best that they see something to be avoided and best you do your part to be avoided.
not what I’m hoping to do Nate …
– Last Updated: Sep-20-10 11:28 PM EST –
...... nor what "I" mean . The question is what the words "Attract Attention" as written in Rule 36 were designed to mean .
To me Rule 25(d) "under oars" is as clear as it gets (unless someone wants argue a paddle is not an oar) ... but Rule 36 "might" be another option , that's why I brought it up . Just wondering how others think it should/could be interpreted .
My last attempt for you
An all round light tells everyone else out there that you are anchored. Are you anchored? NO, so why tell others that? I read the rationale above several times that folk assume that this will just cause others to avoid them, and that may indeed be.
However, in a crossing situation no one will give way to you as they will assume you to be anchored given that your light has remained constant throughout their travel with no running lights. They may not know that you are in fact travelling! Whereas a flash of whitel light does tell them you are underway. An all round light could be a stern light of a vessel traveling the same direction ahead of you, but you’d see their running lights (one of them) as you past or veered to any direction placing you in their 112.5 degree sector on either side of the bow. This then tells them which way you are headed!!
So, displaying regular nav lights per 25 not only would satisfy peoples need to have constant lighting, but would go far further to telling me and anyone else out there what the hell you are, and that you are indeed under way. If to my port I would prepare to give way to you in open water.
This is just the start, and there are more reasons. Understanding of the lighting, the lights area of sweep etc will make things make sense perhaps. With nav lights if I’m astern of you I will see a white light, which is exactly what you are wanting. If abaft your beam I’ll still see white, but as I move into your running light sector I’ll see an additional red or green and that will tell me something that is accurate.
AND, any damn white light powerful enough to do any good in ftont of your eyes is just plain silly.
Even dumber is traveling in congested waters in a kayak at night. Hug the shores or paddle in remote areas where risk is dramatically reduced. Don’t travel across open congested waters at night.
God i hope this helps. I think I’m over the need to try and help here…
night paddling
Four of us paddled from D.L. Bliss State Park (Lake Tahoe) into Emerald Bay in the daylight. While the sun set we decorated our boats with hundreds of glow sticks and then paddled back in the dark. Got lots of compliments, although it wasn’t very eco-friendly. Next time I think I’ll just use a deck light: http://www.kayakreview.org/go/decklight/
hundreds of glow sticks …
… sounds like Rule 36 compliant to me !!
all very good reasons
but people often want to not only know what is a good practice but what is required. Knowing what is required (often a subset of what is a good practice) lets them understand their options so they can adapt them to their unique situation and still be legal. The law does allow for just a white light displayed in time but isn’t clear how soon is too soon to display it. That last part is key (from a legal point of view) because if there is no limit then you can keep the light on continuously. Whether that is a good idea is a very good but still separate subject from what is strictly legal.
Thanks for the all info they do help.