does your buyer read this forum?
If so, perhaps he was just trolling.
re entry shaft breakage
Broke shaft on an AquaBound used for practice and spare. I used the wrong technique placing weight on the shaft with a leg over with lower body. The joint unit is made from polyolefin ?
Replaced the dug out olefin with an oak dowel from McMaster Carr sanded to slip fit with West 650. Good wood.
NOW place weight on the shaft and IN YOU GO !
Problem is , where is the joined paddle stored ?
Mounting along front with a Solstice is possible, dragging paddle back to cockpit in waves.
But otherwise what’s needed are joints NOT made from polyolefin.
All carbon paddlers are exempt. But down from that area, what’s an ounce of strength ? advertising ?
Yeah
Maybe it is someone who cannot quickly do a PF re-entry in NON-rough water in a boat he already has, is too embarrassed to be forthright about it, and is hoping that buying another boat will solve the problem.
Like Jay, I wonder why the obsession with PF re-entry in rough water. There are other recoveries for rough water that don’t require extra gear (roll, cowboy, re-enter and roll). And it is not the seller’s responsibility to tell the buyer what the buyer may or may not be able to do. What you said already is enough: That you have not done it in rough water yourself. To promise anything might make yourself liable for some wacko legal wrangling. Don’t go there just to make a sale.
Bad assumption
since he is asking about this, I assume he is not a novice and knows how to balance his boat with his hips, and to let the water orient his paddle, so the only conditions in which he could flip are where waves are high and rough enough to break across the top of the boat with significant force.
He might well be a novice. This might be a case of someone wanting to bite off more than he can chew but thinks equipment allows skipping the baby steps of learning. It might be someone who has done a PF re-entry in not-rough water but maybe not quickly or easily, so he has doubts about his ability in rough water that he thinks another boat (the Caribou) would “fix” somehow, without having to practice and refine the skill in flat water first. If the 'bou has a low, flat rear deck that would help, but maybe he already owns such a boat. Do you know what he paddles now, and how much effort has he made to learn skills in that boat (if he has one)? Assuming the guy tells the truth, of course…also a bad assumption.
Is this a ship-cross-country sale or can he demo the boat near you if you’re willing? In calm water, of course; if he fumbles it in calm water you’ll know if your assumption is correct.
Weird question. Virtually nobody learns to do PF re-entry in rough water. They start in the easy stuff and practice/refine there first. Skipping steps does not really save time in the long run.
jay’s analogy was great
I laughed.
I had to think about that for a second
I’ve capsized on my own but it was when I was goofing around in conditions I could handle.
As for…
swimming the boat into shore, push it, don’t pull it. The last thing you need is a water filled several hundred pound object looming over your head when you are on in the trough of a wave. Maintaining contact with the boat is difficult, however, and I hate grab loops and the like as they are too close to the hull to ensure that your fingers don’t get crushed, since the boat is moving independently on the wave.
This probably doesn’t need to be said, but I know someone out there has found just how painful it can be to have a kayak plopped on them by a wave.
Rick
Humm…
T-rescue should work. The boat doesn’t have to lift a whole lot of weight since the boat starts draining long before a significant weight is lifted in the air. Note that in whitecaps, the hull will drain pretty quickly as soon as the hull is anchored in your hands as the waves will create troughs into which the cockpit will drain.
Give the cockpit time to drain before attempting to pull the swamped hull across your deck and you should be fine.
Rick
As one who practices paddle float…
reentry annually, I don’t think it can be accomplished in breaking waves with out a lot of luck.
I know I wouldn’t rely on it.
Assisted- yes, but unassisted - no
Jack L
Park and play by the beach
Fairly high chance of capsizing but can be done alone if staying well to the conservative side and if waves push onshore, sandy beach etc.
DNQ
read my post on shaft breaking and look thru the video.
One video has the demonstrator paralleling a regular wave series. He, floating up the approaching wave, mounts the hull as the hull travels down the far wave side.
If riding that wave and breaking the rule of not weighting the now strengthened shaft
You’re in !
self-rescue
You are asking the right kind of question. The more likely it is that people capsize, the more difficult it is for a rescue. Another braced boat along side would help. A scared person can accomplish a lot. A paddle float at least gives you a chance. You can be that the Tsunami Rangers practice things like self-rescue in tough conditions.
Huh?
The tsunami rangers have never used a paddle float re-entry, at least what most people mean by that. I am guessing that you never saw one of their original boats - we have.
What the rangers did - there are the original rangers and a newer version but in this they are similar - was practice climbing back onto the boats via balance and fast plop into the cockpit. No screwing around with paddle floats. In the heavy surf where they often had to remount, there simply was not time to deal with anything that had to be inflated because of being blown around in rocks. The original boats were mostly SOTS, which made that a good choice.
There apparently is some version of the rangers out there now, and they still do a lot of their work in heavy surf. As others who have experience here have indicated, it a place for various alternatives but paddle floats is not one of them.
What does “DNQ” mean ?
Speak English !
Jack L
DNS ?
did not qualify…a common acronym. Meaning me…
Trying paddle float reentry with upper thigh and ankle or an individual variation on the usually breakable shaft may lead into a more effective coordination then successful for not using paddle shaft as a support…the traditional method.
Few have a shaft that strong. AquaBound’s yellow blade paddle’s shaft is strong enough but the joint is not. As emailed, an oak dowel epoxied into shaft…having removed the standard joint…does support half your weight while floating.
We toss the paddle float practice idea around as a practice and as a redundant backup for reentry and here’s a reliable learning method.
This afternoon, while working with similar materials, thought occurred where a reinforcing sleeve would provide strength…or other bracing.
Paddle weight adds up…but for longer trips depending on what long is for you. Shorter trips in rougher conditions could bring in use of a stronger shaft/joint if you found the weighted shaft reentry use able.
Objections will be made that ‘well, if you roll ( that is the writer can and you can’t therefore he is superior to you which is NOT where we’re going here) then you don’t need a float reentry.’
OK then why are we discussing it ? Because the float reentry is a use able safety tool…without a shaft !
Sorry I asked !
Jack L
That’s not a question for you to answer
for a buyer but I would say as a general question no, it’s not a worthwhile technique in breaking waves.
I’d tell the buyer he could learn to roll with the Caribou.
right
Sandy beach and spilling, regular waves. I still needed to bonk my head of the sandy bottom before waking up and wearing a helmet.
The rangers
also tended to use an open cockpit boat. There is an excerpt from Eric’s book on the subject at the following site:
http://tsunamirangers.com/2010/12/01/an-excerpt-from-confessions-of-a-wave-warrior-by-eric-soares/
Rick
Somewhat confused by the article
I didn’t say they never used sit ins, just that the classic boat I saw was not. And that they did not do things where paddle floats were a plan.
But I just read the article in the link. It identifies the X1 early on as a sit on top. A quirky sit on top yes, but that.
The Ranger boat we saw, at a presentation over a decade ago in Castille Maine, was not the boat owned by the original Ranger who spoke. But it was one of a few non-destroyed originals left, a very capable looking SOT.
The Ranger who spoke - forget his name - had aged into photography and lecturing rather than bouncing around on rocks for a living.