Paddle Recommendation

-- Last Updated: Oct-07-16 10:03 PM EST --

I currently do 100% sea kayaking in a 17' Rockpool Alaw Bach TCC. I am wanting to learn to roll, but currently only have my homemade greenland paddle that I've used since almost the beginning of my paddling experience. I had a buddy teaching me before and I was unable to roll with my paddle, but was able to roll fine once we switched to a standard style paddle.

What I'm looking for is a second paddle to use when I'm in waves/practicing rolling. Then move onto learning with my Greenland paddle as well. I'm trying to find a paddle that is between a normal kayak paddle and my Greenland (3" wide at the widest part of blade). I'm trying to get more bite in waves/rolling, but mitigate the feeling of pulling buckets through the water (what a normal paddle feels like to me).

Any suggestions would be great. Criteria would be 2 peice and carbon, straight shaft. I'm not sure for length. I am 5'9" 165 lbs. I'm thinking maybe the Werner Athena based only on the surface area being their smallest. There are so many choices that I'm not really sure how to compare them.

Another option would be making another greenland with wider blades, but I don't know if that's a good option? I am very partial to my Greenland.

Thanks for reading my long post and for any help.

Narrow, not smallest surface area

– Last Updated: Oct-08-16 1:46 AM EST –

I think you want a narrow blade, not one that has a small surface area. Your GPS probably has a lot of surface area when it is fully planted in the water.

I'd consider something like the Werner Camano, but I think that is a fiberglass blade (so whatever their version is that is carbon).

GPs are for Rolling :wink:
I find it odd you have more difficulty rolling with the GP. I’d suggest that if this is the case you’re still relying WAY too much on the paddle. Back up a few steps and work on your boat rotations, body motion, etc. Work with a paddle float and/or partner. How are you failing? A lot can be learned from reviewing video of your unsuccessful attempts.



I find a GP way easier to roll with, though I’m only just now trying to get into using one for everyday paddling. I am almost 100% Euro paddle at this point but recently I borrowed a GP to try. When I rolled the first time I threw myself past vertical and back upside down! The second attempt was a bit more controlled… and I came up laughing, as were the others around me :slight_smile: Consider too, that the paddle was almost a foot shorter than is right for my height.

Suggest you do this
Find someone who can show you how to roll with your gp. It probably won’t be the folks you know who only use Euro paddles. Honestly, I have seen a lot of folks with only Euro paddle background screw up teaching people how to fill with a GP. In case that sounds mean, it isn’t. I mostly paddle wirh a Euro, though l have dabbled with gp and rolled with them. It works fine but the roll is a bit different. GP is actually easie

I Like Your Last Idea
Make another GP.

A Swift Wind Paddle meets your
description. Carbon shafts and blades that are a composite as light as carbon.

Nimbus Kiska
Despite my previous comment on GPs and rolling, if you’re set on a Euro blade that doesn’t feel like pulling buckets through the water, I’m very partial to my Nimbus Kiska paddles. I don’t know about the actual surface area comparison, but they do shed a lot of the resistance that you encounter with cheaper paddles. I went with 215cm, which is a bit shorter than normal for my height and sea kayak touring but I don’t regret the decision - even considered 210 but that might have been a bit short.



I have two - an older fiberglass blade and almost new carbon/basalt. They’re pretty darn near the same weight, 700g give or take (can’t remember exactly) and about $250 CAD. They’re made in British Columbia, Canada and you can actually call and talk to the guy that makes them.



Oddly, I actually prefer the older fiberglass one, and the new one really shows scratches (plenty from paddling Georgian bay) but it doesn’t affect the function at all.

2nd the Windswift
Been my main paddle for years…

Werner
Werner kalista

Greenland paddles are BETTER for
Greenland paddles are better for rolling. Learn to use the Greenland. Your being taught by someone who doesn’t know greenlands. Get a better teacher. if not possible get the DVD “This Is a Roll”. Iam assuming you have a normal sized Greenland now.

You didn’t specify…
…what rolling technique you’re being taught and by whom. If it’s the standard “C to C” roll that’s commonly taught by ACA instructors, it’s actually one of the more difficult methods to learn and it’s really designed for a Euro paddle. Commonly taught Euro rolls like the C to C come from the whitewater world and require precise timing and a strong hip snap, which isn’t necessary with a GP.



Try to find a skilled GP user in your area to work with. Rolling technique with a GP is quite different, although there is some crossover with techniques like the Pawlawta roll, which works with either type of paddle. Most GP rolling techniques involve sweeping the paddle, as it produces a lot of lift when swept.

Paddle

– Last Updated: Oct-12-16 3:49 PM EST –

In waves rolling I would suggest a paddle similar to Werner Cypress or Ikelos. One is smaller and second is larger, pick one based on your upper body strength and whatever feel more comfortable. Both of them are vertical style paddling and foam core construction. When placed on the surface of the water and held with little force it will naturally find the surface and orient flat on the water. That could be beneficial especially if you are gaining rolling experience. I feel they are more forgiving of a beginner rolling style. We do teach roll in CT and I seen it first hand. As for Greenland paddle, they are good for rolling and will highlight errors, but I prefer euro blade in waves. As for length it is subjective, and with TCC being narrow you can go for a shorter one 210 or slighter longer one 215. I have Ikelos in both 210 and 215 and paddle most with 215, they both feel comfortable. Both paddles also come with crank shaft. By the way there more manufacturers on the market if is just most of the people would be familiar with Werner.

I’m a dedicated euro blade user but

– Last Updated: Oct-12-16 4:29 PM EST –

rolling using it depends more on force than finesse. Once I learned a roll with my euro, someone showed me how much more relaxed a roll was with a GP, if I didn't try to muscle the roll.

I'd say stick with your GP, borrow a euro if you feel like you need one to get your roll, but switch back to your GP the moment you do.

Paddle for roll
Hi



It all depends on the technique. There is absolutely no reason to muscle your roll with euro blade. The difference may be that you can’t muscle the roll with GP because it doesn’t have the surface for it. But opposite is not true, you can do fine slow roll with both GP and Euro Blade. In waves when you need quick and powerful moves standard GP blade may not be the best, there are GP surf paddles that are a bit wider. Obviously there are people that do everything with GP paddles and there are people that do the same with Euro Blades. You can start with ether and arrive to the same point. Most people myself included have whole arsenal of paddles. Buy what feels good and in the worst case it will end up being your spare paddle, this what happened with my Camano, don’t really use it but makes a great spare paddle.

Actually…
…you CAN muscle a roll with a GP, but the techniques that are designed for it (and generally taught with it) don’t require that. You don’t see anyone who understands and uses a GP teaching C-to-C rolls with it. The closest Euro-style rolls are the Screw roll and the Pawlawta, the latter of which is basically the “standard” GP roll done with a Euro paddle.



Virtually all GP rolls that use a paddle contain some component of sweeping, which is the major strength of the GP. They also are either layback (mostly) or lay forward rolls. All GP rolls are meant to be smooth and executed with finesse; none are meant to be rushed. If it feels strenuous, you’re not using proper technique.

@fx67 said:
Paddle for roll
Hi

It all depends on the technique. There is absolutely no reason to muscle your roll with euro blade. The difference may be that you can’t muscle the roll with GP because it doesn’t have the surface for it. But opposite is not true, you can do fine slow roll with both GP and Euro Blade. In waves when you need quick and powerful moves standard GP blade may not be the best, there are GP surf paddles that are a bit wider. Obviously there are people that do everything with GP paddles and there are people that do the same with Euro Blades. You can start with ether and arrive to the same point. Most people myself included have whole arsenal of paddles. Buy what feels good and in the worst case it will end up being your spare paddle, this what happened with my Camano, don’t really use it but makes a great spare paddle.

Will take note of this

At age 76 I finally got a dependable, reproducible roll - the Pawlatta with GP or Euro, doesn’t much matter. As many have mentioned here, you don’t need a roll that is reliant on leveraging your self up with the paddle. The suggestion of a good GP teacher is a good one. Where are you located? … someone here may have a suggestion. I am a year older now and find rolling great fun and hope to move on to an assortment of rolls plus reentry and roll. By the time I die, I should be able to roll over in my coffin.

@rsevenic
Your story is inspiring to senior people like me (still much younger than you though). And now I also know what I will do in my coffin. :smiley:

Brandon, with the Alaw Bach I’m surprised that you have to do anything to help the boat roll. Have you tried just laying back and letting the boat take care of rolling up? I haven’t paddled the Alaw Bach that much, but I suspect it would do most of the work for any kind of roll. There must be some kind of compensation for the wall that boat hits.

@rsevenic said:
At age 76 I finally got a dependable, reproducible roll - the Pawlatta with GP or Euro, doesn’t much matter. As many have mentioned here, you don’t need a roll that is reliant on leveraging your self up with the paddle. The suggestion of a good GP teacher is a good one. Where are you located? … someone here may have a suggestion. I am a year older now and find rolling great fun and hope to move on to an assortment of rolls plus reentry and roll. By the time I die, I should be able to roll over in my coffin.

I’m impressed!