Yeah I think fthe rope is a tangle risk and would lose it. Maybe stick the float under your bungees, or inside your pfd, but ropes and rolling are a dangerous combination.
The first time I ever rolled out of necessity, I was paddling (alone of course) out of a ship canal into open water and entering turbulent waters with waves rebounding and colliding off the concrete walls. I didn’t want to go out, but the waves became so big I wanted to turn around even less for fear of capsize,. I tried to let the wind blow me back to safety, or at least back to somewhere that I didn’t want to wet my wetsuit, but backsurfing wasn’t to my liking either, so no matter how hard I tried NOt to go out I kept progressing toward the open water. Finally I dumped, and I had never even practiced rolling in those conditions. Yay.
I carefully set up to do an extended sweep roll, which I was pretty sure I could execute if I kept my cool. Got myself in place, got the paddle in place along the port side, and proceeded to sweep. Everything went great until I realized my paddle was caught in the painter that I used to use, fool that I was at the time. After the initial surge of adrenaline/fear, I calmed down and extricated it, and manged to roll up! But I was still in the same ugly mess. I paddled like hell straight out into open water and headed for shore through the surf that I still had no idea how to paddle in. Some lady with 6 little kids watched the whole thing, and came over. She said I really looked like I knew what I was doing (I didn’t) and took a picture of me holding the kayak with her kids clustered around. I wish I had asked for a copy.
I’ve been known to work on rolls alone, in calm areas. The problem as others have already said is that if you mess it up and have to wet exit and re-enter that gets really old (the worst part IMHO is pumping out the water!). I don’t think it is particularly dangerous if you choose a safe area not too far from shore. If you are at a beach where there are other people it is advisable to warn them about what you are going to be doing so they don’t freak out when they see you capsize!
@rjd9999 said:
Some hulls just don’t allow this. I, for one, will be upside down in my boat and it will not lie on it’s side with, …………………………….
I have one that does not like to “edge” that far. By no means is my high volume boat a Greenland rolling machine. But the flexibility of the paddler that is needed for that manover also isn’t there any more either.
I don’t really have much fear of trying it alone in a slow pool. Unfortunately it’s been raining for like 3 weeks straight and there aren’t any slow pools right now. Every time the water start going down it rains more. Wednesday will be the last roll clinic of the year and I have to miss it. I’ll have to stay dry for 10 days after Wednesday morning. It’s really bothering me. But, I did find out my instructor’s assistant is staying at a lake house. He is awesome and said he will work on it with me Tuesday.
I’m other news, I made my first solo run down the Lehigh Gorge today. I was with a trip but alone in my ducky. I did manage to swim once but never lost contact with my ducky or paddle and managed to get back in on my own. Ok on the 2nd attempt but whatever right? I can’t wait to do it again! I really can’t wait to do it in a hard boat.
I rolled today! Ok well I got like 3 out of 50 attempts but I still managed to do it a couple times.
Yes, the Lehigh Gorge can get extremely crowed on dam release weekends. The largest rafting company can send well over 2000 people a day down alone. Add in a few other companies and people with private boats and it gets busy.
I set up my roll help today a few nights ago or I would have gone on a Gorge trip tonight. Yesterday was 875cfs and packed. Today was 2750cfs and most likely would have been almost empty. Like 2 weeks ago we went on a Wednesday evening and we saw 3 other boaters. You just have to time it right.
@DryFlyTrout said:
I rolled today! Ok well I got like 3 out of 50 attempts but I still managed to do it a couple times.
Yes, the Lehigh Gorge can get extremely crowed on dam release weekends. The largest rafting company can send well over 2000 people a day down alone. Add in a few other companies and people with private boats and it gets busy.
I set up my roll help today a few nights ago or I would have gone on a Gorge trip tonight. Yesterday was 875cfs and packed. Today was 2750cfs and most likely would have been almost empty. Like 2 weeks ago we went on a Wednesday evening and we saw 3 other boaters. You just have to time it right.
If you give up the dry fly and commit to nymphing, your roll will come. Be one with the water.
@Allan Olesen said:
You have my admiration for being able to make 50 attempts in a day. That must have been physically and mentally exhausting.
When I taught myself to roll, I don’t think I was ever above 10 attempts in a day.
I think frustrating is a better word. I am still not consistent at all. I’ll do something right then move on and next thing I know I’m not doing something I had been doing before. I understand what I have to do. I’ve learned the steps individually yet putting them together just falls apart. Then I lose focus. Everything changes when I’m upside down. I become disorientated and am still struggling to visualize exactly what I need to do. During my last roll clinic, they had me flip over, take a second, then touch the front, back, and each side before tapping the bottom to get pulled back up. I didn’t have any trouble with that. The paddle stroke though…it seems completely different when I’m upside down.
Physically I could have kept going, but mentally it was time to stop because I wasn’t really making much progress anymore.
@DryFlyTrout said:
I think frustrating is a better word. I am still not consistent at all. I’ll do something right then move on and next thing I know I’m not doing something I had been doing before. I understand what I have to do. I’ve learned the steps individually yet putting them together just falls apart. Then I lose focus. Everything changes when I’m upside down. I become disorientated and am still struggling to visualize exactly what I need to do. During my last roll clinic, they had me flip over, take a second, then touch the front, back, and each side before tapping the bottom to get pulled back up. I didn’t have any trouble with that. The paddle stroke though…it seems completely different when I’m upside down.
Physically I could have kept going, but mentally it was time to stop because I wasn’t really making much progress anymore.
Congratulations, you’re normal.
Rolling is not at all intuitive. When I first “learned”, I thought I had it down cold. It was mostly muscle memory from my training sessions, and I’d just repeat what worked. THEN something began not to work anymore. I took a big step backwards and lost the ability completely for a while, if you could say that I actually had it to begin with.
That’s when I started getting an assistant to take video, as I’ve described above, and I could start piecing together what I was missing.
When you finally “get it”, you’ll know it because it will be consistent and almost effortless. Until then, keep working at improving. Don’t keep practicing something that doesn’t work though. Figure out what you’re doing wrong and try to make each part of the roll the best it can possibly be.
Have lots of patience with yourself in the process.
What Sparky961 said… “Don’t keep practicing what doesn’t work” and “Learning to roll is not at all intuitive.” That leads into the thought I want to share: A huge part of learning to roll is GETTING THROUGH THE DISCOMFORT. When you’re in the middle of the sound and that wave knocks you over no one is going to be standing next to you helping you up. Hurry up and get past that anxiety / unease of rolling alone. When that wave knocks you over you will NOT have goggles on and you won’t be in a ‘set up’ position. Practice without goggles and without setting up. If you can, fight through the awkwardness and discomfort of rolling on your ‘offside’. Don’t get discouraged when it doesn’t come quickly. It takes time and practice.
@Rex said:
A huge part of learning to roll is GETTING THROUGH THE DISCOMFORT.
Yup, I’ll second that. I frequently roll in strange places now just to keep myself prepared for the day when I’m turned over unexpectedly. I still don’t like rolling when the bottom is full of weeds and/or mud. I also have to calm my panic when the water is so clear you can see down for who knows how far. Murky water is another one, but there’s good reason to be concerned there due to unseen underwater entrapment and impact hazards.
But I digress… all of that comes after being completely comfortable hanging upside down at a beautiful sand beach in 4’ of clear warm water with an assistant standing beside you.
Having at least something that can get you upright reliably without hurting yourself is the first step to learning everything else.
@Rookie said:
The learning process sounds just ducky: discomfort, lack of oxygen, panic, possible injury. :o
But, once you go through it, a whole new realm of paddling venues and opportunities await you. WW playboating and surf paddling really are about spending a chunk of time upside down and not worrying about it. That’s what makes it “fun.”
Yes, Rookie. That’s the kind of people we are. I realized my everyday road bicycling (racing) fits all your descriptive words except I really don’t panic much.
Hey @sing, I did learn how to surf on Lake Superior. Baby waves, but it was still fun. Stayed upright too, although I broached once. Coach thought I’d go over but I fooled him. Was the best day ever and a big confidence builder.
But I don’t wanna normal!
Yes it is for sure not intuitive for me at all.
I’ll see about getting video, but I’m having a minor medical procedure tomorrow and will have to stay dry for 10 days. Which isn’t a bad thing I guess because I’ve paddled a ducky or raft 7 of the last 9 days plus roll clinic. It’s time for a little break. and hopefully I’ll come back refreshed and refocused.
Rex, luckily for the most part, I won’t be in a sound alone. Not that I want to depend on other people, but I should be able to find people to paddle with almost everyday if I want. The few guides I know introduced to me more guides who introduced me to more guides. At this point I’ve got a list of a couple dozen people who’s lives revolve around water. After they guide all day, they go down the river again for fun.
As far as discomfort, it’s not so much. It’s just really unnatural. The combination of movements isn’t like anything else I’ve ever done. I haven’t been wearing googles but I have been using a nose plug about half the time and the other half just dealing with it. Hah that part is actually uncomfortable. Water in my nose sucks. But I hate the nose plug already and can almost guarantee I won’t be wearing it regularly in the future. The lake I was in yesterday was uber murky. I could just barely see the blade of my paddle and lots of brown.
Once I can roll from my strong side I’ll work on my offhand side. I don’t think I’ll get discouraged. It’s like a really cool 3D puzzle or like moving through laser beams trying not to trip the sensor. Rolling is also my gateway to the river with the guides. That’s the one condition for being able to go with them in a hard boat. And the river holds lots more really cool 3D puzzle for me to work on so I want to unlock that door ASAP!
Rookie I think they are making it sound worse than it is to a degree. At least at the stage I’m at now. Even in a lake with only 3 feet of visibility it’s not very scary. You only have to hold your breath for less than a minute, usually much less. Now the first time I’m upside down in a class III without an instructor right there and my helmet is bouncing off rocks, that’s gonna be terrifying!
I practice with goggles. They don’t help me at all with the roll, which works fine with or without goggles. But the Canadian Geese hang out there sharing their E Coli … so the goggles help protect my eyes, I hope.
